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1. Refund without note. Troubled immolation tool?
ELENDIL: Untruth runs back and swallows loan. See him.
3. Man of confused parts.
4. Strawberry ones? No. Pineapple? Well, mostly the same consonants. Conflict here. Forever?
5. Poldark around two notes? See him!
AMROTH: Ten lost from chest, but a thousand gained for him? All so confused!
NIMRODEL: Knights say it – mirror the French sleeping quarters for a streaming thing.
DENETHOR: Paradise disturbed, but meets a god – there he is.
TRINKET: Dynamite with directional change swallows Araw’s confused beasts to produce shiny thing.
10. Hello – a sigh is heard – blue, is he?
11. Note a slightly disturbed bull for him!
ISILDUR: For him, dwarf woman reigns endlessly with first person, in turmoil.
RAID: Mixed atmosphere, note – a violent thing that can happen.
14. Gorbag is confused – loses note, gains direction – it’s crazy, and hot!
15. Fingolfin’s was the first.
16. Tidy greeting element, all mixed up for him.
17. Note twice, but differently – Gene Hunt, without his city. See him now.
SAURON: Caught between two points, almost a catcher of dark wizards … for another?

So now I'm at "Refund [minus one of A-G]. [Anagram of] immolation tool?". Most of the time, we need to look for synonyms of the parts of the clue - "refund" might be "rebate", "pay back", "compensate". All of those contain notes, so any would be possible - but how many could give a Tolkien-related answer?

In clue 1, try treating REFUND as a verb. ;)

So REPAY minus A gives REPY, which is an anagram (troubled) form of PYRE, as in Pyre of Denethor. The only problem with which is, a pyre is most definitely a tool of immolation!

(Thinking about other meanings of words - eg, a verb not a noun - is another key to solving these things.)

hS

Welcome to the game!

Originally, passwords contained clues of any kind and were not themed. But with time I think they evolved to have themes to them, and became more cryptic. Here is that link that Pervinca says was broken on the instructions post, it has very good instructions to what cryptic clues are - though Hui gave a very thorough rundown as well. Saying that, clues don't have to be cryptic, and occasionally they are not.

Sometimes you'd work forwards - e.g. I solved Denethor by working with synonyms of "paradise", and got to Eden. Sometimes you work backwards from the straight clue, which is usually at the start or the end of the clue, or from the theme once it's known.



Saying all this, though, it might be possible that you've joined at a time in the current password when all the easier clues are already solved. Because if I had any idea how to solve the rest, I would be doing so now! So now it's probably time to start posting half-solved guesses, to see if we can tackle this by baby steps and teamwork. I think #4 refers to fields of some sort, in reference to Beatle's Strawberry Fields - otherwise I am having a hard time explaining the "strawberry". The only fields that readily come to mind are PELENNOR, which contain some of the consonants of "pineapple", but otherwise I don't see how it fits.

Every time I try to scramble Gorbag, I inevitably arrive at Boggart. The Harry Potter references are doing something to my brain. :D

Actually, just had a thought. If it's not PYRE, then what could be a tool that is not normally meant for immolation but was used as such? Mount Doom! To melt the Ring and/or burn poor Gollum. Orodruin? Amon Amarth? Lava? I don't see how, but does any of this fit the clue?

PYRE: Refund without note. Troubled immolation tool?
ELENDIL: Untruth runs back and swallows loan. See him.
3. Man of confused parts.
PELENNOR FIELDS (BATTLE OF): Strawberry ones? No. Pineapple? Well, mostly the same consonants. Conflict here. Forever?
5. Poldark around two notes? See him!
AMROTH: Ten lost from chest, but a thousand gained for him? All so confused!
NIMRODEL: Knights say it – mirror the French sleeping quarters for a streaming thing.
DENETHOR: Paradise disturbed, but meets a god – there he is.
TRINKET: Dynamite with directional change swallows Araw’s confused beasts to produce shiny thing.
10. Hello – a sigh is heard – blue, is he?
11. Note a slightly disturbed bull for him!
ISILDUR: For him, dwarf woman reigns endlessly with first person, in turmoil.
RAID: Mixed atmosphere, note – a violent thing that can happen.
14. Gorbag is confused – loses note, gains direction – it’s crazy, and hot!
15. Fingolfin’s was the first.
16. Tidy greeting element, all mixed up for him.
17. Note twice, but differently – Gene Hunt, without his city. See him now.
SAURON: Caught between two points, almost a catcher of dark wizards … for another?

