20 Questions on ME - Page 165 - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Galadriel55 · 06-11-2011, 01:49 PM

Spears, spears...

The javelin that Eol threw at Aredhel?

Mithalwen · 06-11-2011, 02:11 PM

Yay!!!! Correct All yours... and thanks re the sig... I heard it recently and it amused me.

Galadriel55 · 06-11-2011, 02:20 PM

Ok, I have something...

I never really got the difference between spears and javelins, except that spears tend to be big, and javelins vary dramatically in size...

That's a nice siggy, with many ways to twist it. Like, how did the chicken get to the other side if it didn't cross anything?

Mithalwen · 06-11-2011, 03:05 PM

Well it did cross something... it was just it got back to the starting point Isuppose.

Well I know that the Australian Koories use throwing spears for hunting but I assumed a javelin was more like those used in modern field athletics and was thrown whereas a spear you might well hang onto - especially as a weapon rather than a hunting instrument. I can't imagine a javelin being the most useful thing for war since in that situation it is single use and a bow can be fired more economically.

Anyway

Person?

Galadriel55 · 06-11-2011, 03:11 PM

Person - no

LadyBrooke · 06-11-2011, 03:16 PM

Object?

Galadriel55 · 06-11-2011, 03:24 PM

Person - no
Object - I wouldn't say so.

Pitchwife · 06-11-2011, 03:30 PM

Place?

Mithalwen · 06-11-2011, 03:37 PM

Geographical feature?

Galadriel55 · 06-11-2011, 04:35 PM

Person - no
Object - no

Place - no
Geographical feature - not that either

I guess the object thing was confusing, so I changed it to no, cause, well, it's not.

Pitchwife · 06-11-2011, 06:18 PM

Something immaterial then (like a word, idea, concept or some such)?

Galadriel55 · 06-11-2011, 07:41 PM

Person - no
Object - no
Place - no
Geographical feature - not that either

Something immaterial then (like a word, idea, concept or some such)? - yes!!!

LadyBrooke · 06-11-2011, 11:37 PM

Not sure how to word this...

Immaterial thing, used by the Elves?

Galadriel55 · 06-12-2011, 07:02 AM

Person - no
Object - no
Place - no
Geographical feature - not that either
Something immaterial then (like a word, idea, concept or some such)? - yes!

Immaterial thing, used by the Elves - it is immaterial, but I can't say that it is "used" by Elves, even though they are envolved.

Mithalwen · 06-12-2011, 11:42 AM

So not osanwe kenta then.....

Hmmm is it the Girdle of Melian? Though that is used by the elves...

Galadriel55 · 06-12-2011, 12:20 PM

Person - no
Object - no
Place - no
Geographical feature - not that either
Something immaterial then (like a word, idea, concept or some such)? - yes!
Immaterial thing, used by the Elves - it is immaterial, but I can't say that it is "used" by Elves, even though they are involved

Girdle of Melian - no, even less "material"

Mithalwen · 06-12-2011, 12:41 PM

The Doom of Mandos?

Galadriel55 · 06-12-2011, 12:48 PM

Person - no
Object - no
Place - no
Geographical feature - not that either
Something immaterial then (like a word, idea, concept or some such)? - yes!
Immaterial thing, used by the Elves - it is immaterial, but I can't say that it is "used" by Elves, even though they are involved
Girdle of Melian - no, even less "material"

Doom of Mandos - no, but getting closer. It is more, uuum, common than that.

Mithalwen · 06-12-2011, 01:03 PM

The gift of men?

Galadriel55 · 06-12-2011, 01:04 PM

Person - no
Object - no
Place - no
Geographical feature - not that either
Something immaterial then (like a word, idea, concept or some such)? - yes!
Immaterial thing, used by the Elves - it is immaterial, but I can't say that it is "used" by Elves, even though they are involved
Girdle of Melian - no, even less "material"
Doom of Mandos - no, but getting closer. It is more, uuum, common than that.

Gift of men - no, but another good guess

Mithalwen · 06-12-2011, 04:04 PM

Does it appear/is mentioned in Lord of the Rings?

Galadriel55 · 06-12-2011, 04:07 PM

Person - no
Object - no
Place - no
Geographical feature - not that either
Something immaterial then (like a word, idea, concept or some such)? - yes!
Immaterial thing, used by the Elves - it is immaterial, but I can't say that it is "used" by Elves, even though they are involved
Girdle of Melian - no, even less "material"
Doom of Mandos - no, but getting closer. It is more, uuum, common than that.
Gift of men - no, but another good guess

Appears/mentoned in LOTR - yes

Tuor in Gondolin · 06-12-2011, 04:11 PM

Does it appear/is mentioned in The Fellowship
of the Ring in the Lord of the Rings?

