Forsight of the Ainur

[Maédhros]

I think that this might add a little to this Topic:
From Vinyar Tengwar: Ósanwe-kenta

Things may seem alike, but if they are in kind wholly different they must be distinguished. Foresight which is prevision, and forecasting which is opinion made by reasoning upon present evidence, may be identical in their prediction, but they are wholly different in mode, and they should be distinguished by loremasters, even if the daily language of both Elves and Men gives them the same name as departments of wisdom".

Pengolodh here elaborates (though it is not necessary for his argument) this matter of "foresight". No mind, he asserts, knows what is not in it. All that it has experienced is in it, though in the case of the Incarnate, dependent upon the instruments of the hröa, some things may be "forgotten", not immediately available for recollection. But no part of the "future" is there, for the mind cannot see it or have seen it: that is, a mind placed in time. Such a mind can learn of the future only from another mind which has seen it. But that means only from Eru ultimately, or mediately from some mind that has seen in Eru some part of His purpose (such as the Ainur who are now the Valar in Eä). An Incarnate can thus only know anything of the future, by instruction derived from the Valar, or by a revelation coming direct from Eru. But any mind, whether of the Valar or of the Incarnate, may deduce by reason what will or may come to pass. This is not foresight, not though it may be clearer in terms and indeed even more accurate than glimpses of foresight. Not even if it is formed into visions seen in dream, which is a means whereby "foresight" also is frequently presented to the mind.

Minds that have great knowledge of the past, the present, and the nature of Eä may predict with great accuracy, and the nearer the future the clearer (saving always the freedom of Eru). Much therefore of what is called "foresight" in careless speech is only the deduction of the wise; and if it be received, as warning or instruction, from the Valar, it may be only deduction of the wiser, though it may sometimes be "foresight" at second hand.

So that would mean to me is that for the Incarnates (Elves, Men, etc) cannot have "forsesight" because they have no knowledge of the future, only the Ainur (Valar and maiar) can have "foresight". The wise (Incarnates) can only "forecast" based on their knowledge and deduction. The Incarnates seem only to have "foresight" if they received information from a Valar or a maiar.

In the case of Melkor and his ainur, I would have to say that yes, he could have "foresight", but in the case of Melkor, his knowlegde would be less than of other Ainur because he was more interested in other things than in "listening" to the Music. Sauron, IMO, would have had more "information" regarding "the music" than Melkor would. The problem when dealing with Melkor and his agents is that, because they resorted to lying, how could you know when they were lying or telling the truth?

[Durelin]

Originally Posted by Eorl of Rohan

As to this, there is a simple explanation. It was not that Man could foretell the future...but really that they died. This, at least when compared with the elves situation, was a gift. The elves were made to linger on till the end of the World, when they would sing with the Ainur again in the last Music. They were said to be tied to the Earth for all time, and they could never leave it. Men were not tied down, rather their bodies and souls passed from the Earth, and at least their spirits were able to venture to other places. The fate of the world will be but their end of being a part of the world. The Elves will always be a part of the World, and its fate will most likely be their fate. Either that, or they will help decide it, along with the Ainur. Or perhaps a combination of the two.

Now that I think about it, perhaps the fact that Man could not fortell the future was a gift as well.

Most likely foresight came as a gift, along with true wisdom, from a connection with Eru. It was Eru who held the utmost power, and through him an understanding of the World he created could be gained. This foresight, though, is not truly a gift. It is not given, but earned/gained. In the case of Melkor, I doubt he had foresight at all, and if he did, it was a false foresight, or perhaps a foresight limited by his thin connection with Eru, mainly as an enemy. An understanding of one's enemy could also gain Melkor a certain understanding of the ways of his enemies world.

The above rambling contained many ideas, some not fully expressed, I am sure, and maybe not even coherently. Also, many of these ideas are based around opinions. They are just my thoughts on the subject.

-Durelin