Werewolf XLVI: Getting Back to Basics

[Meneltarmacil]

Welcome to the 46th game of Barrow-Downs Werewolf!

This game takes place in the pleasant village of Spruceburg, a small town on the Anduin River, and now an unfortunate target of some rather horrible beasts.

Players:

Aganzir (Cobbler)
Gwathagor (Lawyer)
Kath (Turtle Herder)
Legate of Amon Lanc (Frog Hermit)
Lhunardawen (Pinecone Collector)
Meneltarmacil (Dairy Farmer)
Mithalwen (Lumberjack)
Nerwen (Veterinarian)
Nogrod (Ale-Barrel Salesman)
Oddwen (Maker of Naughty Pine Furniture)
satansaloser2005 (Therapist)
The Elf-warrior (Poetaster)
Thinlomien (Mad Hatter)
Volo (Explorer)

It is now Night One. Wolves may PM, but can't choose a kill. Any gifteds present who have reason to give me names, please do so. Villagers, please refrain from posting.

EDIT: Psst... You'll need to be in Invisible Mode.

[Meneltarmacil]

It was a beautiful spring morning in the village of Spruceburg. There wasn't a single cloud in the sky, and the sun shone brightly through the pine trees.

The villagers were going about their normal routine that day.

Sally was trying to help Lommy with the latter's mental issues, but judging by the manaical cackling, things weren't going too well.

The Elf-warrior attempted to share his poetry with the village, but all he got were pinecones and shoes thrown at him by Lhunardawen and Aganzir respectively.

Mithalwen was delivering some freshly-cut logs to Oddwen to be made into furniture, but cringed to see what naughty things the furniture was up to.

Gwathagor tried to sue Nogrod for "causing riotous disturbances" due to his rather strong ale; however, the latter was too drunk to notice.

Kath was bringing her turtles to market, having started off last night due to the slowness of the task.

A surprised Legate of Amon Lanc charged into town from the woods, pursued by Volo, who had mistaken him for Bigfoot.

At that point, there was a scream from Meneltarmacil's farm. Everyone rushed to the scene, where they found a distressed Nerwen.

"I... I just came out to check on the cows, Menel said there was a problem with the milk... but..." She pointed in the direction of Menel's house, which had a large hole in the roof.

The villagers went inside, where a gruesome sight greeted their eyes. Meneltarmacil lay on the floor beneath the hole, and a cow lay on top of his crushed form.

Volo was the first to notice the signs of the culprits.

"See these tracks around the body?" he said. "Werewolves, I'm pretty sure of it. We've got some serious trouble on our hands."

Alive:
Aganzir
Gwathagor
Kath
Legate of Amon Lanc
Lhunardawen
Mithalwen
Nerwen
Nogrod
Oddwen
satansaloser2005
The Elf-warrior
Thinlomien
Volo

Dead:
Meneltarmacil (Moderator): Crushed under falling cow by Wolves on Night 1.

Day 1 has started. Wolves, stop PMing. Villagers, you may begin posting.

[Mithalwen]

No one else around or just not wanting to make themselves conspicuous by posting first?

Nothing to say when someone is crushed by a falling cow? Are you sure it was werewolves sounds more like French Guards to me - mistaking him for a silly English Knnnnnigget; probably told him that his mother was a hamster and his father smelt of elderberries first then launched the cow from the castle...

*looks around* .... ok no castle.... well maybe if they got a lot of swallows - a really huge number of swallows - African of course not European supported the cow on strands of creeper held under the dorsal guiding feathers....

It's a simple question of weight ratios! Weight ratios and air speed velocity!

Weight rations, air speed velocity. migratory patterns and anachronism....

I'll come in again.


OK werewolves might be more likely....

Shall we lynch Aganzir for being the cobbler? Or can I just have pointless revenge on Nerwen and Nogrod for something that happened in a previous life?

[Volo]

"I've seen bigger cows! For example the Golden Brown Cow of the Albatro City. Now that was a beast! But don't go near this one either, it's still aliv- Hey, Bungo! Don't eat that!"

