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Old 07-13-2018, 09:08 PM   #1
ArcusCalion
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Silmaril The Ring Sets Out

This is the first draft of the chapter The Ring Sets Out.

This chapter uses a thoroughly mixed bag of sources, so I mark every addition made to the text.

The markings are:
FY-HL-xx for all the headlines for the Fading Years.
RSO-SL-xx for all expansions and changes to the narrative.

Some conventions of my writing:

Bold Text = source information, comments and remarks
{example} = text that should be deleted
[example] = normalized text, normally only used for general changes, as well as changes which are a part of replacement that is not grammatical.
Underlined Text = text changed for grammatical reasons in the process of combining and inserting and removing.
<source example> = additions with source information
...... = This section of the paragraph is unchanged from the source.

Quote:
FY-HL-18 <THE RING SETS OUT>

RSO-SL-01 <LotR Prologue: Of the Ordering of the Shire There were many reports and complaints of strange persons and creatures prowling about the borders of the Shire, or over them: the first sign ..... And he still kept secret the ring that he had found.>
RSO-SL-02 <Letter to Milton Waldman
Eventually, Bilbo {is now}turned 111 years old - old age for a hobbit. [Footnote: The normal span of hobbits is represented as being roughly in the proportion of 100 to our 80.] He {has}had adopted as his heir his favorite kinsman of a younger generation, Frodo. He {is}was generally envied for his wealth and apparently unaging health; but {conversation between Bilbo and Gandalf reveals that} all {is}was not well with the old hobbit: he {is}was finding life 'thin' and wearisome. Gandalf {shows}began to have a certain anxious curiosity about his ring.{The introduction ends with the sudden disappearance in the midst of his own birthday-party of the Hobbit,} Then Bilbo /disappeared suddenly in the midst of his own 111th birthday party/, never to be seen in the Shire again. It {is}was his last use of the ring. Gandalf {induces}induced him to leave it behind with his heir, Frodo. All his other trophies of the old adventure he {takes}took with him, and {departs}departed to {an 'unknown destination' (but of course to} the House of Elrond and peaceful memory of the past{)}.
Some seventeen years {elapse}elapsed. Frodo {is now}was then of the age that Bilbo was when he went on his Quest. He also {preserves}preserved his youth, but {is}was afflicted with restlessness. Rumors of troubles in the great world outside {reach}reached the Hobbits, especially of the rise again of the Enemy or Dark Lord. Gandalf, after long absences on perilous journeys of search, {returns}returned and {reveals}revealed that Bilbo's ring {is}was The Ring, the One; and that the Enemy {is}was aware of its existence, and probably through the treachery of Gollum {knows}knew where it {is}was. {Something of the history of the Ring is sketched (mainly how it came into the 'accidental' keeping of Gollum).} Frodo {makes}made plans to fly in secret - to the House of Elrond. A tryst {is}was made for the autumn, but Gandalf {fails}failed to keep it RSO-SL-03 {[Footnote: It is later revealed that this is}This was owing to the treason of Saruman, chief wizard, who {attempts}attempted to imprison Gandalf and force him to join the Enemy party. {], and} Frodo and his hobbit-servant Sam and two younger kinsmen {go}went off alone into the wild - in the nick of time, just as the Black Riders of Mordor (the Nine Ring-slaves in disguise) {reach}reached the Shire.>
RSO-SL-04 <HR text B
{In version B it is noted that the}The Black Captain did not know whether the Ring was still in the Shire; that he had to find out. The Shire was too large for a violent onslaught RSO-SL-05 {such as he had made on the Stoors}; he must use as much stealth and as little terror as he could, and yet also guard the eastern borders. Therefore he sent RSO-SL-06 {some} <The Lord of the Rings Companion; Three is Company five> of the Riders into the Shire, with orders to disperse while traversing it; and of these Khamûl was to find Hobbiton, where ‘Baggins’ lived, according to Saruman's papers. RSO-SL-07 <The Lord of the Rings Companion; Three is Company {[}One{]} {keeps}kept to the east, passing northwards, towards the Marish, and the Bridge. {[}One{]} {takes}took road leading northwest to Michel Delving, and {[}another{]} {goes}went with him, but there {[?]fares}fared on and {traverses}traversed the North Farthing. {[}The other two{]} {go}went through the central Shire, until they {reach}reached the East Road, probably near the Three-Farthing Stone. ({[}These{]} were probably Khamûl and one of his companions, from Dol Guldur; and {[}Khamûl{]} {[is]}was the most ready of all (save {[}the Witch-King{]}) to perceive the presence of the Ring, but also the one whose power was most confused and diminished by sunlight). Drawn by the Ring {[}Khamûl{]} {goes}went to Hobbiton which he {reaches}reached at evening on {Fri. Sept.}Friday September 23rd. {[}His companion{]} {keeps}kept an eye on the East Road and Stock Road, lurking probably between the two, just south of Whitfurrows. {[}Khamûl{]} just {misses}missed Frodo, and misled by the {Gaffers [sic]}Gaffer {starts}started out east again.
{[}On 24 September he{]} {picks}picked up the Stock Road, and {overtakes}overtook Frodo at approaches to Woody End – probably by accident; he {becomes}became uneasily aware of the Ring but {is}was hesitant and uncertain because of the bright sun. He {turns}turned into the woods and {waits}waited for night.> RSO-SL-08 <The Lord of the Rings Companion; Three is Company After dark, becoming acutely aware of the Ring, {[}Khamûl{]} {goes}went in pursuit; but {is}was daunted by the sudden appearance of {the} Elves and {the}their song of Elbereth. While Frodo {is}was surrounded by the Elves he {cannot}could not perceive the Ring clearly.>
RSO-SL-09 <The Lord of the Rings Companion; Three is Company
As soon as the Elves {depart}departed {[}Khamûl{] renews}renewed his hunt, and reaching the ridge above Woodhall {is}was aware that the Ring {has}had been there. Failing to find the Bearer and feeling that he {is}was drawing away, he {summons [}summoned his companion{]} by cries. {[}He{] is}was aware of the general direction that the Ring {has}had taken, but not knowing of Frodo's rest in the wood, and believing him to have made straight eastwards, he and {[}his companion{] ride}rode over the fields. They {visit}visited Farmer Maggot while Frodo {is}was still under the trees. {[}Khamûl{]} then {makes}made a mistake (probably because he {imagines}imagined the Ringbearer as some mighty man, strong and swift): he {does}did not look near the farm, but {sends [}sent his companion{]} down the Causeway towards Overbourn, while he {goes}went north along it towards the Bridge. They {tryst}trysted to return and meet one another at night; but {do}did so just too late. Frodo {crosses}crossed by ferry just before {[}Khamûl{] arrives}arrived. {[}His companion{] joins}joined him soon after. {[}Khamûl{] is}was now well aware that the Ring {has}had crossed the river; but the river {is}was a barrier to his sense of its movement.> RSO-SL-10 <Lord of the Rings Companion; A Knife in the Dark Khamûl, alarmed at the escape of the Ring over the river on the night of 25 September, summoned the other four Riders who had entered the Shire.
