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04-03-2008, 02:55 AM | #81 |
Princess of Skwerlz
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: where the Sea is eastwards (WtR: 6060 miles)
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Nogrod, we ask members not to post their e-mail addresses in order to protect themselves from spam or worse. There are too many bots combing the internet for links. Please do remove it from your post; those who wish to have it can contact you by PM. Thanks!
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'Mercy!' cried Gandalf. 'If the giving of information is to be the cure of your inquisitiveness, I shall spend all the rest of my days in answering you. What more do you want to know?' 'The whole history of Middle-earth...' |
04-03-2008, 04:10 AM | #82 | |
Flame of the Ainulindalë
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Quote:
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04-03-2008, 05:27 AM | #83 |
Wisest of the Noldor
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If you need a second person to mix the recordings etc., I have experience with this and access to professional software and equipment (my father's a musician and I'm doing a multimedia course).
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"Even Nerwen wasn't evil in the beginning." –Elmo. |
04-03-2008, 05:36 AM | #84 |
Flame of the Ainulindalë
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Great!
We could try different mixings and then compare them. If you have far superior sofware we should use yours but if they are roughly similar - producing roughly similar quality - we could share the tasks according to which one of us has time or whether certain tasks are better suited to one software than the other.
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Upon the hearth the fire is red Beneath the roof there is a bed; But not yet weary are our feet... |
04-03-2008, 02:21 PM | #85 |
Flame of the Ainulindalë
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I got Matthew's clip on Boromir.
You act well but the recording is pretty terrible... I'd give you (all) two pieces of advice. 1. Don't record your voice too loud so that the voice breaks down. Adjust the input in a way that the recording levels stay in the middle or little above it. Whatever the recording device it normally goes red when the input volume is too high. If the voice breaks down already in the recording session there's no way to mend it afterwards. One shouldn't record on too low levels either as then all the background noises come to the fore: so try to find the levels just below the "red zone" as it gives the optimal quality of sound. 2. Get away from your computer, as far as is possible - or at least build some kind of a sound-wall between the microphone and the central unit of your PC. It's no problem if you record from far away of the PC and there's some empty track before your recording starts (if you have to move yourselves to the place where you will make the recording after pushing the rec-button) as that can be always cut away. When you record by your computer the humming of the cooler-system of your PC will come through to the recording and it sounds really nasty indeed - like you'd be talking on the deck of an old-fashioned steam-boat . My friend who's a professional told me there's no solution for that as the pitch of the noise the computer has is low enough to be on the same wavelengths as the speech so cutting those will also cut out important lower tones from the voice. I'll send a few clips to anyone who sends me their e-mail addresses. There will be two versions of Matthew as Boromir: one where I have tried to downplay the background humming as well as I could and one where I have tried to make his tone as Boromirish I could (which ended up sounding Boromir being on board of a steam-riverboat as heightening the lower frequencies to make the tone more forceful and low ends up also heightening the background humming of the computer...). Then there is one where I play Gimli and it has been done near the computer (and you can hear the humming) and on the other I play Bilbo a few meters away from the PC (and you can't hear the humming any more). Btw. Those parts I've made myself you should not judge by the acting merits as they are basically just read-throughs with a lots of mistakes as my main focus was on finding the fitting tone to my speech as those characters - both acting-wise and mixing-wise. And I'm in no way trying to steal those characters to myself. I just tried them. Speaking of audiosoftware once more. You Nerwen should especially listen to this - and why not the others who have not heard it yet (use headphones if you can). For I just remembered that I do have a Myspace account where there is my version of the Song of Boromir (a Finnish composition to the local theatrical version of the book which I have arranged myself and turned back to the original lyrics; it's all done in my room eg. I played all the instruments and made the vocals there). From it you can hear what I can do with my sofware; the possibilities and the limits as well - basically the interesting stuff from this point of view is in the end of the song as it's one that grows little by little. But I think we should aim for that kind of sound-quality (and it's an mp3 and not an audio file!). Just keep on sending me your emails and audio clips! We'll overcome the technical obstacles!
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Upon the hearth the fire is red Beneath the roof there is a bed; But not yet weary are our feet... Last edited by Nogrod; 04-03-2008 at 02:24 PM. |
04-03-2008, 04:13 PM | #86 |
Flame of the Ainulindalë
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Crashlanding!