But for no avail. Volo's gorilla ran up to the cow and a fight began between them. Volo who was between the two got all the blood and guts onto himself. Then, surprise surprise, the gorilla strangled the cow and started munching at its hooves.

"Thanks a lot, Bungo..."

[Thinlómien]

*Thinlómien casts a critical look at Mithalwen and Volo, but cannot help looking amused.*

Okay, well, the start of Day1, how I've missed thee... Maybe I'll enjoy it this time. I almost promised I'd write Nogrod something he can jump at when I hand the keyboard to him. Hmmm...

Well, I can say I'm quite looking forward to this - we have a bunch of great people here, including The Elf-Warrior with whom I've never played (if memory serves) and Oddwen and Lhuna with whom I've last played a long time ago, and Kath my ex-semi-nemesis who has been having a pause for a while too.

And I could second Mith's motion for lynching Agan - for she's one to confuse me, for sure.

Well, that really wasn't much. I should improve my small talk skills. Oh, and if anyone wants some tea, just ask me...

[Mithalwen]

I'll have tea if you promise you'll take the dormouse out of the pot....

Indian , no milk no sugar please.
Ok so we have tea and the making of a substantial barbecue but to get oc for a moment we have to take this a bit seriously. Thirteen of us means that the classic 3 wolves is likely, we don't know if we have any gifted and not knowing can be worse than knowing we definitely haven't got any. At least we won't get any "I'm the seer and so's my wife" kind of claims.


Not much scope for going wrong... so talk.... please? Pretty please?

[Nogrod]

Tea? Why bother with tea when we have ale... well sort of... we should have beer... anyone?... I mean I have the barrels... prime quality... anyone wishing to fill them? *Hickup*

Flying French cows, Godzillas, weight-ratios of swallows, confusing characters, lawyers suing... A moment ago I thought I was sober from yesterday but now I'm not so sure anymore...

But our lumberjack makes a pint indeed, ... sorry... a point indeed. We don't know of the gifteds. But with the outcome of her reasoning I would differ a bit. *Hick* I mean if we don't know our ranks then anyone can pose as anyone so "I'm the seer and so's my wife" looks more like forthcoming than not. Now the question remains to be asked whether she tried to sidetrack us from the very beginning in purpose or whether she just didn't think that one to thew end...

Also let's not let this piece of doubt cloud our vision either. It would be the most disasterous if we ignored the calls of our gifteds because of it.

EDIT: X'd with Legate

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

"Now now, my friends, let's not make a mess of it," the frog hermit made himself a way through the onlookers and overlooked the crime scene, now somewhat changed. "It's no doubt these were were were, were, what did I say, wolves. I wonder how, I wonder why, yesterday you told me 'bout the blue... erm, sorry again. Oh yes. I was just thinking now, I know from my experience and also from gossip that werewolves usually cooperate in packs. In packs of three, usually. That's not much, as one medic friend of mine used to say, pack of three is not even enough to play poker with. But this time, we may have a pack of three or also pack of two, or even pack of three with one as bonus when you buy two packs. Or that's how they do that in the shops. All right, what was the point? That we don't know how many werewolves we have here, don't we? Actually, it doesn't matter - as soon as we keep catching them."

"Now, if you'll excuse me. I think it's not already the time to call my frogs in, we don't need reinforcements yet, do we? We can manage it on our own. I am going to let the frogs where they are. As today passes, I hope to collect some data... about all of you folks, of course..."

EDIT: x-ed with Mith

[Aganzir]

So, who wants to buy shoes? High heels! Leather boots! And in case you're interested, I also make other leather goods. Belts! Gloves! Whips! Come one, come all! Brand new shoes will make all your dreams come true!

If only poor Menel had worn shoes made by me, he would still be alive. I made him cowboy boots once but seemingly he never used them... No cow would have dared to crush him if he had been wearing those!

Despite my underrated occupation, I suggest not to lynch me as you won't get pretty new shoes otherwise. Besides, I'm always sweet and innocent.
I agree with Mith that it sounds more like French Guards were doing the killing, so maybe we should start by lynching everyone who can speak French. And how come those two who suggested lynching me know French? Therefore Lommy and Mith must be guilty.

