Tol-in-Gaurhoth revisited (aka Werewolf 2)

[the phantom]

Though Spawn and I are the surviving werewolves, don't forget about Nimrodel_9. She played her part perfectly. She was a huge reason for the innocent Aina getting lynched, she allowed herself to be an early target of my suspicions (to make me look innocent), and though Holby (the seer) went after Nim, it brought the seer to our attention so we could kill her before she could do any more damage.

Well done, Nimrodel_9.

And Dancing Spawn- great job. In our nightly planning sessions, you warned me of things that I was already uneasy about and you bolstered my thoughts on things I was fairly confident about. Basically, you always told me exactly what I needed to hear to make me confident in a decision. It was a pleasure working with you.

And so, BW was the hunter. Spawn and I guessed that a couple nights ago and that was one reason we didn't try to kill him. I also thought it would be lovely to keep SoN and BW alive because they tried to vote for me the very first day. The village should have listened to Fordim- but it didn't, and it certainly came back to bite them (pun intended).

I think the village would have strung up The Barrow-Wight or me before you.

Ah yes, another reason we wanted you and BW around.

I feel personally responsible for this loss; I voted for The Phantom to be lynched on Day 1

But you realize that you and BW did far more than most in your failed attempt to lynch me. Many probably never considered me till it was too late. The other villagers should feel more responsible for the loss because they didn't follow your lead.

I was convinced that your wife, Feanor of the Peredhil, was the werewolf, and was using you in the way that in reality you were using her. After she was proved innocent, I became more timid in my accusations

My poor, poor wife.

Fea's death was supposed to buy me some innocence, so it is wonderful to know that it worked somewhat. Though I defended Fea and voted to lynch Aina instead, that was just to further convince people of my innocence and set up Aina to be a lynching target for a later day. I knew that Fea would die that day, since we had already agreed that Spawn would vote for her (and the other two that hadn't voted at that time were not going to vote before the deadline because of what time zone they were in).

My hat's off to you.

Thank you, sir.

*bows*

And also, a pat on the back for Saucy. Great job running the game and coming up with sickening deaths! Heh- that's not something you hear someone congratulated for very often.

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

Great game everybody, and congratulations to our winners!

dancing spawn I suspected a fair bit, but phantom? I was so naive! Completely missed that one. My suspicions were generally based on guesswork; the werewolves played a fantastic game, I think.

I feel I must apologise to Aina for directing that lynch mob in her direction. No hard feelings, I hope....

Looking forward to the next game where I can maybe get something right. By the way Fordim, what was I again? Was I "SO TOTALLY a werewolf"?

But these wolves are tricky, aren't they? Cheers!

[Nimrodel_9]

I suppose I can post now? Even though I am dead?

Good game everyone!

Phantom and Dancing Spawn, I have been avenged! Nice job!

[The Saucepan Man]

Originally Posted by the phantom

... and though Holby (the seer) went after Nim, it brought the seer to our attention so we could kill her before she could do any more damage.

I feel that I should point out that Holbytlass never actually dreamed of Nimrodel_9. That her accusations of Nim marked her out as the Seer was therefore entirely coincidental ...

Great job running the game and coming up with sickening deaths! Heh- that's not something you hear someone congratulated for very often.

Why thank you. Actually, with the open roles people chose and the secret roles that were assigned, the deaths more or less wrote themselves. And, dare I say it, they were rather fun to write. I do, however, have to credit the phantom with the idea for Holbytlass' death.

I must also say that it was rather fun to watch the Villagers adding two and two together, coming up with five, and rushing off down completely the wrong track. As the game wore on, I became rather good at predicting who would be lynched and who would be mauled during the night (which helped in coming up with their deaths).

[Kuruharan]

What a sick demented soul he is!

(Oh...wait a minute...I guess somebody suggested to the Wight the means of extermination for a couple of prior victims... )

[Encaitare]

Never suspected you, phantom. Well done. Nice game, guys!

