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Old 05-23-2014, 07:44 AM   #23
Zigūr
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivriniel View Post
Arda healed is, in this casting, compared to Arda unmarred is a good analogy. But is not quite the analogy, because in The Second Making, there is an expected reorganisation of The Powers, in a very fundamental sense, to prevent repetition of vulnerabilities the powers built into reality.
According to whom, exactly? Or is this a theory of your own invention? Evil originated with Melkor. In a world in which Eru has incorporated the evil of Melkor to produce greater good, what likelihood is there of repetition? There is no more evil. It has become good.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivriniel View Post
To elucidate, it's not "Manwe versus Melkor", in a divisionist casting of 'good and evil', but instead Manwe (The Flame Imperishable) conjoined to Melkor (The Flame Imperishable running in its Inverse--UNcreation--deadlock.
I don't think this dualistic interpretation is very consistent with the established understanding of Good and Evil according to Professor Tolkien's account. Melkor wanted to destroy, but he was not an "uncreative" force by nature or power. He was originally an initiator and later merely a corruptive force, and it was not within his power to even annihilate matter: "even left alone he could only have gone raging on till all was levelled again into a formless chaos. And yet even so he would have been defeated, because it would still have 'existed' independent of his own mind, and a world in potential." Good and evil were not "equal and opposite" Newtonian forces in Arda or something like that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivriniel View Post
One way around the problem is have Melkor existing in a conjoined Universe where time always runs backwards. So, all his marring runs backwards--from the end of time to its beginning. And so, Manwe and Melkor handball each others manifestations in inverse time flow.
I also don't find this scenario to be especially likely. For reasons I've already stated, I don't think Melkor ever existed in the way you describe, either in the mind of Eru or as an evil being.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivriniel View Post
Another way around the problem is to establish creations where what is selflessness to one Vala *is* selfishness to the other.
I don't believe this kind of moral reversibility is consistent with Professor Tolkien's view. According to Professor Tolkien's metaphysics, if Melkor believed the Valar were evil, then he was wrong. He was evil.

I am not just making up "Arda Healed" incidentally, it's actually a concept explained in the Athrabeth Finrod ah Andreth. I assume we can perceive Finrod's understanding of the matter to be reasonably reliable. I apologise if any of what I am saying is not strictly relevant but I'm finding this theory of yours quite difficult to understand and am struggling to see much substantiation for it in the texts.
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