I tried to send a few samples to Matthew via gmail and after trying to send it long and hard the program said that sending of it failed because it went over the 20 MB limit... and only those short clips I tried to send took 29 MB (Matthew's originals took about 3MB...) So let's take a different approach then. I sent it to both Matthew and Gwath as mp3's. I had problems in sending things to Myspace as well and it's getting late. That's a stupid site indeed. I managed to send my song there when I joined the site (just to do that) a long time ago but now it seems practically impossible to add anything to my account there if it's not a video or a pic... So anyhow I'm afraid we need to go on compressing the files - at least those I will send you as they include lots of mixing stuff and thence are heavier to load. Let's first try with everyone sending me basic audiofiles if they're of reasonable size. I will send mp3's back to your mail after I have meddled with them. We might also try sending them to Nerwen to see whether her software would bring better results. PS. Anyone wishing to hear those first trials just send me your email address by a PM (this first trial is something like 2˝ MB as an mp3 file).
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Upon the hearth the fire is red Beneath the roof there is a bed; But not yet weary are our feet... |
04-03-2008, 04:20 PM | #87 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Skyrim, again.
Posts: 820
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If we are still talking about setting a musical background, I have several guitars and some software which should be up to the task.
From my (somewhat limited) experience, acoustic guitar and keyboard can work very well together.
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04-03-2008, 04:53 PM | #88 |
Shade with a Blade
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Nogrod, I thought you were terrific as both Gimli and Bilbo. Thanks for sending those.
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Stories and songs. |
04-03-2008, 05:27 PM | #89 |
Flame of the Ainulindalë
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Thanks. Although, as I said somewhere before, they were only kind of sound-checks. And my Gimli has a bit too low voice indeed. I mean how will we make the Balrog or the Ringwraiths if already a dwarf is speaking that low?
* Although some general discussion about the scope of this effort should be done as well eg. how much do we want to do this? It's possible to make a chapter or two even if it's task indeed but what's the reasonable limit? The whole book? I read it as a bedtimestory to Lommy and Greenie when they were young and it took something like 9 months reading about an hour or at least half every night. So what's the first goal? A whole chapter? Which one? * I can promise to make those low-baddies if no-one else comes forwards with a lower voice (in my choir I'm a tenor!!!). I can drink a bottle of whiskey the night before and record the tracks first thing in the morning - or when I have a really sore throat...
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Upon the hearth the fire is red Beneath the roof there is a bed; But not yet weary are our feet... Last edited by Nogrod; 04-03-2008 at 05:45 PM. |
04-03-2008, 05:43 PM | #90 |
Flame of the Ainulindalë
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I'm going to sleep and stop this flood-posting right away.
But how is it? If we're planning on background music should we then also think about some sound-effects? Some sound-effects are easy to make at home but others may require some creativity and effort. I've tried a few, like a sword-battle going on around and steps moving from left to right and they seem to work - at least in a way. Others might be experimented. I would indeed be interested in experimenting with them as that is something I have always loved: the soundscapes. But it will be a task. And making music for even a chapter of narration is not a small feat either.
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Upon the hearth the fire is red Beneath the roof there is a bed; But not yet weary are our feet... |
04-03-2008, 10:26 PM | #91 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
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Nogrod- thank you for being involved with this! You definitely are a great asset. As far as the scope of things- should we try a chapter first to see how it all goes? Or a certain Book (Book I, Book II, etc.)? I would like to do a part from Book II but we'll see how it goes.
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"Loud and clear it sounds in the valleys of the hills...and then let all the foes of Gondor flee!" -Boromir, The Fellowship of the Ring |
04-03-2008, 10:46 PM | #92 |
Shade with a Blade
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I think a chapter would be plenty for us to work on until we get the hang of things.
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Stories and songs. |
04-04-2008, 12:15 AM | #93 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Skyrim, again.
Posts: 820
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Well, which chapter?
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Werewolves vs. Fishmen. The battle of the century. |
04-04-2008, 10:25 AM | #94 |
Shady She-Penguin
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: In a far land beyond the Sea
Posts: 8,093
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I think I might like to try some Elf... but not sure whom. Maybe Haldir (or even Legolas)? But I don't know if we want to have them sound like me... Maybe I should try...