[The Barrow-Wight]

I hate to be a sore werewolf entree, but the role-playing aspect of this game made it less enjoyable than it could have been. Friendships, relationships, etc. blurred every post, making it difficult to determine who was playing a role and who was playing the game. In the future, if the moderator wants to inject a bit of RPG into a game, I think it is very important that it be stipulated that all players are individuals and have no 'virtual' ties with other players.

I should have made more of a nuisance of myself. As the hunter, I was taking phantom with me next if I was was targeted.

[Ainaserkewen]

Funny, my death came at a very convenient time. I just graduated this weekend and was without a computer for 2 days. I didn't even get the chance to check and make sure I was dead, but with the crowd left over, I just assumed my votes were the majority. I was tempted to put in my last post "If you kill me, you'll lose." But I didn't. I wracked my brain to try and prove myself innocent, well, I tried.

[Anguirel]

I liked the RPGing stuff, myself...it turned theorising into climactic passages, and made Saucie's posts rather richer. I particularly enjoyed the redistribution of Eomer's wealth.

This is really too frighteningly addictive. I'm going to rest next game, I think.

[dancing spawn of ungoliant]

Thanks for the excellent game, everyone! As Anguirel said, this is really addictive.

I think the RPG aspect can be very misleading but also very funny to read. I found SpM's posts really enjoyable! I especially loved the Little Red Riding Hood touch in the last one

Phantom & Nim, it was a pleasure to terrorize the village with you!

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

Not taking anything away from his performance, but I do think the phantom was awarded a significant slice of luck when Fordim accused him out of nowhere. This afforded him sympathy straight from the off, didn't it? After that, all accusations against the phantom boiled down to the initial confrontational accusation that I saw as a strategy, and nothing else. Perhaps Master Hedgethistle is a true seer!

It's funny how little things work out to turn a game. Remember when mormegil chose to dream about Firefoot? Very lucky because Firefoot was actually playing a blinder and could have caused much havoc were it not for that dream.

I agree that it is addictive, but surely it's better than other vices........right? Right?

[Holbytlass]

I think Mormegil will agree, that being the seer is VERY difficult. At the beginning, the seer has to choose one out of 12 (or more) with a 1 in 4 shot of hitting a wolf.
That he hit one right off the bat is very amazing and kudos to him.
As far as my game went, I always felt like I was playing catch-up. I never dreamt about a wolf, and I felt it was my duty to protect the innocent to the best of my ability. Some may be wondering why, if I KNEW Feanor to be innocent, why didn't I vote for Aina and at least force a tie. Simple, I fell asleep and never woke up till after the deadline. The main flux of voting happened to be around 2 a.m. my time.
I apologized to her, and do so again publicily. I'M SORRY. (Besides, I feared the tongue-lashing prepared for me more than the wolves or the gallows ).
I found the turn of events bizzare when I found out that Angriuel, who suspected and voted for me turned out to be the Guardian. Although he got BBQ'ed that night, it would have been surreal trying to protect the person who was out for me, who was really supposed to be protecting me (or at least the gift).
Now we come to Nimrodel9. That was pure speculation as was SonofNumenor. After I lost my eyes and whatnot, I was screaming at my screen when everyone just started voting for Nim (very hasty, again). I thought I would go down as the worst seer in the history of the game! As stated before, it was pure-dumb luck. But it would have not lasted. My wolf ranking was Eomer (I dreamt about him, innocent) then Barrow-wight and Son of Numenor. Maybe, I will still hold that title.
Again, Great Game!! I love it. No, really, ILOOOVE IT. It's my....prrrrecioussss.
Oh, and good luck next seer, you're gonna need it.

[The Saucepan Man]

Originally Posted by The Barrow-Wight

I hate to be a sore werewolf entree, but the role-playing aspect of this game made it less enjoyable than it could have been.

