Cinematic Frodo: Victim of Downsizing?

[Lalaith]

Watching FotR again, not having seen it for about a year, this point of Frodo's childlike vulnerability really niggled me.
He shakes like a leaf, he can't stop trying to put the ring on, his will is easily bent to that of the wraiths, and even when he's well and happy, he looks like a little boy off to camp.
The cheerful willingness of the Council of Elrond to let him set off seems absurdly irresponsible.
Which it didn't, in the book.

[The_Hand]

Wow. That was a lot to read, but I have to agree. Frodo seems to young. Why would Gandalf send a little hobbit to Mordor? Carrying the fate of all of Middle-Earth in his pocket? I didn't like movie-frodo at all. Not because I am a fan of the books, but because I just didn't understand him. From his first smile to Gandalf he seems sort of childish and distant from all the others. I just can't fathom why he would ever even think about leaving Hobbiton.

As for Faramir... I was furious. But I tried very hard not to judge. And I think the changes made to Faramir are logical. He would, like his brother and any man I think, want the Ring. It's power is suppose to be very great. So it is logical that, only after his "inner-journey" when he finally knows that Frodo is right, that he lets them go. In the book he doesn't seem that affected by The Ring... and that kind of made me think: Did the Rings power just turn itself off? I don't know. Am I totally off track or what? I'm not the only onw who thinks this.
Still I was sad that Tolkiens' Faramir never made it to the movie.

[Essex]

Lucky for you all I lost my network connection as I hit reply earlier as I prattled on for ages re frodo's downsizing.

So a shortened version follows:

I see the movie as an adaptaion of some of the book. For me, I know why Frodo went into the West, as much as I know that he went through the Old Forest, met with Tom, rescued the Hobbits from us (!), etc.

I also know that the sword Merry killed the witch king with was from the Barrow.

And if someone hasn't read the books and doesn't know all this, then there's an easy answer, isn't there???!!!! Read them and then watch the movie with this in mind.

The audio transcription of the book runs at 54 hours. Jackon's (cinematic) versions run at 9 - 10 hours. ie a 1/5th - 1/6th of the material (not including all the time spent on battle scenes) could be used. So go easy on him. (ps I'm not defending Faramir or Aragorn's 'death' by the way - they were mistakes)

Just use what you know from the books to fill in the spaces. It works well, trust me!

PS what the books CAN'T convery that Film can is the acting/directing on certain points. for example, the look on Gandalf's face as he sits alone in Minas Tirith just before the attack. Or Frodo's face when he's picked up by the eagles. or Frodo's line to Sam in the Sammath Naur. 'I'm hear, Sam'. That line (mainly to do with the way it is acted) sends shivers down my spine every time I watch.

Look, we know the films can't beat the books, but they are flipping marvelous none the less! We can say that EVERY character was downsized. Think of a film that was adapted pretty much word for word (HP1) and see how boring it could have been if the same was done for lotr.

[Lyta_Underhill]

We can say that EVERY character was downsized. Think of a film that was adapted pretty much word for word (HP1) and see how boring it could have been if the same was done for lotr.

Good point, Essex! However, I liked HP1 and was not bored at all! Strangely enough, when I recently rented and re-watched Return of the King, I was not as put off by the contrived Frodo leaves Sam sequence and saw through to the cinematic devices sufficiently that it seemed merely a blip (although I keep yelling "Stupid Hobbit!" at Frodo as he's falling into web after web and outright telling Gollum he's got to destroy the Ring. What was he thinking? Anyway, I understand that every character must suffer some from this short-shrifting in a reduction of an epic tale to 9-10 hours of film; I guess the big problem for many filmgoers was that the soul of all the characters could not be believably shown in the short time allotted. (I still think they could have allowed senseless Frodo to raise his head at the Ford of Bruinen and at least shout at the Ringwraiths a bit, though!)

He shakes like a leaf, he can't stop trying to put the ring on, his will is easily bent to that of the wraiths, and even when he's well and happy, he looks like a little boy off to camp.

He seems this way in the beginning, but I also remember our book Frodo being rather frightened and showing it more at the beginning of the journey. He was downright frantic near Weathertop, before the Ringwraiths even got there! I thought the addition of scenes in Lorien and on the Anduin showed very well the growing distance between Frodo and the others and foreshadowed even more completely the fact that Frodo understood he had to leave and his mental preparations for such an event.

As for his will bending to that of the Ringwraiths, I suppose this impression arises from the unfortunate "battlements of Osgiliath" scene, which did, in my opinion, weaken movie-Frodo a bit. But, as we enter the Eastern lands in Return of the King, I see a more determined, bleak Frodo, actually more underplayed than previously (or else Sam went over the top and made Frodo look more subdued). As I re-watched ROTK, I found Sam to be almost a cartoon hero, with the background music swelling to his every daring deed, while Frodo entered another world right next to him. Particularly in the "grasping at shadows" and "wheel of fire" sequence when Sam carries Frodo up Mount Doom, I did not see this young, frightened boy hobbit that everyone speaks of, but a hobbit transformed into something that is groping through an unseen world, that personified Sam's worries in the book about what he would do once they reached their destination.

There were lots of horror movie conventions in this one, but I can forgive that, as I understand it was done to heighten the tension of the scenes. I laughed at Legolas as he let go an arrow at the Dead, when in fact, he wasn't frightened at all of them and spoke of them as "mere shades of Men" in the book. I have already spoken of the convention of separating Frodo and Sam at Shelob's Lair elsewhere, I believe. Such conventions were widespread and understandable, but it is to Jackson's credit that he did not go overboard with them and turn LOTR into a ghoulfest.

I'm sure I have more to say, but I can't think of it right now! My apologies; I have been too long away from this thread!

Cheers!
Lyta