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04-04-2008, 11:03 AM | #95 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
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Hm...well let's all say some chapters that we would want to do.
My personal choices are really any chapter from Book II. There would then be quite a few characters in which we could cast. I'm sure you could say the same with The Return of the King, at least the first Book of it. But yeah, I'm for a chapter from Book II. What does everybody else think?
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"Loud and clear it sounds in the valleys of the hills...and then let all the foes of Gondor flee!" -Boromir, The Fellowship of the Ring |
04-04-2008, 05:24 PM | #96 |
Flame of the Ainulindalë
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Just keep on sending me your email addresses. You don't know what you're missing! I will then mail you back what we have.
This far we have Matthew's, Oddwen's and my interpretations of some of the characters. Mac, Rikae, Lommy (and Gwath?) have already promised to make their versions as well. It's testing all the time as we need to learn how this thing works. So join in and contribute & enjoy what others have done! This is fun indeed!
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Upon the hearth the fire is red Beneath the roof there is a bed; But not yet weary are our feet... |
04-04-2008, 05:43 PM | #97 |
Flame of the Ainulindalë
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I see a problem coming though...
When we combine recordings made in different places with different equipment they will then follow one another (like what we shall soon hear there being Oddwen narrating and myself bringing Gandalf into the midst of it after which Oddwen will continue) and the different levels of background humming may sound nauseatingly disturbing. Like there is the narration with midlevel humming behind it followed by character X with a clean background - interrupted by a humming "X said" - and then the voice goes to character Y who has a lots of background noise... It all just goes on to say that you should try to minimize any background noises. The first thing is to get the microphone away from your computer as the computer makes a lot of noise. Do not worry about there being gaps or silences in your recording. Those I can cut away easily.
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Upon the hearth the fire is red Beneath the roof there is a bed; But not yet weary are our feet... |
04-04-2008, 08:12 PM | #98 |
Shade of Carn Dűm
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It's nice to see that things are happening! I won't have access to recording equipment until mid-May, more than a month away, but if that's not too late, I'll send some stuff in then. If it is, then best of luck/break a leg to all, and I'll be looking forward to hearing the final product/helping in any other way I can.
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04-04-2008, 09:15 PM | #99 |
Wisest of the Noldor
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Re: humming–
Sounds the 50-cycle hum (or 60-cycle in America). This is very common and it means your equipment is not grounded properly. You can try using different connections. However, most sound-editing programs have filters for getting rid of it. As for sound effects– I have heaps, so I don't think that should be too much of an issue.
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"Even Nerwen wasn't evil in the beginning." –Elmo. |
04-04-2008, 10:14 PM | #100 | |
Drummer in the Deep
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Next Sunday A.D.
Posts: 2,125
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I tried a minimal noise removal effect on my original wav, but that made the rest of the audio sound like I was talking into a tin can. Which would, I suppose, be alright in Moria, but not under the darkening sky.
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04-05-2008, 02:12 AM | #101 | ||
Flame of the Ainulindalë
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Filters are handy when the noise one wants to cut out is on different wavelengths than the stuff one wants to record (like the scratches from old LP-records or the hissing of old C-cassetes). But the humming of a computer is quite low and cutting those frequencies out will also cut those frequencies from the human voice leading up to this "tin-can" effect Oddwen speaks of as you now miss those important lower frequencies that add to the richness or fullness of the human voice. Sure. The quality of the microphone makes a difference but unless the mic is really bad its main effect is just lower quality of tone. Better microphones produce clearer, richer, wider and sharper sound - not exactly the slang one should use I presume but those words describe the difference to me at least. Quote:
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04-05-2008, 05:22 AM | #102 | |
Wisest of the Noldor
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Quote:
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"Even Nerwen wasn't evil in the beginning." –Elmo. Last edited by Nerwen; 04-05-2008 at 05:36 AM. |
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04-05-2008, 05:27 AM | #103 |
Flame Imperishable
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Right here
Posts: 3,928
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Ok, I think I'll rejoin
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Last edited by Eönwë; 04-05-2008 at 07:57 AM. |
04-05-2008, 03:43 PM | #104 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
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Good! I was just about to leave you a message saying it's too bad you're going to depart.