As I stated, it was not my intention to create an RPG, but to provide the players with a background from which to start their posting (and to make my job of devising their deaths easier ). I was also hoping that it would assist in eliminating extraneous matters (such as BD friendships, PM'ing activity etc) from the game. I didn't intend that it should cause the game to be much different from the first one and, after an initial flurry of RPG-type posts, I don't think that it really was. Most of the discussion revolved around who had said what earlier, who had voted for whom etc.

As for friendships and relationships, I think that it would be difficult to eliminate these entirely. Whether there is a role play aspect or not, alliances will form and it is likely that reasons (village relationships) will be given for this. Although I do think that the phantom and Fea should be banned from ever participating in the same game again ...

In any event, I guess that the style of the game is really a matter for whoever is moderating it, provided that the players are happy to go along with the style that he or she suggests.

[Feanor of the Peredhil]

Although I do think that the phantom and Fea should be banned from ever participating in the same game again ...

I'm hurt. You can't possibly believe how hurt I truly am.

Quite honestly, I spent a good portion of my time lying. Not about any of the he said/she said evidence and why I voted for certain people, but I didn't ever tell a soul who I really suspected. Even after I died, nobody knew. I couldn't for the life of me figure out why Fordim went after the phantom before any proof was there, and after that, I kept a close eye on the phantom.

Honestly, ol' boy, plain old wolves hoisting people to the ceiling and tying them there? Good grief.

I kept waiting for him to screw up. It was exasperating, to tell you the truth, because he never does. Drives a girl mad.

But the one who really got to me was Sono. I knew that I was innocent, and I couldn't understand why in the world he would so immediately accuse me.

But then again... like Holby said... I'm sneaky and I play games. Which is no doubt why she dreamt about me on night one. Just to get that out of the way.

For everyone's piece of mind though... no worries of me and the phantom working together on the next game (not that we ever actually worked together on any of them)... my internet's down at home and I've got ten class days left before graduation, plus work, which means no time at all in which to play.

Saucie, my hat's off to you for your grisly and oh-so-entertaining slaughterings. I loved the last...

[the phantom]

As for friendships and relationships, I think that it would be difficult to eliminate these entirely. Whether there is a role play aspect or not, alliances will form and it is likely that reasons (village relationships) will be given for this. Although I do think that the phantom and Fea should be banned from ever participating in the same game again ...

A very rude statement, if I may say so. Is a tiny bit of friendly interaction amonst Downers a crime? Hmph! Some people just have no appreciation for that sort of thing.

If you really are considering the ban, how about a compromise? If the positive interaction is the problem, Fea and I could refer to each other "attercop" and "tomnoddy" and throw in an occasional "fool of a Took". Is that belligerent enough to allow us to play?

[Feanor of the Peredhil]

Or, of course, we could pretend that we hate each other and immediately accuse each other of everything in sight no matter what the circumstance just to show how truly serious we are about our non-commitment to um... anything. Yeah....

[Anguirel]

That would be still more confusing. "Are they triple-bluffing?"

[Feanor of the Peredhil]

Now I understand... tp, our sheer brilliance (and of course good looks) have them intimidated. They are terrified to attempt to match our wits.

[the phantom]

Now I understand... tp, our sheer brilliance (and of course good looks) have them intimidated. They are terrified to attempt to match our wits.

Remember, you're just supposed to think that, not actually say it. Well, actually, I suppose you can say the good looks part if you want. No one seems to get too offended by that. Just leave off the bit about brilliance and wit. That seems to rile up all those competetive big-ego sorts. But you are correct, of course. It would be nearly impossible to defeat a Fea-Phantom wolf team, whether we were coworkers, friends, lovers, or bitter enemies.

"Are they triple-bluffing?"

Ha ha!

That would be still more confusing.

In other words- perfect.

[Feanor of the Peredhil]

Originally Posted by the phantom

Just leave off the bit about brilliance and wit. That seems to rile up all those competetive big-ego sorts.

Indeed. Which explains my saying it in the first place. It's just so much fun to watch those competetive big-ego sorts get riled up. Of course it's not so much fun when they suggest a ban against us...