The Nazgûl found one another easily, since they were quickly aware of a companion presence, and could hear the cries over great distances. They could see one another also from far away, even by day when to them a Nazgûl was the one clearly visible thing in a mist. As soon as he {has}had assembled his force (in the early morning of 26th, probably) {[}Khamûl{] leaves}left one to lurk near the Bridge and watch it; he {sends [}sent two{]} along the East Road, with orders to report to {[}the Witch-king{]} the eastward movement of the Ring; he himself with {[}his companion{] passes}passed secretly into Buckland by the north gate of that land. But desiring to attract as little notice as possible he (mistakenly and against Sauron's orders) {sacrifices}sacrificed speed to stealth. {[}The two sent east{] pass}passed along the East Road, and {visit}visited Bree and 'The Prancing Pony'. They then {go}went in search of {[}the Witch-king{]} but {cannot}could not at once find him {[}until 27th September. He{] is}was elated to learn that the Ring was really in the Shire, but {is}was alarmed and angry at its escape; and also by the fact that the Bearer must {now}then certainly {know}have known that he {is}was being hunted. (If he {is}was a person of power and knowledge he {may}might find out indeed how to use it, and compel a Nazgûl to leave him unmolested at the least. But {[}he {]is}was told that Khamûl{] has}had discovered that the Bearer {is}was a very small spiritless creature with no pride or will power, and {is}was filled with terror at the approach of a Ringwraith.)
{[}The Witch-king{] is}was uncertain what to do. The Bearer {seems}seemed to be making eastwards, he {is}was therefore surely bound for Rivendell (not the Havens). He would have naturally used the East Road; but {will}would he do so, now that he {knows}knew he {is}was pursued? Probably he {will}would attempt to escape from the Shire at some unexpected point, through the Old Forest and the Downs, and there make cross-country to strike the Road beyond Weathertop, maybe. In that direction {[}he{]} {now sends}then sent out {[}three Riders{]} separately, with orders to reassemble just east of Weathertop, and then return towards Bree along or near the Road. {[}He{]} himself, {[}with two other Riders{] redoubles}redoubled his vigilance on the east-borders along the Greenway - his counsels disturbed by threat of attack. Some of the Dúnedain {have}had met Elvish messengers, and {[}he{] is}was uneasily aware that many enemies {are}were watching him and though none {has}had yet come with power to challenge him. Meanwhile {[}Khamûl and his companion{] are}were searching Buckland, but {can}could do little except at night; and they {are}were at a loss, since the Buckland did not appear in Saruman's charts of the Shire at all. By good fortune they {do}did not discover the Hay-gate or become aware that the Ring {has}had departed. [Footnote: {In his unfinished index Tolkien says that} Hay-gate is {another name for the north gate. Perhaps here he is referring to} the gate through the High Hay into the Old Forest.] On 28 September they {find}found Crickhollow at night, but {do}did not attack though {[}Khamûl{] is}was aware that the Ring {has}had been, or {is}was still, there. {[}Khamûl{] ?lurks}lurked near, and {[}his companion{] is}was sent to bring {[}the rider left by the Bridge{]} and the horses. {Road}The road between Bridge and Bree {is}was thus left unwatched. {[}Early on 29 September Khamûl and the other two Riders{] come}came back to Crickhollow and {watch}watched it as night {passes}passed.>
RSO-SL-11 <Letter to Milton Waldman
Over all the 400 miles to Elrond {they are}the hobbits were pursued by the terror, and {are}were brought through only by the help of a strange man met in an inn, RSO-SL-12 known to some as Strider, whose true identity was <LotR Synopsis Aragorn the Ranger of Eriador>. His stature and power {are}were only slowly manifested.>
RSO-SL-13 <Lord of the Rings Companion; A Knife in the Dark
{the}The three Black Riders who had been sent to Weathertop and told to ride back along the Road reached Bree at dusk {[}on 29 September{]}, and soon {learn}learned from the Isengard spy of the RSO-SL-14 {events}stay of Frodo’s companions in the Inn, and {guess}guessed the presence of the Ring. One {is}was sent to the {[}Witch-king{]...}. {[}He{] is}was waylaid by Dúnedain and driven away {does}did not reach {[}the Witch-king{]} until the next day. {.. [}The other two{]} foiled in their attempt to capture RSO-SL-15 Frodo’s companion Merry {make}made plans for an attack on the Inn at night. {..} The Inn was attacked by the two Riders in early hours before dawn. Crickhollow was attacked at about the same time, {.... Both}but both attacks {fail}failed. {[}The two Riders in Bree{] go}went off in haste to find {[}the Witch-king{]} to report that Bearer {has}had gone (without waiting for further news). {[}The three from Crickhollow{] ride}rode down the Buckland Gate and {make}made also for Andrath [Footnote: Sindarin 'long climb', the defile between the Barrow-downs and the South Downs through which the North-South Road (Greenway) passed. {, Unfinished Tales, p. 418}]. The Nazgûl {are}were thus all assembled at Andrath. {[}The Witch-king{] is}was exceedingly wroth, and {feels}felt certain that the Bearer {has}had gone east from Bree. He {is}was not yet aware of the presence of Gandalf, and {does}did not learn anything of Aragorn beyond the report of the spy that 'a Ranger was in the Inn on the night of September 29'. {[}The Witch-king{] now plans}then planned his pursuit. He {sends}sent four Riders across country from Andrath to Weathertop. He himself with the other four {scour}scoured all round the borders from Sarn Ford to Bree at speed, but {can}could find out nothing, or feel any trace of the Ring. {[on}On 30 September{]} knowing {now}then that the Ring {has}had escaped East {[}they{] leave}left the Greenway and {take}took the East Road; soon after midnight they {ride}rode through Bree like a storm, casting down the gates.>
RSO-SL-16 <Lord of the Rings Companion; A Knife in the Dark
{on}On 2 October the four Black Riders who were sent ahead {assemble}assembled near Weathertop. {[}One{] remains [}remained while three {go}went on eastwards on or near the Road.{ . . .Oct.}On October 3{:}, Gandalf {reaches}reached Weathertop but {does}did not overtake the {[}Witch-king and other four Riders{]}; for they {become}became aware of his approach as he {overtakes}overtook them on Shadowfax, and {withdraw}withdrew into hiding beside the road. They {close}closed in behind. {[}The Witch-king{] is}was both pleased and puzzled. For a while he had been in great fear, thinking that by some means Gandalf had got possession of the Ring and was {now}then the Bearer; but as Gandalf {passes}passed he {is}was aware that Gandalf {has}had not got the Ring. What {is}was he pursuing? He himself must {be}have been after the escaping Bearer; and it must therefore somehow have gone on far ahead. But Gandalf {is}was a great power and enemy. He must be dealt with, and yet that {needs}needed great force.
{[}The five{] follow}followed Gandalf hotly to Weathertop. Since Gandalf {halts}halted there, {[}the Witch-King{] suspects}suspected that it {is}was a trysting place. Gandalf {is}was attacked by {[}the five plus the rider who had stayed near Weathertop{]} on Weathertop on {night 3-4}the night of October 3. Frodo and Aragorn {see}saw the light of the battle in the sky from their camp. {Oct.}On October 4{:}, Gandalf {repulses}repulsed the Nazgûl and {escapes}escaped northwards at Sun-rise, and {follows}followed the Hoarwell up towards the mountains. {[}Four Riders{] are}were sent in pursuit (mainly because {[}the Witch-king{] thinks}thought it possible he {may}might know of the whereabouts or course of the Bearer). But {[}the Witch-king and Khamûl{] remain}remained watching Weathertop. Thus they {become}became aware of the approach of Frodo on {Oct.}October 5. {[}The other three{] return}returned from East.>