The reason I added a question mark at the end of clue 1 is that I had a thought about the word 'immolation' and, looking it up, my suspicion was confirmed. 'Immolation' specifically means to kill, usually by burning, not to burn someone who is already dead - which is what a pyre is supposed to be used for - the now obsolete practice of suttee being an exception, and Denethor's use of them being another. Thinking about it, that chapter name is a bit of a spoiler, isn't it?

For Pelennor Fields, I added 'forever' to make a big hint at the Beatles song, so I felt justified in just saying it shared most of the same consonants. 'Conflict' here was literal, although it can be used as an anagram indicator.

Soriman, giving the passwords themes was something we started doing a few years ago, (apart from a brilliant one-off one Galadriel created a while before that, with names of the Tolkien family), because it makes them more fun (and more challenging to create!), but you don't have to make your password themed.

Regarding Clue 17, I am a big fan of the British time-travelling cop show 'Life on Mars' and its spin-off series 'Ashes to Ashes.' Gene Hunt is a central figure of both shows, and the element I'm looking for is a nickname he is given in 'Ashes to Ashes' when he has left his native Manchester to work for the Met, (the Metropolitan Police, in London).

G55, look at the last word of clue 14. Then think of a possible near-anagram of Gorbag. ;)

Thanks to all for giving me some pointers, I'll put some more thought into these puzzles, extra thanks to Galadriel for posting a working link to SaucepanMans' post.

Regarding the Life on Mars clue I spent a very long time thinking greater Lancaster and not Manchester so thanks for clearing that up.
As for number 14 it took an embarrassingly long time for something so simple...
GORBAG - G + L = BALROG.



Edit: to avoid double posts I'll just add this on here. I'd like to guess at THEODEN for number 17 although I'm not confident in that one.

PYRE: Refund without note. Troubled immolation tool?
ELENDIL: Untruth runs back and swallows loan. See him.
3. Man of confused parts.
PELENNOR FIELDS (BATTLE OF): Strawberry ones? No. Pineapple? Well, mostly the same consonants. Conflict here. Forever?
5. Poldark around two notes? See him!
AMROTH: Ten lost from chest, but a thousand gained for him? All so confused!
NIMRODEL: Knights say it – mirror the French sleeping quarters for a streaming thing.
DENETHOR: Paradise disturbed, but meets a god – there he is.
TRINKET: Dynamite with directional change swallows Araw’s confused beasts to produce shiny thing.
10. Hello – a sigh is heard – blue, is he?
11. Note a slightly disturbed bull for him!
ISILDUR: For him, dwarf woman reigns endlessly with first person, in turmoil.
RAID: Mixed atmosphere, note – a violent thing that can happen.
BALROG: Gorbag is confused – loses note, gains direction – it’s crazy, and hot!
15. Fingolfin’s was the first.
16. Tidy greeting element, all mixed up for him.
17. Note twice, but differently – Gene Hunt, without his city. See him now.
SAURON: Caught between two points, almost a catcher of dark wizards … for another?

Indeed! Well done.

I'm guessing you thought of Lancaster because of the actor who plays Chris Skelton - Marshall Lancaster.

In 'Ashes To Ashes,' Gene Hunt is sometimes referred to as 'The Manchester ????????'

17 is not Theoden. You do need the 'The,' though.

Okay so number 17, I'm pretty sure Gene Hunt's nickname is "The Manchester Lion" minus "Manchester" leaves us with "THELION" or if you remover all the letters in Manchester from his nickname you're left with "HLIO".
Since you guys were nice enough explain the cryptic clues a little more I no longer think the two notes refers to a harmony and we just simply add two more letters (A-G).

So i'm pretty sure it's a 6 or a 9 letter word, probably a 9 letter word using THELION and 2 more letters.
This one is pretty frustrating I keep finding I'm missing an 'R' so maybe i'm wrong so far. It has also crossed my mind that I should probably finish reading the Lord of the Rings to gain an advantage.

Oh! I think you've parsed this exactly right, and the lack of an anagram indicator means the two notes come right at the beginning, which makes it ECTHELION. Which does indeed come pretty late in LotR (it's the name of Boromir's granddad, and also of the Tower of Ecthelion in Minas Tirith, which is named after a different Steward Ecthelion).

I'm not sure how obvious this is from the thread, but it's entirely okay to guess the password before we've solves all the clues; that can give us the first letters to help with the rest. I'm pretty sure this password starts with 'People And', but haven't gotten the rest of it yet.

hS

Nice one! I completely missed that the letters had to come at the start. Thanks for the background info on him too, I just finished the first book so It won't be too long until i get to Minas Tirith. Thankfully i've already read the silmarillion & The Hobbit so i shouldn't be completely lost with other clues.