It would be nearly impossible to defeat a Fea-Phantom wolf team, whether we were coworkers, friends, lovers, or bitter enemies.

The mere thought makes me giggle in anticipation of future fun. You know they'll never trust us. But wouldn't it be all kinds of fun if we were to use that against them?

If only I could play in the next game... That would be a blast and a half if we ended up true partners in crime.

[The Saucepan Man]

See what I mean ...

[The Only Real Estel]

I should have made more of a nuisance of myself. As the hunter, I was taking phantom with me next if I was was targeted.

So you actually did suspect Phantom?

[Fordim Hedgethistle]

Originally Posted by Eomer of the Rohirrim

Not taking anything away from his performance, but I do think the phantom was awarded a significant slice of luck when Fordim accused him out of nowhere. This afforded him sympathy straight from the off, didn't it? After that, all accusations against the phantom boiled down to the initial confrontational accusation that I saw as a strategy, and nothing else. Perhaps Master Hedgethistle is a true seer!

I think the slice of luck he was afforded came about when the mob decided not to adopt my strategy -- or, for that matter, any strategy -- and to instead hang me on the "evidence" that I had developed a strategy...

Fordim: "I have a way of hunting down werewolves."

Werewolf: "He has a strategy for hunting down werewolves. He must be a werewolf."

Villagers: "Hang him! Hang him!"

Odd logic indeed!

[Holbytlass]

Forgive us! Forgive us! Hopefully, if you play the next game, you will get your revenge. Also, is your signature curses and insults to us that voted for you in another language?

[Saurreg]

I would like to try out for the next game...

...Provided we go back to the original rules and someone explain to me how the time cycling works for the next round. I propose we follow the GMT as shown on the board if that's all right.

[Fordim Hedgethistle]

Originally Posted by Holbytlass

Forgive us! Forgive us! Hopefully, if you play the next game, you will get your revenge. Also, is your signature curses and insults to us that voted for you in another language?

Nothing to forgive! I badly misplayed my opening gambit -- it was my bad luck that I accused a werewolf, as that meant I immediately brought down three wolves on my neck, which meant they only needed to fool...er...sway three villagers to their 'cause'.

The siggy is actually a bit of dialogue from Bladerunner rendered in Old English.

[Mithalwen]

I think the truth is that the best course of action will always to be lynch Fea instantly. She is the Werewolves' greatest asset even if she doesn't happen to be a werewolf herself.......

[Feanor of the Peredhil]

Oh come now, Mith, that's just mean. The only thing that makes me an "asset" to the wolves is the fact that people can't distinguish between being outspoken and being guilty. Everyone knows that I'm outspoken... you'd be even more suspicious of me if I were to lay low and keep out of the discussion. I can't win either way, and that bites.

[The Saucepan Man]

Originally Posted by Feanor of the Peredhil

The only thing that makes me an "asset" to the wolves is the fact that people can't distinguish between being outspoken and being guilty.

Originally Posted by Feanor of the Peredhil

Quite honestly, I spent a good portion of my time lying.

I would posit that it is actually in the villagers' best interests to tell the truth (albeit that it is advisable to keep quiet about any secret role that they might have). Accordingly, it seems to me that a villager who spends much of their time lying is likely to be an asset to the Werewolves, since this serves to spread (or increase) confusion and carries with it the likelihood that the liar will be suspected of being a Werewolf him- or herself...

In any event, the game has been over for some time now and has been well and truly dissected in the subsequent posts. I should be grateful, therefore, if one of the Admins could close it.

[Mithalwen]

Originally Posted by Feanor of the Peredhil

Oh come now, Mith, that's just mean.

Not mean.... assuming you mean what I think you mean by mean which isn't what I mean by mean... just practical ...and you admitted you spent a lot of time lying .... if you confuse people enough you will look guilty at some point - and so it will be easier to get you out of the way before perpetual confusion sets in..... and remember you haven't been killed by werewolves yet. And if you haven't noticed this game has wakened my usually dormant competitive streak and linked into the ruthless efficiency that is usually reserved for my professional life. There may be casualties...