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"Loud and clear it sounds in the valleys of the hills...and then let all the foes of Gondor flee!" -Boromir, The Fellowship of the Ring |
04-06-2008, 01:33 PM | #105 |
Flame of the Ainulindalë
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Oddwen's clip is almost a page long and there's three hobbits, Gandalf and the narrator involved in it. We are going to make a trial with it tomorrow. Lommy comes over to my place and she'll record one hobbit's lines and I will do the Gandalf parts - and hopefully Greenie has time and enthusiasm to join us making another hobbit so Oddwen would have one hobbit and the narration left to her. I'll send it all to you all to hear as it's done. Then we can hear how different voices act together.
Matthew: If you can please make another go for Boromir (or whoever you want). Just lower the input levels a bit so that your voice doesn't break and try to get the mike (and yourself) at least a little away from the computer. Let's see if a second try brings better results in light of recording quality. You acted nicely already in the first clips. Others: Keep those clips coming (just record a short passage of someone's lines and send them to me) and we'll get this thing going! Send me a PM to get my email address to send them into. Remember this is just testing so do not take it too seriously. But we need first to hear how your equipment works and surely we'd all like to share your voice. I promised to send those "raw-materials" to Nerwen as well so that she could try out whether her software would produce better results. Meanwhile - as the testing goes on - we should actually start the discussion what is the chapter we should try first and who should play which role. I have no strong preferences to either question.
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Upon the hearth the fire is red Beneath the roof there is a bed; But not yet weary are our feet... |
04-06-2008, 02:37 PM | #106 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Skyrim, again.
Posts: 820
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I'd love to help out with this.
I don't have mic equipment, so I can't contribute to the voices. However, I can help with soundtracks, as that is more my area of expertise and I have the hardware to do it.
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Werewolves vs. Fishmen. The battle of the century. |
04-06-2008, 02:47 PM | #107 |
A Voice That Gainsayeth
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: In that far land beyond the Sea
Posts: 7,431
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I actually need to save some time to even make some recording... and first I should probably save some time to read most of this thread since my last post here, as I have only vague idea what's been arranged meanwhile... I wouldn't have been of much use lately anyway, as my voice was still recovering after I was ill (though maybe an Orc would do then; I was recording some singing for my brother however, so hopefully it didn't ruin my voice again)... I will try to come up with something soon, but if I don't, don't bother with me, maybe you won't even need me, depending on the thing you pick to record...
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"Should the story say 'he ate bread,' the dramatic producer can only show 'a piece of bread' according to his taste or fancy, but the hearer of the story will think of bread in general and picture it in some form of his own." -On Fairy-Stories |
04-07-2008, 01:58 PM | #108 | |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
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Quote:
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"Loud and clear it sounds in the valleys of the hills...and then let all the foes of Gondor flee!" -Boromir, The Fellowship of the Ring |
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04-07-2008, 02:53 PM | #109 | |
Flame of the Ainulindalë
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Quote:
Otherwise some nice news. Lommy came here today and played Frodo's part in the clip Oddwen sent me. Greenie will come on Wednesday and I try to persuade her to take Merry. I try to find time to recording Gandalf in that clip. Then we would have a clip including four different actors in it! That should give us a taste of how it might sound like. Btw. Many of the clips are now from Rivendell. They are nice scenes but there is one problem considering the actual trial of making one whole chapter and that is the fact that The Council of Elrond is composed mainly of long monologues... *** EDIT: I sent you Matthew a mail instead of a PM so that you can reply to it. Thus we can remove the possibility that the address was wrong. I have a few ideas in the mail I sent you to try out.
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Upon the hearth the fire is red Beneath the roof there is a bed; But not yet weary are our feet... Last edited by Nogrod; 04-07-2008 at 03:04 PM. |
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04-07-2008, 03:33 PM | #110 |
Shade with a Blade
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The only microphone I have is built into the keyboard of my laptop. I'll try it anyway, but hopefiully I'll be able to dig up something more legit when I go home (in a month).