Oh, and some Darjeeling for me, please, Lommy dear.

edit: xed with Gwathy

[Mithalwen]

"Des fouettes eh? C'est interressant mais je dois dire que je ne suis pas louve-garoue. Et on peut parler Francais sans etre Francais ...."

I say that statistically it is almost certain that someone from the Finnish quarter of Pineburg is a wolf.... but I see I am cross posting...

Je reviens...

[Lhunardawen]

Wow, this is a quiet village - or is it because there's not much to say on Day 1s? And I see my lists have become a subject of debate. Should this worry me?

Gwathagor, I cannot imagine why you would want me to stick only to facts. If I had done that, which I assure you (as well as Legate who thought I didn't give much of my own opinion) I didn't, you should have been more worried, because there's no way you could have formulated an opinion of me. If I had just chronicled every single thing everyone said and NOT expressed what I thought of them, then I could very easily be judged as lycanthropic because I'm hiding behind others' words to keep me from saying anything possibly incriminating.

I don't know, Gwath, but I get this honest gut feeling () that you could be sucking up to Legate. If you're a wolf, and you know he's innocent, that's quite a strategy. But that's just me.

Mith feels innocent, she's honest enough to be one, and shows she has nothing to fear in saying whatever she feels like saying.

Nerwen's a bit worrying for skirting the issues, however petty, to which she could have contributed. That one post seems to me very safe - which makes it otherwise, if you get me.

Oddie's behaviour feels normal to me, however unsettling her words may be.

Now, as for Volo's self-vote, I'm not sure if Menel has a provision for automatic lynchings for non-voters. But in any case, I strongly advise not to vote for Volo because of his RL constraints. We have greater need to lynch our strong suspects than people who can't participate properly.

Speaking of participating properly, I see we still have a few people who haven't spoken. I hope they have valid reasons for being still absent. I'll be casting my vote (for either Nogrod, Gwath, or Nerwen as of this moment, but that could very well change) possibly within the hour.

[satansaloser2005]

Here to serve, Master Legate.

You know, it was possible that an Oddie-wolf voted for Gwath and didn't think he'd actually get killed; I've seen wolves make bolder moves in my time. I've never played with Oddie before though. Would she do that?

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Originally Posted by satansaloser2005

You know, it was possible that an Oddie-wolf voted for Gwath and didn't think he'd actually get killed; I've seen wolves make bolder moves in my time. I've never played with Oddie before though. Would she do that?

Well, anything is possible. I don't know. I am going to sleep now, so feel free to run around here and analyse... whatever... I just briefly looked at Nerwen and Kath and it looks like Nerwen only briefly interacted with Gwath, but there was something in that repetitive argument of hers... the one she had to repeat several times... which got me to think her
innocent... or having nothing to do with Gwath... it was this:

Originally Posted by Nerwen

Now, was Lhuna killed for giving Seer hints? We can't assume this, but if she was it's more likely it was for picking a wolf than for babbling about pine cones. (I'd guess Gwathagor, in that case.)

Not sure how much weight this has however...

And Kath... well she among other things also brought forward the possibility of Gwath being dreamt of... although she could do even that as a Wolf I'd think... so I don't know...

I need to sleep on it all. Good night.

EDIT: X-ed with really ODD wen and others. Someone's gone mad here.

[Oddwen]

Day One -

Gwath's first post mentions how he dislikes first days.

Nogrod jumps on this statement, says it's wolvish, calls lawyers useless.

Nogrod groups Lhuna & Oddwen with Gwath for the same reason as Gwath.

Lhuna calls Gwath a "guilty lawyer"

Gwath replies to Nogrod's suspicion of Oddwen with the defense "she is just mimicking me", calls repeating everyone "a safe move" - he says Nogrod "took no convincing whatsoever" that Gwath's post was wolvish, that Nogrod is either innocent as Lhuna said or a wolf. He leans toward Nogrod being innocent. Gwath says he likes Lhuna's lists, providing they are factual and not personal. He calls Legate "reasonable and impenetrable", but doesn't know what to make of him, and doesn't like Legate's gut feelings (towards Mith and Nogrod) calling them "too easy a basis for suspicion, and requires no actual evidence". He says "his other posts don't depend on "honest gut feelings", so maybe he's alright."