RSO-SL-17 <Lord of the Rings Companion; A Knife in the Dark
{Oct.}On October 6{.}, Frodo {reaches}reached Weathertop observed by the Nazgûl. Aragorn {sees [}saw three Riders{]} coming back from a patrol of the Road west of Weathertop. The camp {is}was attacked at night by {[}five Riders{]}; but they {are}were driven off by Aragorn; and {withdraw}withdrew after wounding Frodo. {[}The Witch-king{] now knows}then knew who {is}was the Bearer, and {is}was greatly puzzled that it should be a small creature, and not Aragorn, who {seems}seemed to be a great power though apparently 'only a Ranger'. But the Bearer {has}had been marked with the Knife and (he {thinks}thought) {cannot}could not last more than a day or two.
It {is}was a strange thing that the camp was not watched while darkness lasted of the night {Oct. 6-7}of October 6, and the crossing of the Road into the southward lands {seems}seemed not to have been observed, so that {[}the Witch-king{]} again lost track of the Ring. For this there were probably several reasons, the least to be expected being the most important, namely that {[}the Witch-king{]}, the great captain, was actually dismayed. He had been shaken by the fire of Gandalf, and began to perceive that the mission on which Sauron had sent him was one of great peril to himself both by the way, and on his return to his Master (if unsuccessful); and he had been doing ill, so far achieving nothing save rousing the power of the Wise and directing them to the Ring. But above all the timid and terrified Bearer had resisted him, had dared to strike at him with an enchanted sword made by his own enemies long ago for his destruction. Narrowly it had missed him. How he had come by it - save in the Barrows of Cardolan. Then he was in some way mightier than the Barrow-wight; and he called on Elbereth, a name of terror to the Nazgûl. He was then in league with the High Elves of the Havens.
Escaping a wound that would have been as deadly to him as the Mordor knife to Frodo RSO-SL-18 {(as was proved at the end)}, he withdrew and hid for a while, out of doubt and fear both of Aragorn and especially of Frodo. But fear of Sauron, and the forces of Sauron's will was the stronger. {Oct.}On October 7 {. He}he arose and cried out to his companions, and drew {[}the other four{]} back to him. He then {patrols}patrolled the Road to the Bridge of Mitheithel, knowing that it was practically impossible to cross the Greyflood between Tharbad and the Bridge (while {[}the four Riders who pursued Gandalf{] are}were away north along the upper river). The Nazgûl {search}searched in vain for the Bearer while Aragorn {leads}led Frodo in the pathless lands south of the Road.>
RSO-SL-19 <Lord of the Rings Companion; Flight to the Ford
{Oct. 11:}On October 11, Glorfindel {reaches}reached the Bridge of Mitheithel and there {finds [}found three Riders, including Khamûl{]}. He {drives}drove them back well down the road, until they {leave}left it and {disperse}dispersed. (Thus Aragorn and Frodo {cross}crossed safely on {Oct.}October 13). Glorfindel {meets [}met the Witch-king and another Rider{]} coming east along the road, but {[}the Witch-king{] cannot}could not challenge him (especially by day) with so small help; he {flees}fled into the pathless lands. {Oct. 14: [These}On October 14, these five Riders{] reassemble}reassembled and {start}started in pursuit again. {[}The Witch-king and Khamûl{] perceive}perceived that Ring crossed Bridge but {lose}lost its trail, and {waste}wasted time hunting about. {Oct. 19: They become}On October 19, they became aware of the Ring not far ahead.>
RSO-SL-20 <Lord of the Rings Companion; Flight to the Ford
{on}On 20 October the four Riders who had pursued Gandalf {return}returned from the North, reaching the Fords of Bruinen, not long before Frodo {comes}came there, pursued by the other five. After the Witch-king {breaks}broke Frodo's sword, he, Khamûl, and possibly some others {dare}dared to ford the water - for he {is}was desperate, {knows}knowing that the Ring {is}was about to escape to Rivendell. But the water {overwhelms}overwhelmed him - and Aragorn and Glorfindel {drive}drove the others into River with fire.>
RSO-SL-21 <Lord of the Rings Companion; The Ring Goes South
Only the bodies of 8 horses were discovered; but also the raiment of the Captain. It is probable that the Captain took the one horse that remained (he may have had strength to withdraw it from the flood) and unclad, naked, invisible, rode as swift as he could back to Mordor. At swiftest he could not accomplish that (for his horse at least would need some food and rest, though he needed none) ere November had passed. The wrath and fear of Sauron then may be guessed; yet if there was any in the world in whom he trusted it was the Lord of Angmar; and if his wrath were lessened by perceiving that his great servant had been defeated by ill chance (and the craft of the Wise) rather than by faults of his own, his fear would be the more - seeing what power was yet in his Enemies, and how sharply fortune favored them at each turn when all seemed lost. Help no doubt was sent out to the other Ringwraiths as they made their way back, and they were bidden to remain secret again. It was no doubt at the end of 1418 that Sauron (likely aided by Angmar) bethought him of {the}their winged mounts; and yet withheld them, until things became almost desperate and he was forced to launch his war in haste.>
RSO-SL-22 <Return of the King: Synopsis {The first part, The Fellowship of the Ring, told how Gandalf the Grey discovered that the ring possessed by Frodo and the Hobbit was in fact the One Ring, ruler of all the Rings of Power. It recounted the flight of Frodo and his companions from the quiet Shire of their home, pursued by the terror of the Black Riders of Mordor, until at last, with the aid of Aragorn the Ranger of Eriador, they}Thus, Frodo and his companions came through desperate perils to the House of Elrond in Rivendell. RSO-SL-23 <Letter to Milton Waldman {The Second Book - which must, as explained before, begin with a pause, before a complete change of direction, after healing and refreshment and the gaining of wisdom - begins with the healing of}There, Frodo /was healed/, {the meeting of Frodo} and met Bilbo again.> There was held the great Council of Elrond, ..... Meriadoc and Peregrin, for the Hobbits; and Gandalf the Grey.
The Companions journeyed in secret .... Ring and still lusted for it, was following their trail.
It now became necessary for them .... Boromir attempted to seize the Ring by force. RSO-SL-24 {The first part ended with}There followed the fall of Boromir to the lure of the Ring; ..... seemed already overtaken by disaster.
RSO-SL-25 {The second part (Books Three and Four), The Two Towers, recounted}Among the deeds of all the company after the breaking of the Fellowship of the Ring {. Book Three told of}were the repentance and death of Boromir, and {of} his funeral in a boat committed to the Falls of Rauros; {of} the capture of Meriadoc and Peregrin by orc-soldiers, who bore them towards Isengard over the eastern plains of Rohan; and {of} their pursuit by Aragorn, Legolas, and Gimli.
The Rider of Rohan then appeared. A troop of horsemen, .... Tree-folk and their march on Isengard.
In the meanwhile Aragorn and his companions .... and rescued him from the spells of RSO-SL-26 [Gríma] Wormtongue, his evil counsellor, .... Wormtongue besieged in the indomitable tower of Orthanc.