Galadriel55 · 06-12-2011, 04:15 PM

Person - no
Object - no
Place - no
Geographical feature - not that either
Something immaterial then (like a word, idea, concept or some such)? - yes!
Immaterial thing, used by the Elves - it is immaterial, but I can't say that it is "used" by Elves, even though they are involved
Girdle of Melian - no, even less "material"
Doom of Mandos - no, but getting closer. It is more, uuum, common than that.
Gift of men - no, but another good guess
Appears/mentoned in LOTR - yes

Does it appear/is mentioned in The Fellowship of the Ring in LOTR? - hmm... I can't say that it is named directly, but with a stretch...

Mithalwen · 06-13-2011, 07:52 AM

Is it unique to Middle Earth?

Galadriel55 · 06-13-2011, 10:31 AM

Person - no
Object - no
Place - no
Geographical feature - not that either
Something immaterial then (like a word, idea, concept or some such)? - yes!
Immaterial thing, used by the Elves - it is immaterial, but I can't say that it is "used" by Elves, even though they are involved
Girdle of Melian - no, even less "material"
Doom of Mandos - no, but getting closer. It is more, uuum, common than that.
Gift of men - no, but another good guess
Appears/mentoned in LOTR - yes
Does it appear/is mentioned in The Fellowship of the Ring in LOTR? - hmm... I can't say that it is named directly, but with a stretch...

Unique to ME - I don't really understand the question, but I'd say no...

Mithalwen · 06-13-2011, 11:30 AM

OK by unique to middle earth I mean say the Girdle of Melian or the osanwe kenta or the straight road as opposed to telepathy or the north wind or foresight

Galadriel55 · 06-13-2011, 11:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mithalwen

OK by unique to middle earth I mean say the Girdle of Melian or the osanwe kenta or the straight road as opposed to telepathy or the north wind or foresight

Ok then... I still think it's not ME-tied. It could be... not exactly anywhere, but it doesn't have to be in ME.

Mithalwen · 06-13-2011, 12:19 PM

OK ... I may have to do some reading... I may be some time....

LadyBrooke · 06-13-2011, 12:43 PM

Immortality?

Galadriel55 · 06-13-2011, 01:46 PM

Immortality - no

Here's a hint: both Elves and Men could be involved. I can't imagine a Dwarf being involved, though. Also, not all Elves and Men are involved...

LadyBrooke · 06-13-2011, 02:18 PM

The choice of the Half-Elven?....but I wouldn't consider that more common then the Doom of Mandos....so...confused...

Galadriel55 · 06-13-2011, 02:20 PM

Not the choice of the half-elven. Although I do recall some peredhil being involved.

The choice that you mention is only for specific people (Half-Elves: not too common). The thing that I have in mind could apply to anybody, although as I said many characters don't "feel" it while others do.

LadyBrooke · 06-13-2011, 03:07 PM

I feel like I'm monopolizing the guessing, but the Sea Longing perhaps? It's something felt at least....

Galadriel55 · 06-13-2011, 03:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LadyBrooke

I feel like I'm monopolizing the guessing, but the Sea Longing perhaps? It's something felt at least....

Yes!!!

I was looking for "the call of the Sea", or the Voice, but Longing is also acceptible.

Please proceed!

Mithalwen · 06-13-2011, 03:56 PM

Oh I thought sea-longing then discounted it and I can't think why... I think I thought of it only in connection with Elvses... anyway nice to have a new chooser - I can certainly use a breather...

Galadriel55 · 06-13-2011, 04:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mithalwen

Oh I thought sea-longing then discounted it and I can't think why... I think I thought of it only in connection with Elvses...

That's what I also thought, but then I decided that... why not Men as well? Like Aldarion...

When my turn comes around again, I won't choose anything that unexplainable.

Is it a person, Brooke?

Mithalwen · 06-13-2011, 04:34 PM

Ooh I thought you hadn't read UT! I suppose cos I live a quarter mile from the sea i take it for granted!

Galadriel55 · 06-13-2011, 04:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mithalwen

Ooh I thought you hadn't read UT! I suppose cos I live a quarter mile from the sea i take it for granted!

I haven't read UT... but the Enc. of Arda helped...

There's something magical about any kind of water, not only the sea, even swamp water (although that's likely to be magical in a bad sense)

I should shut up now and not hyjack the thread.

LadyBrooke · 06-13-2011, 05:36 PM

I forgot about Aldarion too...Anyways, glad it makes you happy to have a new chooser Mith.

Is it a person - Yes

06-11-2011, 01:49 PM	#6561
Galadriel55 Blossom of Dwimordene Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: The realm of forgotten words Posts: 10,311	Spears, spears... The javelin that Eol threw at Aredhel? __________________ You passed from under darkened dome, you enter now the secret land. - Take me to Finrod's fabled home!... ~ Finrod: The Rock Opera

06-11-2011, 02:11 PM	#6562
Mithalwen Pilgrim Soul Join Date: May 2004 Location: watching the wonga-wonga birds circle... Posts: 9,916	Yay!!!! Correct All yours... and thanks re the sig... I heard it recently and it amused me. __________________ “But Finrod walks with Finarfin his father beneath the trees in Eldamar.” Christopher Tolkien, Requiescat in pace