Oddwen questions Nogrod's grouping of herself with Gwath, calls the grouping of she, Gwath & Lhuna "hasty".

Oddwen replies to Gwath's assumption that she was repeating everyone else with a joke.

Legate says Gwath's post makes him feel uneasy, but feels that his opinion on Lhuna's list is "okay", says Lhuna's list are "statement of fact", but still could be twisted subtly. Legate wonders what Gwath sees as "reasonable" in his earlier posts, wonders if this is wolvish. Legate goes on to place Gwath in his "yellow zone", says that he "used to be worse...from an observer point".

Lommy feels there's something wrong, especially with Gwath & Legate, she replies to their discussion of Lhuna's list, calling them more "joking" than "helpful", nothing wrong with that, playfully says Gwath & Legate err in seeing it differently than she, calls their views "limited if not false". She finds Legate looks worse than Gwath, but finds Gwath calling Legate "reasonable" suspicious, as Legate does. She must think, but is watching those two, as is everyone else.

Nogrod agrees with Lommy about "Lhuna['s list]& the guys", thinks Legate & Gwath place too much importance on them. He says his suspicions from earlier on Gwath hasn't made Gwath look better, finding him "too verbiose", he feels better about Oddwen, doesn't know what to make of Lhuna.

Lhuna cannot imagine why Gwath would want her to only stick to facts, says if she had he should have been worried because that's something a wolf could hide behind, something a wolf could do safely to avoid incriminating themselves. She has an "honest gut feeling" that Gwath could be "sucking up" to Legate, calling it "quite a strategy" if Gwath was a wolf and Legate innocent. She says she'll vote for Nogrod, Gwath or Nerwen.

Aganzir doesn't find Gwath's "first-days-are-rubbish" post suspicious, says her first post wasn't constructive either but she wasn't suspicionated as were Oddwen and Lhuna. She asks why saying that makes one suspicious, asks if it's always wolves trying to contribute, asks if it's the same as suspecting the silent. She sarcastically says that it doesn't matter since Oddwen Gwath & Lhuna are wolves and she is the cobbler defending them from Nogrod. She finds Gwath suspicious because of similar behavior from other games where he was a wolf, calls Gwath calling Legate "reasonable" trying to gain an ally early. She says that Gwath saying "if there's anything a wolf cannot afford to be, it is irrational...But don't give me reason to think otherwise."[to Nogrod] makes her think that two fellow wolves pre-decided to not suspect each other.

Lhuna votes for Gwath, because he's the suspect that she "can defend from myself the least" (?). She wishes to give Nerwen more chance to speak, she calls Nogrod "always argumentative", though not always argumentatively sound. She says she's not played with Gwath before and doesn't know if this is how he usually is.

Nogrod replies to Aganzir's question about his first-day-hater-suspicion with the revelation that he was using it as "bait'. He called Gwath's reaction to it suspicious as he felt Gwath was reacting wolvishly. He calls Oddwen's reaction "Oddwenish", he says that that is no argument as wolves would try to be as normal as possible, he feels she is innocent. He feels that Lhuna "creeps me out", says she doesn't respond to his suspicions, wonders if her suspicion of him "without stating any reason" is retaliation, or wolvish. He calls Agan's opposition to the suspiciousness of Gwath good, as Gwath has been mentioned as suspicious and wolves generally latch onto existing suspicion. He says that Legate and Lhuna appear to be following suspicion in regards to Gwath, he wonders if it's genuine or if it's wolvish.

Lommy lists her suspicion level on everyone, she says that she doesn't suspect Gwath, Legate or Oddwen more than anyone else. She says that none of them strike her as particularly suspicious, she would be hesitant to vote for them on those grounds. She feels she would be following other's suspicions and not because she thought they were wolves. She fears grasping at imaginary straws.