I don't know where to start with guessing the password, I see "Pendant" but we need another N.
If you have ideas on what the clues 5, 10, 11 & 16 are hinting at when they reference he/him, I can try to get us some more answers.

No problem; it's not always obvious whether there's scrambling involved or not (Pervinca is pretty good about marking it, the rest of us are bit more haphazard). I think a different Ecthelion (a lord of Gondolin) got a passing mention in the Silm, but most of his part is in the older drafts of the tales.

So the password isn't an anagram; it's an acrostic made by the entire puzzle. We know that it's going to be PE*P*ANDT**IRB***S; we just need to fill in the missing letters. (It's not always the first letters, but in this case it seems to be.)

It can't be 'people', though, I was wrong about that; I thought there was an extra letter between P and A!

Pervinca is really fond of using 'him', 'her', and 'there' as her straight clues; I don't think there's any more information in them. It's possible that #10 is someone associated with the colour blue, but it could just as easily be cryptic: synonyms for [hello] + [ahhh] + [blue] = a male character.

hS

Or try a word for blue that's acceptable because Tolkien invented it. ;)

Ecthelion is right. E and C are musical notes.

I was wondering about 'luin'... So I remembered vaguely that there might be a character named HIRLUIN (Hi + R = ahh + luin), and sure enough Tolkien Gateway confirms that he's the leader of the people of the Green Hills, who dies at the Pelennor.

hS

Ahh thank you for the extra info, I was looking at substituting blue for sad but i guess that is wrong, perhaps it is blue in sindarin? Which might be Luin or Lhun but i'm not sure.
I think that "their" fits quite nicely in the password but can't think of a word that fits after, "B??ES".



EDIT: Ah i see you already got it hS, well done.

PYRE: Refund without note. Troubled immolation tool?
ELENDIL: Untruth runs back and swallows loan. See him.
3. Man of confused parts.
PELENNOR FIELDS (BATTLE OF): Strawberry ones? No. Pineapple? Well, mostly the same consonants. Conflict here. Forever?
5. Poldark around two notes? See him!
AMROTH: Ten lost from chest, but a thousand gained for him? All so confused!
NIMRODEL: Knights say it – mirror the French sleeping quarters for a streaming thing.
DENETHOR: Paradise disturbed, but meets a god – there he is.
TRINKET: Dynamite with directional change swallows Araw’s confused beasts to produce shiny thing.
HIRLUIN: Hello – a sigh is heard – blue, is he?
11. Note a slightly disturbed bull for him!
ISILDUR: For him, dwarf woman reigns endlessly with first person, in turmoil.
RAID: Mixed atmosphere, note – a violent thing that can happen.
BALROG: Gorbag is confused – loses note, gains direction – it’s crazy, and hot!
15. Fingolfin’s was the first.
16. Tidy greeting element, all mixed up for him.
ECTHELIION: Note twice, but differently – Gene Hunt, without his city. See him now.
SAURON: Caught between two points, almost a catcher of dark wizards … for another?

Right again!

I have a guess for 11. I went with "Mundo" for bull and arrived at Eomund, might be a stretch but worth a shot?

The password seems to be clearing up. PEEPS AND THEIR BANES?

That gives us 9 pairs of Peeps and Banes.
Elendil - Sauron
Amroth - ?
Nimrodel - ?
Denethor - Pyre
Hirluin - Pelennor
Isildur - Trinket
Ecthelion - Balrog
? - Raid
? - ?

I don't think anyone of the guessed peeps was killed in a raid, giving us a hint about the remaining ones. And Amroth and Nimrodel probably mean that we're gonna get some variant of Sea and Mountains. BUT! Too many of the remaining clues hint at people. So perhaps there are some common banes in there.

Ohhh, Isildur coupd be the Raid peep, if there is someone else for Trinket.

You guys are really really good at this, thats really helpful G55.


If my last guess of Éomund is correct, he died fighting an orc raid in rohan.

Aren't Amroth and Nimrodel sort of each other's banes? They each directly caused the death of the other.

hS

Good grief, I haven't thought of that.

Elendil - Sauron
Amroth - Nimrodel
Denethor - Pyre
Hirluin - Pelennor
Isildur - Trinket
Ecthelion - Balrog
?Eomund - Raid
? - ?
? - ?

But this means we are left without hint for the remaining clues. We have two hims, one man, and whatever Fingolfin's first is, meaning that at least one of the banes is also a person.



