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Old 10-28-2010, 09:45 AM   #1
Elmo
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Were the Valar right to summon the Elves to the West?

I do not think they were for various reasons.

Firstly, it lead to the Sundering of the Elves. Elves who had together the strong bonds of kith and kin were separated in this life and the next simply because some did not trust a strange horseman who came bursting in with tales of some wondrous land thousands of leagues away. Of course there were other instances of this Sundering caused by the summons, like the separation of the brothers Elwe and Olwe caused by a spell put on by one of the Valar-kind in order to ensnare her mate.

Second, it led to all the sorrows of the War of the Jewels in which countless Elves, Men and Dwarves were brutally slaughtered. The Undying Lands caused the Elves to be arrogant and warmongering. And the direct cause of the war - the Silmarils - were forged by the Elves in those lands.

Third, I agree with Nimrodel, the Summoning caused the natural way of the Elves to be disrupted. The Elves were meant to wander and sing under starlight, not to live in stone houses and mine for gems. This disruption of the natural order might be the underlying causes of all the Elves' sorrow after the Sundering. Also how much heartache was caused to the Elves throughout the ages by the sea longing caused by the Summoning -they who loved the lands of Middle Earth so much?

Fourth, it lead to the abandonment of Middle Earth of its fairest inhabitants. These inhabitants could have done much to heal the land of the hurts caused by Melkor yet the land and its remaining folk were left to suffer.

Lastly but not least it was unfair. The main reason for the Elves' Summoning was to protect them from the dangers of the starlit dusk. This protection was not extended to Men or Dwarves. Why did this protection not extend to Men or Dwarves? Was it simply that Elves were the ones that the Valar cared about most? Manwe was said to love the Vanyar the most as they were the most fair of Elves. Logically that must mean he must care about Men and Dwarves the least as they were far less fair than even the ugliest Elf.

It is mentioned somewhere (I think) that when the Valar interfere directly in the affairs of Elves and Men it all turns to evil. The creation of Numenor was another example of this meddling. I think the Summoning of the Elves is a big example of this interference and therefore was the wrong thing to do.
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Old 10-28-2010, 10:20 AM   #2
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I remember this being brought up before, this thread in particular.

I don't really have anything new to add, but I see it basically the same way. You mention the fact that Dwarves and Men were not offered protection and bliss in Valinor. I think there was an obvious reason for that. The Elves differed from the other Children fundamentally in their "immortality" (which it really wasn't, but that was the perception), their tie to Arda that bound them to the world as long as it lasted. Middle-earth was not an immortal place. Things died there.
I know there were Silvan Elves who lived thousands of years in ME in apparent content, but as immortals, did they really belong in a mortal world? Wasn't that what lay behind Celebrimbor's making the Three? A desire to arrest change in an environment where change was the natural order of things? Can immortal beings ultimately be happy in a changing world?
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Old 10-28-2010, 11:47 AM   #3
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Having not read previous threads about this--that I can recall, anyway--I get to blissfully make points that may well have been brought up before. However, that is not deterrent in the slightest, so here I go.

Firstly, I would agree, but only to an extent, that the Valar made the wrong call. I think this is supported by The Silmarillion narrative, but it's one of those "wrong in hindsight" calls. Insofar as the Valar were wrong, it has more to do with the fact that they, themselves, retreated from the affairs of early Middle-earth, and in so doing abandoned it to Morgoth. This led to the inevitable situation wherein they either had to abandon the Elves as well, or they had to intervene.

Intervening was, clearly, the right choice to make, and the war on Morgoth and his subsequent imprisonment in Valinor was clearly the right call. Should the Elves have been left in Middle-earth thereafter or summoned west? Well, asking that question kind of assumes a perfect world. Middle-earth was still very dangerous, and dark. Without the Sun and Moon, it could certainly have been construed as unjust for the Valar to have excluded the Elves from the light of the Trees, and from the safety and protection that Valinor offered.

The Valar could either have relocated themselves to Middle-earth, invited the Elves to Valinor, or simply let the Elves be in Middle-earth. They chose the middle course, when perhaps the should have chosen an extreme course (and I'm not really sure which extreme course would have been better).

Furthermore, it seems to me that, in the long run the Elves ought to have been invited to Valinor... but perhaps not before the First Age. Perhaps it would have been more appropriate to have invited the Elves west once they began to wane, once the Dominion of Men began and the shifting change of the world had begun to wear on the Elves. Although sad, from the perspective of the Men left behind, I don't think one can argue that it is unfair--in the Fourth Age--for the Elves to go West and find respite, given their vastly different natures, and the inevitable envy of the Doom of Men.

Perhaps, in that case, the mistake of the Valar was more in their timing than the nature of their summons--it pre-emptively changed the course of Elven development, sapping too much energy and population from Middle-earth, which needed their numbers and energy (note the shadowy existence of the Silvan and Avari Elves) and brought them to too sharp a point in Valinor (hence, among other things, their unrest and desire for lands to rule and make their own). If their was a "perfect" way for the Valar to act, I think the way of Melian in Doriath may not be such a bad case.

Of course, this ignores the Marring of Arda wrought by Morgoth, and is heavily counter-factual... but that gives the next responder plenty of grounds to build an alternative case.
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Old 10-28-2010, 04:10 PM   #4
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It was only wrong of the Valar because they did everything half-arsed. They left the Elves to their own devices on the long road West and lost thousands of them on the way, and then they ignored those that didn't make it. What, was it too big of a deal for an angelic immortal to hop back over the sea for some retrieval duty? Manwe couldn't have managed a couple weeks away from Varda to gather up the stragglers? Eonwe was supposedly a great hunter, couldn't he have gone back and rustled up the strays?

And then, of course, they did nothing when Morgoth skipped bail, and the Valar instead decided to punish the Elves (and by default, the Men and Dwarves) for the better part of an Age, only coming back when Earendil arrived sporting the Silmarils. BUT -- they did a half-arse job again and didn't rout out all Morgoth's minions, leaving Sauron alone to work his evil.

I give the Valar a failing grade in their guidance and protection roles
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