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Stories and songs. |
04-08-2008, 01:09 AM | #111 |
Shady She-Penguin
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: In a far land beyond the Sea
Posts: 8,093
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Yes, I did Frodo, and it was horrible. I do not like hearing my own voice recorded, especially as I always thought it less feminine, clearer and less squaky. Whatever. Anyway, I let Nog keep my Frodo in order to demonstrate how it works with a "dialogue", but I don't want to be Frodo when we do the recordings. So, don't regard it as an "audition" for the role. I also tried some Legolas and deleted it - because someone whose English is more fluent has to do the part and because I sounded even more girly than normally when I was trying to sound like Legolas... poor guy...
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Like the stars chase the sun, over the glowing hill I will conquer Blood is running deep, some things never sleep Double Fenris
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04-08-2008, 03:22 AM | #112 |
Flame Imperishable
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Right here
Posts: 3,928
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Augh! My voice is breaking (even worse than usual)I suppose this means I'm out, or can only do only minor characters, as my voice wll obviously change too much to be recognisable as the the same one.
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04-08-2008, 12:00 PM | #113 | |||
A Voice That Gainsayeth
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: In that far land beyond the Sea
Posts: 7,431
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All right, I FINALLY managed to read all the thread between my last posts... I have a few comments to that...
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Now concerning the present things. I will record something soon - only a question, it does not matter what I record, Nog? Whether a dialogue, narration, a mix of both; a dialogue between two characters - should I act them or, like, what exactly is the purpose of this? Just technical thing (to find out that I need to buy a better microphone or probably a microphone with longer cable, as I am quite sure the computer humming will be heard in my case), or also to show my acting capabilities and such? (The thing I have in mind is, if I record a dialogue between Gandalf and Frodo, and in the end I turn playing Gimli, the sample won't tell much, as my voice or acting may not be good for Gandalf nor Frodo, but good for Gimli.) Speaking of that, I have no clear idea of whom I'd like to play - well, how could I when I don't know what chapter we are going to record or such. But I don't particularly care (although I just got an idea what I could record... we'll see). Hm, not sure if I said all I wanted, but I will post if I remember. It has been enough for now anyway, I think P.S. Oh yes, Nog: And mainly: How long thing should the recorded sample be? And in which format (I was not able to figure out from the posts whether it has to be wav or whether converting it to mp3 does not matter - I think depending on the length of it, wav can be quite a big file).
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"Should the story say 'he ate bread,' the dramatic producer can only show 'a piece of bread' according to his taste or fancy, but the hearer of the story will think of bread in general and picture it in some form of his own." -On Fairy-Stories Last edited by Legate of Amon Lanc; 04-08-2008 at 12:13 PM. |
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04-08-2008, 01:03 PM | #114 |
Flame of the Ainulindalë
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To the concerns of Lommy and Eönwë - and anyone else - I'd just want to say the following... Don't raise the level of expectations for yourself too high. This is no Hollywood or BBC production with professional actors, directors, studio conditions or equipment. We are amateurs all of us who have gotten an idea to do something fun together. Right? It would be awesome if we could - come fall - boast that we have indeed made one chapter from the LotR together over seas and continents. And we have had fun with it. And we can remember that thing when we're old in a way "well, then we did this thing back in the early third millenia... now where's that file again... I was soo young back then, just listen to my funny voice..."