FY-HL-19 The Battles of the Fords of Isen

RSO-SL-27 <BFI The chief obstacles to an easy conquest ..... achieving the death of Théodred.
It was clearly seen in Rohan, ..... before the arrival of Gandalf.
It has been said that the valor ..... underestimates its importance.
The Isen came down swiftly .... journey into Western Gondor.
Saruman's attack was not unforeseen, .... before it was fully prepared.
But Saruman had not revealed .... outflanking him upon the west.
He was extricated by the onset .... most eager of then-pursuers.
When Théodred gained the Fords ..... with the Uruks in pursuit.
As soon as the enemy ..... but for the coming of Elfhelm.
Elfhelm had been riding ..... ordered his companies to charge.
It was the turn of the Isengarders ..... and the other fell before Grimbold.
They stooped then to lift the body, ...... not know what might yet befall.
When after a cold and sleepless night ..... discovered whither the Uruks had gone.

So ended the First Battle .... and the invasion of Rohan began.
Erkenbrand did not at once himself ..... be their snare and not ours!’
Grimbold on the other hand ..... we are all gathered northwards.’
In the end Grimbold manned ..... before it could reach the Fords.
All went ill, as most likely ...... slopes to dislodge him; not yet.
Elfhelm had been unable to take ..... dreading what it might bring.
They did not have to wait ...... The shieldwall still held.
In vain Grimbold looked ..... though he might seem inglorious.
The night had been overcast ...... strength of wall and gate.
It was for this reason ...... he could only await the dawn.
What followed is less clear, ..... Grimbold's men he sent southward to join Erkenbrand.> RSO-SL-28 <editorial addition Thus they came to the Battle of the Hornburg in time to win the field.>
FY-HL-18: This headline seemed to fit this chapter best, since it describes the events of the narrative reasonably well. It comes from a rejected title for one of the books of LotR.

RSO-SL-01: This bit from the prologue sets the stage for the events of LotR, bringing us to the Shire and showing their perspective of what is going on in the outside world. Bilbo is brought back into our thoughts, and his situation is brought into the present. I know the end of the last chapter took place chronologically after this point, but I think this formation works best, even though there is a slight time overlap.

RSO-SL-02: Here we come to the events of LotR. The Synopsis of LotR contained in the front of Two Towers and Return of the King basically glosses over this entire portion of the narrative, picking up in detail only after the arrival in Rivendell. Therefore, I used the Letter to Milton Waldman to supplement it, since otherwise we would not adequately set up the characters. The letter is written in present tense and has several commentative bits, so I updated the tense to the past, and removed the more commentative sections.

RSO-SL-03: This is given as a footnote to the letter, but I think we should bring it into the main body of the text. This relates the events back to the previous chapter, where we saw Gandalf was captured by Saruman.

RSO-SL-04: This was given as HR-SL-15 in the last chapter. I think it fits much better here in this chapter now that Fin has added all the updates from The Reader's Companion.

RSO-SL-05: This was HR-SL-15.2.

RSO-SL-06: This was HR-SL-15.3.

RSO-SL-07: This was HR-SL-15.4.

RSO-SL-08: This is the next Hunt for the Ring bit from Lord of the Rings: A Reader's Companion. It picks up where 08 left off.

RSO-SL-09: This is the next Hunt for the Ring bit. It recounts the crossing of the Brandywine.

RSO-SL-10: This is the next Hunt for the Ring bit. It recounts the coming to Crickhollow.

RSO-SL-11: Here we return to the Letter to Milton Waldman. I placed this here so that we can introduce Aragorn into the story in the best way possible using these texts.

RSO-SL-12: This bit is structued somewhat oddly, but in the Letter, Tolkien never clarifies in his narrative summary who Strider is, so I pulled this bit from the LotR Synopsis and added in a clarifier. I hope this is not taking too much liberty, but I think this is the best way to combine the texts.

RSO-SL-13: Here we recount the events at Bree from the Black Riders' perspective.

RSO-SL-14: I changed the ambiguous 'events' to this more specific description, since we cannot go into too much detail without having to invent text wholecloth. I think this gets the job done.

RSO-SL-15: We have not mentioned Merry previously, so I introduced him here.

RSO-SL-16: This recounts the fight with Gandalf and the Ringwraiths on Weathertop.

RSO-SL-17: This recounts the attack on Weathertop and Frodo's wound and escape.

RSO-SL-18: I removed this reference to the Witch-king's death, since I think it is looking forward too much.

RSO-SL-19: Here Glorfindel enters the story and protects the Last Bridge.

RSO-SL-20: Here we have the altercation at the Fords of Bruinen, and the defeat of the Nazgul.

RSO-SL-21: This bit describes their movements after their demise.

RSO-SL-22: Here we come to the narrative of the LotR Synopsis. The tenses are right for much of this, and there is only a mild reference to the LotR text which I removed.

RSO-SL-23: Here I inserted a small sentence from the Letter to Milton Waldman simply to say that Frodo was healed, so that we dont leave it as an unresolved plot point.

RSO-SL-24: I removed a comment referring to the text of LotR in an external context.

RSO-SL-25: I removed a comment referring to the text of LotR in an external context.

RSO-SL-26: Since we discuss Grima in the Battles of the Fords text by name, but the Synopsis only refers to him as Wormtongue, I figured we should add his name in order to make everything clear to the reader that he is the same person.

FY-HL-19: Here we have the Battles of the Fords title. We could discuss making this a separate chapter, as its subject matter does not really fit under the header The Ring Sets Out.

RSO-SL-27: Here we insert the Battles text. I found nothing to change in this entire text, but I could have missed something. As it is, the place I inserted it in the narrative is after the mention of the battle of Helm's Deep, but I think that is important in order to understand the references of the text.

RSO-SL-28: This editorial addition is not sourced from any text, but I think we need it in order to explain the relevance of the text to the plot of LotR. Perhaps it is too much liberty.

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Old 07-17-2018, 01:33 PM   #2
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First of all: ArcusCalion I appreciate the hard work you put into this chaper very much. It is really nicely edited even so I have a few points of critisem, the overall feedback I would like to give is: very good!

To emphasis this farther see that I have only one small point of critisem for the editing in special, the rest is more general or structural. I know my own work how very hard it is to keep structural or general points in mind while editing.

I start with some global points of the structure:
As first remark: In a pseudo historical point of view the ‘War of the Ring’ began with the synchronized attaks on Thranduil’s realm (to catch back Gollum) and Osgiliath (to allow the Nazgûl to cross Anduin). Thus all the actions in the last and in this chapter are actually part of the War of the Ring. If we find that useful we could therefor take ‘The War of the Ring’ as an over title including everything beginning with ‘The Hunt for the Ring’ or even earlier (see below).
Some of the actions described are not very much warlike, and thus we might us the title ‘The War of the Ring’ in smaller sense, as you, ArcusCalion, did, but at least for The Battles of the Fords of Isen we should consider to move them to that next chapter.

Second remark: Bilbo’s birthday party and disappearance can not be told here, in the middle of the actual hunt for the Ring! I think we should separate RSO-SL-01 & the first paragraph of RSO-SL-02 (named in that new position RSO-SL-01.5) and put them before TS-SL-14. Together I would then separate these from The Tale of Aragorn and Arwen into a chapter of its own headed The Shadow Grows. If we do so we must edit the beginning of the second paragraph of RSO-SL-02 a bit different (see below under HR-SL-01.5).