[Feanor of the Peredhil]

No, it's just mean because the only things I lie about are suspicions because it's nice to see who defends who and what the reactions are. If I'm killed immediately every time (or banned from playing with certain members), than what's the point of joining in? "Keeping things simple" defeats half the fun.

[Mithalwen]

Well bottom line is you make yourself vulnerable. If you have to more or less take a stab in the dark on your vote, then the good target is the one who will pay a grief dividend in the event of them being a lynched innocent. If I play games I play them to win - if you don't take them seriously they aren't fun.

[Encaitare]

I think I'll sit the next one out, just to take a little break. It was a fun game, though, and I'd definitely be interested in playing sometime again.

[the phantom]

I think the slice of luck he was afforded came about when the mob decided not to adopt my strategy -- or, for that matter, any strategy -- and to instead hang me on the "evidence" that I had developed a strategy...

But you must realize that no one but a werewolf can have a truly solid strategy on day one since only the werewolves know who is innocent and who is not. Day one is a complete shot in the dark, and everyone knows it, so if you seem to know what you are doing on day one people are going to suspect you. Sorry, lad, but that's just the way it is. Maybe they'll listen to you next time (of course, you might be a wolf next time).

Plus, you should have picked a different target. Sure, I'm disliked by some and you might get their votes, but there were also a couple of villagers that I am friendly with and they were not too anxious to get rid of me. You should've gone after BW. People would've piled on him, I bet.

it was my bad luck that I accused a werewolf, as that meant I immediately brought down three wolves on my neck, which meant they only needed to fool...er...sway three villagers to their 'cause'.

Ah, but four of the first five "kill Fordy" votes came from villagers. We wolves did not even lead the counter charge- we let the villagers do it.

I think the truth is that the best course of action will always to be lynch Fea instantly. She is the Werewolves' greatest asset even if she doesn't happen to be a werewolf herself.......

Ha ha ha!

By the way, I've finished my review of this game. You can read it on the Random Thoughts page of my website. I included excerpts from pms sent to Spawn and Nim during our nightly planning sessions, as well as a couple of my pms to Saucy declaring our target for the night. Enjoy...

[The Saucepan Man]

Originally Posted by Fea

No, it's just mean because the only things I lie about are suspicions because it's nice to see who defends who and what the reactions are.

I agree that this is a valid strategy at the start of the game, since you can tell a lot by people's reactions to being accused (or defended). My own view is that, since this is (as I see it) a team game, Villagers should be more concerned about flushing out the Werewolves than avoiding being killed, unless they are the Seer or the Guardian, in which case their lives are more valuable. After all, a Villager is going to get killed each night, and you might as well risk being that Villager (or even risk getting lynched) in order to follow a course which you think will assist the Villagers in their ultimate goal of eliminating the Werewolves. Accordingly, my suspicions are always aroused when someone seems to be putting more energy into defending themselves or avoiding saying anything controversial than into trying to deduce who the Werewolves are.

But I do agree with Mithalwen. Your strategy is one which makes you vulnerable. And I think that it's value becomes less as the game wears on when clarity rather than confusion is of most vlaue to the Villagers.

Nice analysis, phantom. I wondered how your suspicions that BW was the Hunter had arisen. I like the thought processes that went into selecting Enca as your victim on the final NIGHT although, from what I knew, I was pretty sure that you would pick her,

[Holbytlass]

Oooohh....I have chills running up and down my spine! Nothing like reading about thoughts on your own demise. And that squeezing the eye thing , I'm sure SpM did you all proud!!

[Encaitare]

I like the thought processes that went into selecting Enca as your victim on the final NIGHT although, from what I knew, I was pretty sure that you would pick her,

I had a bit of a foreboding feeling as well...