I got Matthew's clips finally. I'm afraid most email-providers have a 10MB size limit what comes to attachements so we should start using mp3's indeed. Otherwise the files get too big to be posted. I'm trying to upload the next bigger one to Myspace though. If it works we could share larger files that way later. But just for now let's stick to mp3's (I know I myself said let's try to use wav.-files as they have a better quality but having sent a pile of files recently over this matter I think we need to accept the mp3 format - and it's not that bad compared to the relative differences in the recordinhgs themselves). I'd advice against meddling with the text, at least in a way of adding things to it. One thing we could and probably should do would be to skip off those narrations which only state "Frodo said" or "said Gandalf" (and there are a lot of those!). When the narration goes like "Bilbo laughed" or "said Elrond Gravely" we should think whether that tone of voice can be acted out clear enough to omit that phrase if that is the only thing that precedes, cuts or follows a speech. But when the narration says fex. "cried Sam, unable to contain himself any longer, and jumping up from the corner..." then the narrator should read that all, also the part "cried Sam". Legate - and others who have not recorded anything yet: it's pretty much the same what you record now. Take something you like. The first thing we need to see is, do the equipments work and how they do it? This far we know that Oddwen's equipments work well enough as well as mine (and Lommy & Greenie can use mine as well) and that Matthew has some problems with the technical stuff. I've sent one clip from Matthew to Nerwen for her to see whether she could get better results from it with her dad's stuff. But there surely is the other dimension as well. It would be useless for me to try a Lobelia just as a technical trial as that would in no case be my character. So keep your favourites coming. After we have a host of them we all have heard we can start to discuss who should take which role. And we need a narrator as well. I think it would be good if the narrator was someone who speaks English as a mothertongue and has decent equipments because the narrator is the one who has basically the most lines. About the length then. Oddwen read almost a page and that I think should be the maximum. Matthew has made some takes from almost oneliners to a few sentences. That I think is the minimum. Regarding the chapter we should try eventually I'd say we should try to choose one which has lots of hobbits and elves in it so that all the females could find characters to themselves - if we are to try female voices as hobbits and elves in the first place; I do think myself it's a good idea as there are so many females compared to males in relation to the roles in the actual books. Although a chapter with a few orcs as well might do as I could run the female orc-voices through a guitar amplifier with distortion or something... it might sound interesting as well.
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Upon the hearth the fire is red Beneath the roof there is a bed; But not yet weary are our feet... Last edited by Nogrod; 04-08-2008 at 01:08 PM. |
04-08-2008, 02:08 PM | #115 | |
A Voice That Gainsayeth
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: In that far land beyond the Sea
Posts: 7,431
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All right. I will have something for you hopefully tomorrow.
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Speaking of Orcs, I like very much the Uruk-hai, but not sure if it's everyone's cup of tea... Or hey, what about the Voice of Saruman? That provides some good dialogues (but that will be quite a challenge to make a convincing Saruman - and even more convincing Gandalf in the end... Besides, I think MatthewM wanted Boromir there...).
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"Should the story say 'he ate bread,' the dramatic producer can only show 'a piece of bread' according to his taste or fancy, but the hearer of the story will think of bread in general and picture it in some form of his own." -On Fairy-Stories |
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04-08-2008, 02:16 PM | #116 | |
Flame of the Ainulindalë
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Quote:
I also think she's pretty outstanding Gollum as well (I've heard her acting him). So if I can talk her over to try that as well...
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Upon the hearth the fire is red Beneath the roof there is a bed; But not yet weary are our feet... |
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04-08-2008, 09:49 PM | #117 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
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Indeed!
So, if we can agree that we are looking for a chapter which has speech from Men, elves, and hobbits...perhaps one from Lorien?
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"Loud and clear it sounds in the valleys of the hills...and then let all the foes of Gondor flee!" -Boromir, The Fellowship of the Ring |
04-09-2008, 10:11 AM | #118 | |
Leaf-clad Lady
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"But some stories, small, simple ones about setting out on adventures or people doing wonders, tales of miracles and monsters, have outlasted all the people who told them, and some of them have outlasted the lands in which they were created." |
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04-09-2008, 10:45 AM | #119 |
A Voice That Gainsayeth
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: In that far land beyond the Sea
Posts: 7,431
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Aah, I also thought about Gorbags when I was choosing what to do, but then I left the idea as I presumed we won't be probably doing Orcs anyway... so I picked something "neutral" (Strider). It's not the crown of creation, but now for the basic purposes it should serve well. Hope Nog gets it all right.
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"Should the story say 'he ate bread,' the dramatic producer can only show 'a piece of bread' according to his taste or fancy, but the hearer of the story will think of bread in general and picture it in some form of his own." -On Fairy-Stories |
04-09-2008, 12:56 PM | #120 | |
Shady She-Penguin
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: In a far land beyond the Sea
Posts: 8,093
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This is beginning to look better and better...
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If we're doing Lórien, I might reconsider doing Haldir... I like him and I would have great fun with some of his lines. Maybe I must test one day.
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Like the stars chase the sun, over the glowing hill I will conquer Blood is running deep, some things never sleep Double Fenris
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