One last point of structural critisem: The Hunt for the Ring ended with the defeat of the Nazgûl in the Battle of the Ford of Bruinen. And not when Frodo set out from Hobbiton. I could agree to an inclusion of a bit more like the results of the search after the battle and the return of the Witch-king to Mordor and the following creation of the winged creatures for the Nazgûl. Thus I propose to integreat the part of this chapter up to RSO-SL-21 under the sub-heading The Ring sets out under the last chapter The Hunt for the Ring, where we might use the following sub-heading for the first part: Of the Journey of the Black Riders according to the account that Gandalf gave to Frodo
To make the transition between the to parts work better, I would then shift a part of RSO-SL-02 under the new marker HR-SL-01.5 to the beginning of that chapter and edit the rest a bit different:
Quote:

FY-HL-17<
The Hunt for the Ring
>HR-SL-01<ORP Now by fortune and his vigilance Mithrandir first learned of the Ring, ere Sauron had news of it; yet he was dismayed and in doubt. For too great was the evil power of this thing for any of the Wise to wield, unless like Curunír he wished himself to become a tyrant and a dark lord in his turn; but neither could it be concealed from Sauron forever, nor could it be unmade by the craft of the Elves. Therefore with the help of the Dúnedain of the North Mithrandir set a watch upon the land of the Periannath and bided his time. But Sauron had many ears, and soon he heard rumor of the One Ring, which above all things he desired, and he sent forth the Nazgûl to take it.>
HR-SL-01.5<Letter to Milton Waldman Some seventeen years {elapse}elapsed after Bilbo’s departure. Frodo {is now}was then of the age that Bilbo was when he went on his Quest. He also {preserves}preserved his youth, but {is}was afflicted with restlessness. Rumors of troubles in the great world outside {reach}reached the Hobbits, especially of the rise again of the Enemy or Dark Lord. Gandalf, after long absences on perilous journeys of search, {returns}returned and {reveals}revealed that Bilbo's ring {is}was The Ring, the One; and that the Enemy {is}was aware of its existence, and probably through the treachery of Gollum {knows}knew where it {is}was. {Something of the history of the Ring is sketched (mainly how it came into the 'accidental' keeping of Gollum). }Frodo {makes}made plans to fly in secret - to the House of Elrond. A tryst {is}was made for the autumn, but Gandalf {fails}failed to keep it RSO-SL-03{[Footnote to the text: It is later revealed that this is}This was owing to the treason of Saruman, chief wizard, who {attempts}attempted to imprison Gandalf and force him to join the Enemy party. {], and Frodo and his hobbit-servant Sam and two younger kinsmen go off alone into the wild - in the nick of time, just as the Black Riders of Mordor (the Nine Ring-slaves in disguise) reach the Shire.}>FY-HL-17.5<
Of the Journey of the Black Riders according to the account that Gandalf gave to Frodo
>HR-SL-02<HR text A Gollum was captured in Mordor in the year 3017 and taken to Barad-dûr, …



… This proves a main error, though in fact it was nearly successful, since the Barrowwights {are}were roused, and all things of evil spirit, hostile to Elves and Men, {are}were on the watch with malice in the Old Forest and on the {Barrowdowns}[Barrow-downs]. {[}The other three Black Riders{]} are left to guard the eastern borders, to watch Greenway, and guard against Elves or Dúnedain coming from eastwards.>FY-HL-18b<
The Ring Set Out
>RSO-SL-02b<Letter to Milton Waldman {A tryst is made for the autumn, but}As Gandalf {fails}failed to keep {it}the tryst for autumn RSO-SL-03{[Footnote to the text: It is later revealed that this is owing to the treason of Saruman, chief wizard, who attempts to imprison Gandalf and force him to join the Enemy party. ]},{ and} Frodo and his hobbit-servant Sam and two younger kinsmen {go}went off alone into the wild - in the nick of time, just as the Black Riders of Mordor (the Nine Ring-slaves in disguise) {reach}reached the Shire.>
RSO-SL-04<HR text B{In version B it is noted that the}The Black Captain did not know whether the Ring was still in the Shire; that he had to find out. …

If we do follow my above suggestions, what is left is only RSO-SL-22 to RSO-SL-26. As that is very short I suggest to take it up as a sub-chapter under the heading The Ring in the Shadow in to the chapter The War of the Ring.

The one single point about special editing: I think ArcusCalion missed a necessary ‘outline expansion at the end of RSO-SL-21. The text tells that Sauron was aided in the creation of the winged mounts by ‘Angmar’. Since Angmar is realy a country and not a person, Thsi is JRR Tolkiens short hand for ‘the Lord of Angmar’ as he wrote a few sentence before. I think we must expand the name.

A few general remarks:
- It seems we have now two spellings ‘Barrow-downs’ and ‘Barrowdowns’. In LotR alway the spelling with the hyphen was used, So I think we should take that up as a general change.
- Numbers (especially the date of the days in the Month): We have in our text three spellings: e.g. ‘23’; ‘23rd’ and ‘twentythird’. If you add the article ‘the’ employed or not, the variation becomes even grater. As he did for (low) numbers, Tolkin never used numeric characters in his texts for dates. Even with high numbers he went through some painsticing variations to avoid numeric characters. Even so it is a lot of work, since we have a lot of such numerical characters; I think we should replace them and standardise our spelling with the ‘the’ included if the date is after the Months and ‘of’ if the date is given before the Month.

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Old 07-17-2018, 03:02 PM   #3
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Thank you for the kudos Fin, much appreciated.

I must admit I am somewhat confused by your structuring changes. This is how it seems to me that you wish to have the last chapters laid out:
Quote:
The War of the Ring
- The Shadow Grows
- The Hunt for the Ring
-- Of the Journey of the Black Rider According to the Account that Gandalf Gave to Frodo
-- The Ring Sets Out
- The Ring in Shadow
- The Battles of the Fords of Isen
The End of the Third Age
I see why you propose some of these, but some are confusing to me. I will go through them one at a time.

Overall Structure Notes: You are right that the events in these chapters may be termed as part of the War of the Ring. However, I did not put them under a single heading for two reasons: 1) This leaves us with no title for the events of Return of the King, which, I think, above all other divisions need their own title. 2) In the narrative Synopsis of the events of the story we have this quote from Tolkien:
Quote:
Even as they reached the Cross-roads and took the path to the ghastly city of Minas Morgul, a great darkness issued from Mordor, covering all the lands. Then Sauron sent forth his first army, led by the black King of the Ringwraiths: the War of the Ring had begun.
This puts the official start of the War of the Ring midway through the events of the Two Towers, so I think we are justified in referring to the last battles as the War of the Ring proper, while the other buildup was more of the kindling that lit the fire. I know this is a subject for debate, but I think it is more important to have a title for the Return of the King events, and so I would really prefer to keep The War of the Ring as the title for the next chapter. That being, said I am open to some restructuring possibilities. I am open to moving the events from RSO-SL-22 to the end into the next chapter, which would mean moving the subheading The Battles of the Fords of Isen to the next chapter as well.

