Do Balrogs Have Wings?

[Galadriel]

Originally Posted by Inziladun

One thing I've wondered about is this: if the Balrogs could really fly, why couldn't they have been searching for Gondolin from the air, after Húrin gave away its general location to Morogth? Why did it take the capture of Maeglin to allow the city to be found?

Sure, the Eagles were present to keep watch, but would a Balrog really not be up to facing a giant bird?

Another point...why would the Balrog in Moria have 'leaped across the fissure' instead of flown? I'm sure this has been addressed before. Not sure why I just said that. Only thing is I'm assured that Balrogs have wings but cannot fly.

[narfforc]

Originally Posted by Galadriel

Only thing is I'm assured that Balrogs have wings but cannot fly.

A bit like an ostrich, wings but cannot fly. Having been stuck in the Dark Pit for a few thousand years, would they have become defunct or the Balrog had just forgotten he had them. Maybe this is what Tolkien what trying to tell us, they (the wings) had become shadows of their former selves.

[Galadriel]

Originally Posted by narfforc

A bit like an ostrich, wings but cannot fly. Having been stuck in the Dark Pit for a few thousand years, would they have become defunct or the Balrog had just forgotten he had them. Maybe this is what Tolkien what trying to tell us, they (the wings) had become shadows of their former selves.

I mentioned the ostrich bit earlier myself, only I said dodos And I agree with you, though one thing foxes me:

Glorfindel and Ecthelion and Fëanor could take on Balrogs (more than one at a time). They were Elves. They died in the end, but that's besides the point. If Gandalf is a Maia, why did he have so much trouble? I know they are not allowed to reveal their full power in ME, but still.

[Puddleglum]

Originally Posted by Galadriel

I mentioned the ostrich bit earlier myself, only I said dodos And I agree with you, though one thing foxes me:

Glorfindel and Ecthelion and Fëanor could take on Balrogs (more than one at a time). They were Elves. They died in the end, but that's besides the point. If Gandalf is a Maia, why did he have so much trouble? I know they are not allowed to reveal their full power in ME, but still.

I think it's largely situational. Glorfindal managed to take a Balrog over a cliff, Echthelion managed to take one into a deep fountain. I'm not sure that Feanor "took on" Balrogs, it's more that they took HIM on - and killed him without suffering loss.

Largely, I think this all indicates how powerful the Elvish lords were. Remember Fingolfin was able to deal 7 long-lasting wounds to Morgoth himself. Gandalf, as a Maia, may not have been so significantly more powerful than the greatest Elvish lords - at least not in physical prowess (his "power" in the end was in encouraging other beings to join the fight and in showing love to them).

[Galadriel]

Originally Posted by Puddleglum

I think it's largely situational. Glorfindal managed to take a Balrog over a cliff, Echthelion managed to take one into a deep fountain. I'm not sure that Feanor "took on" Balrogs, it's more that they took HIM on - and killed him without suffering loss.

Largely, I think this all indicates how powerful the Elvish lords were. Remember Fingolfin was able to deal 7 long-lasting wounds to Morgoth himself. Gandalf, as a Maia, may not have been so significantly more powerful than the greatest Elvish lords - at least not in physical prowess (his "power" in the end was in encouraging other beings to join the fight and in showing love to them).

Good point! Though I still feel he ought to have more power (let's just ignore the fact that he's a wrinkled old man who can actually wield a sword lol).

[Puddleglum]

Originally Posted by Galadriel

Good point! Though I still feel he ought to have more power (let's just ignore the fact that he's a wrinkled old man who can actually wield a sword lol).

You may have something there.
As I think back to his battle, maybe it can be explained this way.

In the first stage (on the bridge) Gandalf's first aim and priority was to get the company safely out of Moria. Getting caught up in a fight might give orcs & trolls more chance to come on the scene and bar the gate or otherwise attack the fellowship. Thus, he sacrificed his staff in order to break the bridge and, he hoped, take the Balrog out of the picture long enough for them to escape.

He obviously did not expect that parting whip-stroke that dragged him into the abyss. A simple mistake, but very costly.

So, in the second stage, he lacked his staff (which is elsewhere shown to be VERY IMPORTANT - for lighting fires, as a lantern, for driving off flying nazgul, for use in healing Theoden <even in the books it was part of the process>, for disarming Gimli, Legolas & Aragorn when they thought him Saruman, and perhaps more). So his offensive power was significantly (and unexpectedly) reduced and he had to improvise. The result was he still killed the Balrog, but only after a long and damaging battle from which he received mortal wounds.

Had the battle been a more formally arranged bout - you know, Bally in the blue corner, Gandy in the red; unlimited rounds, unlimited choice of tactics, No Seconds, one-on-one, to the death - then perhaps Gandalf would have wiped the floor with the Balrog.

Unfortunately, real-life battles (especially the ones that matter) are rarely so cut-and-dried. They come in the midst of other engagements and the parties have to make do with what they have on the spur of the moment. And that, I think, tends to make such contests more chancy and less of a slam-dunk - even if one party is natively stronger.

[Galadriel55]

During the Gandalf-Barlog fight on the bridge, it clearly says that Barlog tried to close its wings over Gandalf's head, but was not able to. This is written proof that barlogs have wings.
However, not in LOTR or in the Silmarillion, is it written that a barlog ever flew. On many occasions barlogs could have benefitted from flying, but it seems that they were not able to. This questions the existence of wings.
My explanation to this is the wings are more of a metaphore for willpower of darkness. The fight between Barly and Gandy was more of a competition of whose will is stronger. This means that since Barly was not able to close darkness over Gandy, Gandy had more power and a stronger will at the moment. That is why Barly was required to use physical force - simply the power of his will and thought was not enough.