Nerwen calls Lhuna's vote for Gwath "too easy". She doesn't like the look of Gwathagor, she feels he just chimes in with everybody, as she is doing here herself. She says that he always does.

Kath feels Gwath "gives the sentiments of most", thinks his thoughts on Legate are wild. She thinks Lhuna's vote for Gwath was "fair reasoning". Mentions Nerwen's suspicion of Gwath, Lhuna Legate Nog or Mith. She calls Nogrod's reaction to Gwath, Oddwen, Lhuna's first posts "kneejerk". She mentions Lommy's reaction to Legate & Gwath's reaction to Lhuna's list. She places Gwath, Legate, Nogrod, Lommy on her "guilty" list. She is tempted to vote either Legate or Gwath because they "argue themselves in circles" and delaying, votes for Legate because he argues with everyone.
(Gah, this is a list of a list!)

Gwath replies to Nerwen's accusation that he chimes in, says he doesn't think he does. He's glad she realizes she's suspicious, sarcastically calls it a ploy to avert further suspiciousness, he says she's chiming in with Nogrod. Gwath replies to Aganzir's thought that wolves don't plan much, calls it "far out", wonders if she's serious or throwing everyone off.

Aganzir replies to Nogrod's approval of her reluctance to go along with the common suspicion of Gwath, says she suspects Gwath but not for the reason Nogrod does.

Legate replies to Lommy's pairing of he and Gwath on the Lhuna-list issue, he says he wasn't agreeing with Gwath that they were helpful, says he was actually talking about Gwath, saying Gwath's interpretation of Lhuna's lists seemed logical. Says he was agreeing with Gwath's assessment, not with Gwath himself. He calls Gwath in the yellow, but doesn't quite want to vote for him because he'd rather vote for someone who hasn't contributed much, top of that list is Oddwen. Says we can always lynch Gwath tomorrow. Legate thinks Lhuna's voting for Gwath is good because she's not going after Legate, her supporter, but he still finds her slightly suspicious.

Aganzir questions Gwath's question about her question about wether wolves plan, asking what he didn't understand.

Gwath doesn't like the "myths" that have sprung up around him, he says he doesn't chime in with people, says he's not trying to flatter Legate, says that Legate does seem rational and that he's a "sucker for rational arguments". (No myth #3?) Says he's not been arguing in circles with Legate, that he's mentioned Legate once. He's suspicious of everyone.

Nogrod thinks Gwath is suspicious based on arguments, thinks he's suspicious in himself, not in with someone else.

Aganzir thinks that the suspicions of Gwath based on him saying Legate is rational is strange because she doesn't think Legate seemed rational.

Legate responds to Kath's thougths on himself, thinks she and Gwath might be fellow wolves but that that might be overcomplicating her meaning.

Legate responds to Gwath's Legate-is-rational thought with the explanation that he himself didn't think he was rational. Legate replies to the Gwath-and-Legate-are-arguing-alot theory with the theory that whoever started that is suspicious (Lhuna?).

Nogrod feels that Gwath's "myths" are fairly reasonable. Nogrod says that unlike Gwath & Nerwen, he was included in Lhuna's suspicion list without a conclusive argument.

Gwath doesn't like the way Nogrod directs suspicion, calls him "controlling" and "master-wolf". He feels Lhuna's vote for him is "flippant". He feels Volo's self-vote is more wolvish than innocent. He suspects Volo, Nogrod and Lhuna. He wants to hear more from the quiet ones.

Gwath mistakes the times, votes for Lhuna, thinking it's the last minute? Says he won't vote for Volo because he needs more evidence, threatens tomorrow.

Gwath apologizes for his wrong time.

Aganzir asks Gwath to answer an earlier question of hers, says he's gotten by in the past by ignoring questions. Says she'll vote Legate, Gwath or Lhuna.

Gwath answers Aganzir's question, he thinks that it's silly to think that wolves don't plan because they have a whole day.

Aganzir acknowledges Gwath's answer.