Second Remark: I agree to the movement of the texts in this way, aside from two things. 1) I think they would be better placed after TS-SL-14, since Bilbo's party happened long after the births of Faramir and Boromir, and placing it before they're mentioned gives the impression that the opposite is true, and that at the time of the War of the Ring they would only be around 17 years old! 2) I do not agree to the creation of a new chapter, or of the heading The Shadow Grows. I am unsure where this heading comes from, but it seems to me to be unsourced, which we must avoid at all costs. Therefore, I think to simply leave the text at the end of The Tale of Aragorn and Arwen is fine. We have a long history in the project of including events inside chapters and stories where they are not necessarily immediately relevant to the title name, but I think it is ok to do so. If you think we absolutely cannot leave them in The Tale of Aragorn and Arwen, then we should move them to the very beginning of The Hunt for the Ring.
Sidenote: the slightly different editing of HR-SL-01.5 looks good, but it should say 'had elapsed.'

Last Point of Structural Criticism: This looks perfect Fin, and I was actually thinking it should have been structured better, so thank you. I only have one comment, which is that I would prefer the first subheading to simply be Of the Journey of the Black Riders, as the full title seems needlessly long, perhaps the second part (According to the Account Gandalf Gave to Frodo) can be placed underneath the subheading, but I suppose any option is fine really, just an aesthetic preference.

Fin's Ending Comments: I do not think we need the subheading The Ring in Shadow, as The Ring Sets Out still applies. I am also not sure where this title comes from, so I think it is best to leave it out.
As to the comment about expanding the outline reference to Angmar, I agree.

I see your point about dates, and I agree. Would you like to go through your copies to make sure the dates are all in order? I will do the same with mine.

P.S. As a summary, I think this is the best final structure:
Quote:
- The Tale of Aragorn and Arwen
- The Hunt for the Ring
-- Of the Journey of the Black Riders
-- The Ring Sets Out
- The Treason of Isengard
-- The Battles of the Fords of Isen
- The War of the Ring
- The End of the Third Age
(See the next post for the Treason of Isengard chapter)

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Old 07-17-2018, 03:18 PM   #4
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I just had an idea: What if from RSO-SL-22 through to just before the Battle of the Pelennor Fields could be its own chapter called The Treason of Isengard, since the vast bulk of the chapter will be made up of The Battles of the Fords of Isen, as well as the events of the LotR Synopsis that deal with The Two Towers and Saruman's treachery. I think this would work best, and allow us to use The War of the Ring for the events of Return of the King, and allow us to keep The End of the Third Age as the chapter that tells of the aftermath.

Edit: The chapter heading would be FY-HL-18.5. The chapter would basically consist of all the material displaced from this chapter, with this small addition at the end:
Quote:
TI-SL-01 <LotR Synopsis In the parley before the door Saruman refused to repent, and Gandalf deposed him and broke his staff, leaving him to the vigilance of the Ents. From a high tower Wormtongue hurled a stone at Gandalf; but it missed him, and it was picked up by Peregrin. This proved to be one of the three surviving palantíri, the Seeing Stones of Númenor. Later at night Peregrin succumbed to the lure of the Stone; he stole it and looked in it, and so was revealed to Sauron. TI-SL-02 {The book ended with the coming of a}A Nazgûl came over the plains of Rohan, a Ringwraith mounted on a flying steed, presage of imminent war. Gandalf delivered the palantír to Aragorn, and taking Peregrin rode away to Minas Tirith.>
The next chapter, The War of the Ring, would thus open with the journey of Frodo and Sam to Mordor. Thoughts?

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Old 07-18-2018, 05:10 PM   #5
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Sorry for being not clear enough. I mentioned the possibility of using The War of the Ring as overall title just as OPTION.
I fully agree to keep The War of the Ring as title for the next chapter!

RSO-SL-01 & RSO-SL-01.5 after TS-SL-14: Agree. This arangment makes much more sense. But I obsereved that we have to change HR-SL-01 slightly:[quote] HR-SL-01<ORP Now by fortune and his vigilance Mithrandir had first learned of the Ring, ere Sauron had news of it; ...[/b]

The Shadow Grows, The Ring in the Shadow and The War of the Ring or The Return of the King wer the first idea for titles of three volumes of the LotR. It is recorded in Letters; 136. The next stage in the development from Letters, 137 & 139 was The Return of the Shadow, The Shadow Lengthens and The Return of the King. In Letters; 140 we came near to the final with The Fellowship of the Ring, The Two Towers and [/b]The War of the Ring[/b]. The Discussion was settled in the end mutal between Rayner Unwin and JRR Tolkien on The Fellowship of the Ring, The Two Towers and The Return of the King.

That means the title have a source in JRR Tolkien. Nonetheless we can discuss if we should creat this very short chapter, or take it with or without a sub-chapter heading into one of the others. If you don’t like the short separate chapter I would leave TS-SL-14 at the end of The Tale of Aragorn and Arwen and take RSO-SL-01 & RSO-SL-01.5 at the beginning of The Hunt for the Ring, boith without sub-heading.

HR-SL-01.5: Agreed.

FY-HL-17.5: Since at least in my format ]Of the Journey of the Black Riders according to the account that Gandalf gave to Frodo does anyhow occupy 2 lines we are free to place the line break behind ‘Black Riders’. But I would shy back from using brakets. I see no reason allowed by our rules for this insertion.

FY-HL-18.5: I could agree to use the title The Treason of Isengard here for that part of the story you named. But we might need that title else where (see below). Anyhow I would keep the (sub-) heading The Ring in the Shadow for the first part. A sub-heading does not have any relevance in the next chapter, so [i]The Ring Sets Out[/b] can no longer ‘apply’. I think we would in this case need a third sub-heading or must at least separate the last part about the Battle of the Hornburg and the parley at Orthanc. For this The Treason of Isengard is also a well fitting candiadat. And I found no other. Any idea?
Anyhow I think we miss something. Is there nothing to fill the gape between ‘Grimbold's men he sent southward to join Erkenbrand.> RSO-SL-28<editorial addition Thus they came to the Battle of the Hornburg in time to win the field.>’ and ‘TI-SL-01<LotR Synopsis In the parley before the door Saruman refused to repent, and Gandalf deposed him and broke his staff, leaving him to the vigilance of the Ents.’?

To be more clear then last time, here the structure I anvision, with some remarks in breakets what is included:
Quote:
- The Tale of Aragorn and Arwen (ending with the death of Aragorn’s mother)
- The Shadow Grows (Giving the Info about Denethor and his sons and of Bilbo leaving the shire.)
- The Hunt for the Ring (HR-SL-01 & HR-SL-01.5)
-- Of the Journey of the Black Riders
according to the account that Gandalf gave to Frodo
(From Mordor to the Shire)
-- The Ring Set Out (From the shire to Rivendell)
- The Treason of Isengard
-- The Ring in the Shadow (The journey of the Fellowship to Rauros and then farther on to Rohan)
-- The Battles of the Fords of Isen (similar as in UT)
-- * * * (The Battle of Hornburg and the parley at Orthanc)
The War of the Ring
The End of the Third Age
About dates: Okay, I will make the changes in my working copy.

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Old 07-18-2018, 07:30 PM   #6
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Some good notes Fin! Sorry I was confused.

RSO-SL-01, RSO-SL-01.5, and TS-SL-14: I am glad you agree to the shift, and now that I know that the title has a Tolkien source, I agree to use it, but I think it would be better as a subheading in the chapter The Tale of Aragorn and Arwen. If you think we should then put the RSO additions into the beginning of The Hunt for the Ring then I agree, and I agree to the change to HR-SL-01 if that is the structure you prefer, but personally I am fine with leaving them all under the subheading in The Tale of Aragorn and Arwen.