Going back to the clues and looking up Poldark, I think we're meant to use his first name Ross, given that it must start with S. ROSS + A + E = SAEROS. Now if tha is right another clue should be up for the taking, can't see which yet.


Soriman - it would have taken me a long time to get Balrog. And if you didn't get that one, we wouldn't have Banes. It's a team effort. :)

So assuming Eomund and Saeros are right, we're left with an E, an A (maybe not a person), and an N. Saeros' bane ought to be Turin, but which of his nine billion names fits?

Agarwaen and Adanedhel are there, but don't fit the A clue at all. Neithan? If 'tidy greeting element' is three things all mixed together, then 'greeting' could be HI, leaving netan... which is NEAT + N (for Nitrogen). So NEITHAN for #16.

For the others, not a clue. I know Feanor was first with a sword, but could Fingolfin have been the first to wear ARMOUR?

This! Different perspectives are always key, especially in the middle clues before the password gets figured out.

hS

PYRE: Refund without note. Troubled immolation tool?
ELENDIL: Untruth runs back and swallows loan. See him.
E: Man of confused parts.
PELENNOR FIELDS (BATTLE OF): Strawberry ones? No. Pineapple? Well, mostly the same consonants. Conflict here. Forever?
SAEROS: Poldark around two notes? See him!

AMROTH: Ten lost from chest, but a thousand gained for him? All so confused!
NIMRODEL: Knights say it – mirror the French sleeping quarters for a streaming thing.
DENETHOR: Paradise disturbed, but meets a god – there he is.

TRINKET: Dynamite with directional change swallows Araw’s confused beasts to produce shiny thing.
HIRLUIN: Hello – a sigh is heard – blue, is he?
EOMUND: Note a slightly disturbed bull for him!
ISILDUR: For him, dwarf woman reigns endlessly with first person, in turmoil.
RAID: Mixed atmosphere, note – a violent thing that can happen.

BALROG: Gorbag is confused – loses note, gains direction – it’s crazy, and hot!
A: Fingolfin’s was the first.
NEITHAN: Tidy greeting element, all mixed up for him.
ECTHELIION: Note twice, but differently – Gene Hunt, without his city. See him now.
SAURON: Caught between two points, almost a catcher of dark wizards … for another?

Quite right.

And to add to the 'team effort' point, we also get ideas for new password puzzles from each other. I was clean out of new ideas, (the above password is my 117th! - my earlier ones weren't themed, though), but my theme is what I was at one point convinced was the answer to Huey's last password.

Nimrodel, I confess, was a mistake. I thought Amroth drowned in what came to be known as the Nimrodel. He didn't, (I checked). He drowned in the Bay of Belfalas. So I'm not 100% happy about that answer, but I can live with it. She was kind of his bane, inadvertently.

Soriman, you'll be a password veteran in no time! :)

EDIT: Yes to Neithan; no to armour.

Thanks! I missed your post saying you were on it before I'd started working at it so sorry if i stole that one from you :D . Don't worry, it took me far too long for something so simple.


I think you are right with Saeros, I was also using the name Ross I just didn't get there.

I'm still pretty stumped on number 3, I've tried scrambling pieces, parts, bits, components, elements and thrand (before we knew it began with "E") but I didn't come up with anything.
I'm assuming "man of" implies that the answer is a place name.

Soriman, think theatrically. ;)

Man means man. 'Of' means what you make his name from.

-_- You're so helpful sometimes. :p

hS

It's a lot more helpful than you'll realise when you see the answer. ;)

Soriman thought it meant 'man of ...' and hence a place name. I was pointing out that it doesn't.

By the way, I always remember HIRLUIN (and various others) because I hear Oz Clarke singing the Song of the Mounds of Mundburg in the BBC radio adaptation.

I might have number 3 but i'm not sure...

If I said "What a piece of work is a man" would I be there?

Edit: Wait no I'm 99% sure that's way off.

You need another word meaning PARTS in a play or film or TV/radio show/play.

I know, I know; I just like to pretend I'm funny. ;)

No penalty for posting wrong answers! More than once I've put up something wrong, and it's prompted someone to find the right answer.

I'm pretty sure 'confused' is an anagram indicator, and Pervinca is suggesting 'man' is the straight clue, which means the whole cryptic clue is contained in the word 'parts'. :confused:

hS

I prompted myself to find the right answer :), it is ELROS!

... [Facepalm] It's from "roles", isn't it?

Well done! Are we left with just one now?

...

Elros died of AGE, didn't he? And Fingolfin's was the First... yeah.

hS

Yes from "roles", at first i thought it was something to do with Hamlet but i was trying to be too clever, the extra clues really helped.