Lommy thinks Legate overreacted to the Lhuna-Gwath thing? She thinks Gwath looks a little more innocent.

Nogrod agrees with Gwath regarding Volo seeking to be obviously innocent without incriminating himself with a vote for another with his self-vote. Nogrod says that someone accompanying his own arguments to be extremely suspicious, Gwath's not getting anywhere with his flattery. Oh yeah, and Elf-Warrior, just because you think I'm innocent, that's not getting you anywhere either! Even if Gwath agrees with me about the suspiciousness of Volo and Lhuna!

Aganzir says it doesn't matter to her wether it's Legate, Lhuna or Gwath gets lynched, they're all equally suspicious to her.

Aganzir changes her statement, she says Lhuna's death would give the most insight (ha!) feeling that it would shed light on the alignment of Volo, Legate or Gwath.

Legate would rather not vote Gwath that Day, since Gwath started looking "better", but he expresses doubt about that as well.

Gwath replies to Aganzir's musings on wolves and planning, saying her point is that people tend to over-analyze.

Lommy says that of the people garnering votes, she would rather see Gwath go - though he seems no guiltier than anyone else.

Lommy votes for Gwath, for being "slightly fishy/unreasonable", not because he's any more suspicious to her.

Lhuna dies.

Edit: x-ed since Lommy

[Oddwen]

Disclaimer - I made the above list for myself, just searched for "Gwath" and put my interpretation on what I found. Mainly so I wouldn't have five pages open in my browser. I unfortunately don't have time to do Day 2 or either of the dead innocents at the time, so am reading day 2 right now, and hopefully I can do the rest.

What stands out after making that list is, predictably, the discussions between Gwath and Nogrod - Nogrod has had equally longer discussions with most of you, but you will note by my italicized section above what I find to be the most suspicious between the two there. And yes, this is all based on Day one discussions, but I'm finding really nothing on Day 2 to say against that.

I'd pull out my ol' favorite term "thrashing" and staple it to Nogrod, except the way I usually use it is when a sometime-proven innocent briefly touches upon a wolf, and the wolf goes berserk - and in this case, a known wolf is at the throat of an unknown, and they're both at it. Then again, this applies to Nogrod & Lommy as well - I'm wondering if this could be a wolf goading a known argumentative, or a wolf being argumentative. Right now, I'll just call him LOUD.

Originally Posted by Sally

You know, it was possible that an Oddie-wolf voted for Gwath and didn't think he'd actually get killed; I've seen wolves make bolder moves in my time. I've never played with Oddie before though. Would she do that?

I don't vote for people I don't want to die. (Oooh, considering my track record for this game, I've got a perfect record!) I made a gamble. It seemed to me that Lhuna made a stronger offence at a wolf than a defense for any innocent, and I acted on it.

Originally Posted by Sally

Oh noes!

I'd rather see Gwath go than Noggie at the moment, so....

++GWATH

And I must ask - is it possible that a Sally-wolf voted for a Gwath? Would you do that?

Did you intentionally tie Nog & Gwath, or did you not know that think you were making a safe vote for the runner up, not knowing Nogrod & Volo were voting just then? Or not?

x-ed since the next-to-last Leggy.

[Thinlómien]

Oddwen's summary confused me. I think I'll go through Gwath's posts on my own, even though I must admit that currently I feel terribly lazy.

Sally - you left me out from your day2 voting summary. I voted Noggie, after Mith but before Legate. (Although we all cross-posted, so...)

Originally Posted by Legate

Does anyone thing the formulation is odd? The last sentence does not logically fit in there, does it? It looks like praising silence??? Maybe a wolf hint to a friend among these two - "stay silent, that's the best defense"? Or how do you read it? I find that improbable and maybe I am reading too much to it (maybe a writing mischmatch), but it simply is odd.

Yes, it's surely odd, but I don't think it looks like a secret advice to a fellow. Maybe because I don't believe in wolves advising one another in their posts, it always seems a bit far-fetched to me. But I don't have any idea what to make of it.

Okay, maybe I'm off to reread and think of something more insightful to say...