FY-HL-17.5: I did not mean the brackets would be included in the text, they were just for clarification of my comment. That part of the title would just be in the second line, perhaps in smaller font.

FY-HL-18.5: I see your structure and I think it is a good idea. However, I think a better title would be The Shadow Lengthens instead of The Ring in the Shadow, since that title refers to the journey of Frodo and Sam. We could use that subheading in the next chapter.

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Old 07-19-2018, 04:21 PM   #7
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RSO-SL-01, RSO-SL-01.5 and TS-SL-14: I am also okay with keeping these together under a sub-heading within The Tale of Aragorn and Arwen.

FY-HL-16.5 and FY-HL-21: I can understand your desire to use The Ring in the Shadow in a later place. I have no problem to use both The Shadow Grows and The Shadow Lengthens, but I would switch these. For me, but that is of course a bit personal feeling, ‘Grows’ is ‘stronger’ more menaceing verb, while ‘Lengthens’ is less threatening, since it is more natural: If the sun goes down every shadow will lengthen, so the object that does creat the shadow has still the same size. But if the shadow grows, the assumption is that the object casting the shadow grows.
To be clear I would use FY-HL-16.5c The Shadow Lengthens for ‘Giving the account of Denethor and his sons and of Bilbo leaving the shire’ in the chapter The Tale of Aragorn and Arwen and FY-HL-21b The Shadow Grows for ‘The journey of the Fellowship to Rauros and then farther on to Rohan’ in the chapter The Treason of Isengard.

FY-HL-17.5: I don’t see the smaller font, but we could repress it from going into the contents.

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Old 07-19-2018, 04:48 PM   #8
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FY-HL-16.5/21: Agreed, this makes sense.

FY-HL-17.5: Yeah this is a small matter, we don't need to spend time on it. We are essentially in enough agreement to move forward.

I must say, the structuring changes of the past few chapters have been crazy, but the final result is sooo much better than any of the original ideas, so thank you Fin!
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Old 07-23-2018, 04:56 PM   #9
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As I said before I am not happy with the Battle oft he Hornburg not descript after a long account oft he battle oft he ords of Isen. But as I did not find any material to work with (since it is not given, Christopher Tolkien concentrats on the drafts that show differences and leaves out all drafts that are similar to the later story in his treatmeant of the Helm’ Deep) we can not amand that point. Therefore I think the supposed sub-headline ‘* * *’ is unnecessary. But nonetheless I would like to change the agaranment of the text’s slightly:
Quote:
RSO-SL-25{The second part (Books Three and Four), The Two Towers, recounted}Among the deeds of all the company after the breaking of the Fellowship ...
...
...
...
... With him they rode over Rohan to the halls of King Théoden of the Mark, where Gandalf healed the aged king, and rescued him from the spells of RSO-SL-26<editorial addition Gríma> Wormtongue, his evil counsellor, secret ally of Saruman. They rode then with the king and his host against the forces of Isengard{, and took part in the desperate victory of the Hornburg}.>FY-HL-19b<
The Battles of the Fords of Isen
>RSO-SL-27<BFI The chief obstacles to an easy conquest of Rohan by Saruman were Théodred and Éomer ...
...
...
...
What followed is less clear, since only Gandalf had full knowledge of it. He received news of the disaster only in the late afternoon of March the {3rd}third. RSO-SL-27.5<based on LotR, Appendix B By this time was Erkenbrand defeated.> RSO-SL-27.7<based on UT; The Drúedain; Note 13 So he <moved from below had{ been} driven away southwards parts<moved from below of Saruman’s forces>{A marginal jotting states that after}. After the Battle of the Fords of Isen it was found that many Drúedain did indeed survive in the Drúwaith Iaur, for they came forth from the caves where they dwelt to attack remnants of Saruman's forces that had been driven away southwards.> {The}In the late afternoon of March the third the King was{ then} at a point not far east of the junction of the Road with the branch going to the Hornburg. From there it was about ninety miles in a direct line to Isengard; and Gandalf must have ridden there with the greatest speed that Shadowfax could command. He reached Isengard in the early darkness, [Footnote to the text: As the narrative suggests, Gandalf must already have made contact with Treebeard, and knew that the patience of the Ents was at an end; and he had also read the meaning of Legolas' words: Isengard was veiled in an impenetrable shadow, the Ents had already surrounded it.] and left again in no more than twenty minutes. Both on the outward journey, when his direct route would take him close to the Fords, and on his return south to find Erkenbrand, he must have met Grimbold and Elfhelm. They were convinced that he was acting for the King, not only by his appearance on Shadowfax, but also by his knowledge of the name of the errand-rider, Ceorl, and the message that he brought; and they took as orders the advice that he gave. Grimbold's men he sent southward to join Erkenbrand.> RSO-SL-28<editorial addition Thus they came to the Battle of the Hornburg in time to win the field.>
RSO-SL-28.5<Letter to Milton Waldman{They roder then}Aragorn, Gimli and Legolas with the king and his host{ against the forces of Isengard, and} took part in the desperate victory of the Hornburg Hornburg <moved from above against the forces of Isengard>. Gandalf then led them to Isengard, and they found the great fortress in ruins by the Tree-folk, and Saruman and Wormtongue besieged in the indomitable tower of Orthanc.>
TI-SL-01<LotR Synopsis In the parley before the door Saruman refused to repent, ...
I added RSO-SL-27.5 and RSO-SL-27.7 as these make more clear what happend in the Second Battle of the Fords of Isen, and moved the complet text of The Battels of the Fords of Isen a bit to collect the few mentions we have of the Battle of the Hornburg.

As all that is left of the Appendices that ArcusCalion had planed is only The Marshals of the Mark I wonder if we should not give this text here as an Appendix to this chapter.

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Old 07-23-2018, 09:25 PM   #10
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I agree to these changes, very nicely done!
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Old 07-24-2018, 03:02 PM   #11
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What about The Marshals of the Mark?

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Old 07-24-2018, 03:16 PM   #12
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You said in your comments in the outline thread that it would be better moved to Volume 3 to stand next to such things as The Sources of the Legend of Isildur's Death, The Istari and The Rivers and Beacon Hills of Gondor. I think that is the better placement.
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Old 07-24-2018, 05:39 PM   #13
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Okay.

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Old 02-01-2019, 07:54 AM   #14
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I just wanted to say that I think the restructuring decision works really well. Having two separate chapters "The Hunt for the Ring" (which includes "The Rings Sets Out") and "The Treason Of Isengard" makes the most sense. I will include my comments on "The Ring Sets Out" in "The Hunt for the Ring" thread where the material ultimately ended up.
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Old 02-03-2019, 02:50 PM   #15
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Here are my comments on the Treason of Isengard chapter:

1) This is my attempt at including a resolution for Balin:

Quote:
The Companions journeyed in secret far from Rivendell in the North, until baffled in their attempt to cross the high pass of Caradhras in winter, they were led by Gandalf through the hidden gate and entered into the vast Mines of Moria, seeking a way underneath the mountains. RSO-SL-23.1 <Treason of Isengard; Mines of Moria (2): The Bridge The Company of the Ring {stood some time in silence beside} found the tomb of Balin. RSO-SL-23.2 <Tale of Years Balin had perishe{s}d, and the dwarf-colony {is}was destroyed.> RSO-SL-23.3 <Return of the Shadow; The Mines of Moria They {are}were pursued by goblins and {a B[lack] R[ider] [written above:} a Balrog{]} after escaping from Balin's Tomb - they {come}came to a bridge of slender stone over a gulf.> There Gandalf, in battle with {a}the dreadful spirit of the underworld, fell into a dark abyss...
Admittedly not the smoothest, but it's the best I could come up with. Let me know if you guys find anything better.