I Love editing posts: I didn't see Pervinca's last post which completely gave it away haha.

PYRE: Refund without note. Troubled immolation tool?
ELENDIL: Untruth runs back and swallows loan. See him.
ELROS: Man of confused parts.
PELENNOR FIELDS (BATTLE OF): Strawberry ones? No. Pineapple? Well, mostly the same consonants. Conflict here. Forever?
SAEROS: Poldark around two notes? See him!

AMROTH: Ten lost from chest, but a thousand gained for him? All so confused!
NIMRODEL: Knights say it – mirror the French sleeping quarters for a streaming thing.
DENETHOR: Paradise disturbed, but meets a god – there he is.

TRINKET: Dynamite with directional change swallows Araw’s confused beasts to produce shiny thing.
HIRLUIN: Hello – a sigh is heard – blue, is he?
EOMUND: Note a slightly disturbed bull for him!
ISILDUR: For him, dwarf woman reigns endlessly with first person, in turmoil.
RAID: Mixed atmosphere, note – a violent thing that can happen.

BALROG: Gorbag is confused – loses note, gains direction – it’s crazy, and hot!
AGE: Fingolfin’s was the first.
NEITHAN: Tidy greeting element, all mixed up for him.
ECTHELION: Note twice, but differently – Gene Hunt, without his city. See him now.
SAURON: Caught between two points, almost a catcher of dark wizards … for another?

And that's a wrap! Well done, everyone. :)

Over to ... Huinesoron, I think?

Well done, you! That was a good one - a few that fell quickly to get us started, a few brain-twisters in the middle, and a solid theme that let us clean up the last few. :)

G55, I think; I know it wasn't me, I was too busy being unable to count the letters in 'people'.

hS

Thanks guys and gals for helping me get involved, this was actually pretty fun.
Looking forward to the next one :)

Great to have a new passworder on board! And well done.

And well done G55 for getting the password!

Nothing to worry about! Many people can work on the same clue - and that's the point, we often have to each pitch guesses and ideas before it clicks for someone. There's no claiming clues, so no stealing them either. :)

Well done on Elros and Eomund too! I can't echo Pervinca and Hui enough in saying it's lovely to see new people here.

My god. Old age as a bane... And what can I say, Fingolfin's Age was indeed the First... Suffice to say that without the theme and Elros' name known, this would have been quite impossible, but with this knowledge it's actually quite brilliant. :D The bane of old age... This one's gonna take a while to get over. :D

Excellent theme, and absolutely brilliant clues. Even if Nimrodel and Amroth didn't work out as you initially thought, as Hui pointed out it still works quite nicely. But Age has gotta be my favourite!



This one is a bit of a cheat, inspired by previous passwords and written all in the last hour, so my apologies if not as original as its predecessor. I should be more like Pervinca and prepare these ahead of time.


1. Hang door trim on the chaotic peaks.
2. Male buildings, literally.
3. The bands sing right - or wrong.
4. Elder... yes, almost elder.
5. Bright welcome, both noted and unnoted, initially jinxes small tumbled wheels.

This looks just as impossible as the last one looked to me at first:D and yet as I read those through those clues a few more times I get an idea or two. I'll have some time tomorrow to get stuck into one or two of them.

On a side note it's lovely finding this place still somewhat active and it's even lovelier to find dedicated Tolkien fans coming up with very clever puzzles (so far... :p.).

There's no rush to get at the clues. And if you're ever stuck, remember that we won't bite in the event of wrong guesses or half-guesses. In fact, we might confirm correct elements, or give further hints. A guess doesn't have to be a complete solution.

So far, yeah. *remembers the Baobab Pudding* :D (look it up on this thread if you really want to see something quite silly and quite different).

And if there's a puzzle or game on here that interests you, there's a good chance it might be revived. I for one am a ubiquitous poster and tend to get my fingers in all of the pies; I've posted in many of the games before and would be happy to again if they go at a reasonable pace, like this thread does.

1. Hang door trim on the chaotic peaks.

'Peaks' seems the most likely candidate for the straight clue, so I went looking for a group of mountains/hills/mounds.

I haven't placed all the elements yet, but TYRN GORTHAD has HANG and a trim version of DO(O)R.

Still leaves TYRT, though. ;)

OK, I'll get me coat. :D

...

I used to write passwords ahead of time and store them until needed, but I made up the last one from spur-of-the-moment inspiration caused by Huey's last one.

P.S. I wonder if Baobab Pudding is like Blue String Pudding, the Clangers' Default Desert.