2)
Quote:
Footnote: The Ents are here left out of account, as they were by all save Gandalf. But unless Gandalf could have brought about the rising of the Ents several days earlier (as from the narrative was plainly not possible), it would not have saved Rohan.
I think "the narrative" is referring to the published Lord of the Rings and feels awkward here. I propose we change it to:

Quote:
Footnote: The Ents are here left out of account, as they were by all save Gandalf. But unless Gandalf could have brought about the rising of the Ents several days earlier (as RSO-SL-27.1 {from the narrative} was plainly not possible), it would not have saved Rohan.
There is another instance of this later on:

Quote:
Footnote: As the narrative suggests, Gandalf must already have made contact with Treebeard
I say we remove the reference to "the narrative":

Quote:
RSO-SL-27.8 {As the narrative suggests}, Gandalf must already have made contact with Treebeard
3)
Quote:
What followed is less clear, since only Gandalf had full knowledge of it. He received news of the disaster only in the late afternoon of March the 3rd. RSO-SL-27.5 <based on LotR, Appendix B By this time Erkenbrand had been defeated.> RSO-SL-27.7 <based on UT; The Drúedain; Note 13 So he <moved from below had {been} driven away southwards parts <moved from below of Saruman’s forces>{A marginal jotting states that after}. After the Battle of the Fords of Isen it was found that many Drúedain did indeed survive in the Drúwaith Iaur, for they came forth from the caves where they dwelt to attack remnants of Saruman's forces that had been driven away southwards.>
I have a question about "So he had driven away southwards..." Is this referring to Gandalf? It comes immediately after a statement about Erkenbrand. If it's Gandalf, I think we should make it clear. Also, the phrase "So he had driven away" sounds awkward to my ears. I propose:

Quote:
RSO-SL-27.7b <based on UT; The Drúedain; Note 13 So {he}Gandalf <moved from below {had been driven}drove away southwards parts <moved from below of Saruman’s forces>{A marginal jotting states that after}. After the Battle of the Fords of Isen it was found that many Drúedain did indeed survive in the Drúwaith Iaur, for they came forth from the caves where they dwelt to attack the remnants of Saruman's forces that had been driven away southwards.>
I also added a "the" to the second reference to the remnants of Saruman's forces.

4) I only found one typo:

Quote:
and the loyalty of Théodred and Éomer remained steadfast, even in his apparent dotage,
There should be a period instead of comma after dotage.
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Old 02-03-2019, 06:20 PM   #16
ArcusCalion
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1) Agreed.

2) Agreed.

3) I am unsure of the meaning of this as well. Fin, what did you intend by it?

4) Nice catch.
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Old 02-04-2019, 04:07 PM   #17
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1) That is okay for me.

2) RSO-SL-27.1: I am okay with removal in the first foot note.
RSO-SL-27.8: But I am more reluctant in the second instance: ‘As the narrative suggests’ can as well mean the text at hand. So I think it is ambiguous enough to be keept.

3) RSO-SL-27.7: First the intended meaning: Gandalf is not active in the Battle of the Fords of Isen. He is only mentioned as the one who got a full report of the events. Therefore it is Erkenbrand who was defeated, but nonetheless drove away southwards part of Sarumans forces. That is way I am as well not in full support of the added ‘the’ in the next sentence. As the battle was a defeat for the forces of the Westfold led by Erkenbrand, the ‘remnants of Saruman’s force’ can only be a fraction of that force and all that isleft of it, as the ‘the’ does suggest.
Lets see how we can reconstruct what we know about that last part of the Second Battle of the Fords of Isen: Elfhelm and his riders were driven away eastward in the Second Battle. Grimbold and his man were scatter and moved south on the eastside of the road to Helm’s Deep. Erkenbrand was on the road hastening to the Ford. Saruman’s Eastern force had already passed south cross country, while Saruman’s Western force was on the Road from the Ford to Helm’s Deep.
From that picture we can assume that the last part of the Second Battle was fought only between Erkenbrand and the western forces of Saruman. In the end Erkenbrand was defeated fast, but he drove of part of Saruman’s forces to the south (meaning clearly the Land between Isen and Ered Nimrais, so that it is rather southwest and anyhow west of the road) and his own trops remained intact.
We are farther told that Gandalf meet Elfhelm and Grimbold on his way to and for Isengard, which must mean that Elfhelm drifted back westward when the Eastern forces of Saruman had passed to the south and that Grimbold did not find Erkenbrand before that last part of the Battle was joined. In the end we see Gandalf, Erkenbrand and Grimbold coming together to the rescue of Helm’s Deep, while Elfhelm guarded the Fords of Isen. I asume that Gandalf found an united the forces of Grimbold and Erkenbrand on his return from Isengard.
So what about this editing:
Quote:
What followed is less clear, since only Gandalf had full knowledge of it. He received news of the disaster only in the late afternoon of March the {3rd}third. RSO-SL-27.5<based on LotR, Appendix B By this time was Erkenbrand defeated{.}> RSO-SL-27.7<based on UT; The Drúedain; Note 13 , even so he <moved from below had{ been} driven away southwards parts<moved from below of Saruman’s forces>{A marginal jotting states that after}. After the Battle of the Fords of Isen it was found that many Drúedain did indeed survive in the Drúwaith Iaur, for they came forth from the caves where they dwelt to attack remnants of Saruman's forces that had been driven away southwards.> ...
4) Thanks for pointing us to it.

Respectfully
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Old 02-04-2019, 05:43 PM   #18
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2) OK, keeping the second "narrative" is fine with me.

3) Thanks for the explanation, Fin. I like the addition of "even" to make it "even so" but grammatically I think it needs to be a new sentence:

Quote:
RSO-SL-27.5<based on LotR, Appendix B By this time was Erkenbrand defeated.> RSO-SL-27.7<based on UT; The Drúedain; Note 13 Even so he <moved from below had{ been} driven away southwards parts<moved from below of Saruman’s forces>
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Old 02-05-2019, 11:52 AM   #19
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These changes are wonderful, agreed to both.
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Old 02-08-2019, 07:46 PM   #20
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There is a small part in the "End of the Third Age" chapter which I think fits better here:

Quote:
There was held the great Council of Elrond, at which it was ETA-SL-03.9b <UT Sources of the Legend of Isildur’s Death {Long afterwards, as the Third Age of the Elvish World waned and the War of the Ring approached, it was} revealed {to the Council of Elrond} that the Ring had been found, sunk near the edge of the Gladden Fields and close to the western bank; though no trace of Isildur's body was ever discovered. They were also then aware that Saruman had been secretly searching in the same region; but though he had not found the Ring (which had long before been carried off), they did not yet know what else he might have discovered.> It was decided to attempt the destruction of the Ring, and Frodo was appointed the Ring-bearer.
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Old 02-08-2019, 10:14 PM   #21
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This works well, I agree to it. This should be marked RSO-SL-23.5 however because it is an addition to this chapter, even if it was earlier placed elsewhere.
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