06-11-2011, 02:20 PM	#6563
Galadriel55 Blossom of Dwimordene Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: The realm of forgotten words Posts: 10,311	Ok, I have something... I never really got the difference between spears and javelins, except that spears tend to be big, and javelins vary dramatically in size... That's a nice siggy, with many ways to twist it. Like, how did the chicken get to the other side if it didn't cross anything? __________________ You passed from under darkened dome, you enter now the secret land. - Take me to Finrod's fabled home!... ~ Finrod: The Rock Opera

06-11-2011, 03:05 PM	#6564
Mithalwen Pilgrim Soul Join Date: May 2004 Location: watching the wonga-wonga birds circle... Posts: 9,916	Well it did cross something... it was just it got back to the starting point Isuppose. Well I know that the Australian Koories use throwing spears for hunting but I assumed a javelin was more like those used in modern field athletics and was thrown whereas a spear you might well hang onto - especially as a weapon rather than a hunting instrument. I can't imagine a javelin being the most useful thing for war since in that situation it is single use and a bow can be fired more economically. Anyway Person? __________________ “But Finrod walks with Finarfin his father beneath the trees in Eldamar.” Christopher Tolkien, Requiescat in pace

06-11-2011, 03:11 PM	#6565
Galadriel55 Blossom of Dwimordene Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: The realm of forgotten words Posts: 10,311	Person - no __________________ You passed from under darkened dome, you enter now the secret land. - Take me to Finrod's fabled home!... ~ Finrod: The Rock Opera

06-11-2011, 03:16 PM	#6566
LadyBrooke Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: The modern day version of Edoras: horses, wind, rolling plains =) Posts: 507	Object? __________________ Busy, Busy, Busy...hoping for more free time soon.

06-11-2011, 03:24 PM	#6567
Galadriel55 Blossom of Dwimordene Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: The realm of forgotten words Posts: 10,311	Person - no Object - I wouldn't say so. __________________ You passed from under darkened dome, you enter now the secret land. - Take me to Finrod's fabled home!... ~ Finrod: The Rock Opera

06-11-2011, 03:30 PM	#6568
Pitchwife Wight of the Old Forest Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Unattended on the railway station, in the litter at the dancehall Posts: 3,355	When I can tell at sight a spear like Aiglos from a javelin... Place? __________________ Und aus dem Erebos kamen viele seelen herauf der abgeschiedenen toten.- Homer, Odyssey, Canto XI

06-11-2011, 03:37 PM	#6569
Mithalwen Pilgrim Soul Join Date: May 2004 Location: watching the wonga-wonga birds circle... Posts: 9,916	Geographical feature? __________________ “But Finrod walks with Finarfin his father beneath the trees in Eldamar.” Christopher Tolkien, Requiescat in pace

06-11-2011, 04:35 PM	#6570
Galadriel55 Blossom of Dwimordene Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: The realm of forgotten words Posts: 10,311	Person - no Object - no Place - no Geographical feature - not that either I guess the object thing was confusing, so I changed it to no, cause, well, it's not. __________________ You passed from under darkened dome, you enter now the secret land. - Take me to Finrod's fabled home!... ~ Finrod: The Rock Opera

06-11-2011, 06:18 PM	#6571
Pitchwife Wight of the Old Forest Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Unattended on the railway station, in the litter at the dancehall Posts: 3,355	Something immaterial then (like a word, idea, concept or some such)? __________________ Und aus dem Erebos kamen viele seelen herauf der abgeschiedenen toten.- Homer, Odyssey, Canto XI

06-11-2011, 07:41 PM	#6572
Galadriel55 Blossom of Dwimordene Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: The realm of forgotten words Posts: 10,311	Going in the right direction from the first questions... Person - no Object - no Place - no Geographical feature - not that either Something immaterial then (like a word, idea, concept or some such)? - yes!!! __________________ You passed from under darkened dome, you enter now the secret land. - Take me to Finrod's fabled home!... ~ Finrod: The Rock Opera

06-11-2011, 11:37 PM	#6573
LadyBrooke Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: The modern day version of Edoras: horses, wind, rolling plains =) Posts: 507	Not sure how to word this... Immaterial thing, used by the Elves? __________________ Busy, Busy, Busy...hoping for more free time soon.

06-12-2011, 07:02 AM	#6574
Galadriel55 Blossom of Dwimordene Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: The realm of forgotten words Posts: 10,311	Person - no Object - no Place - no Geographical feature - not that either Something immaterial then (like a word, idea, concept or some such)? - yes! Immaterial thing, used by the Elves - it is immaterial, but I can't say that it is "used" by Elves, even though they are envolved. __________________ You passed from under darkened dome, you enter now the secret land. - Take me to Finrod's fabled home!... ~ Finrod: The Rock Opera

06-12-2011, 11:42 AM	#6575
Mithalwen Pilgrim Soul Join Date: May 2004 Location: watching the wonga-wonga birds circle... Posts: 9,916	So not osanwe kenta then..... Hmmm is it the Girdle of Melian? Though that is used by the elves... __________________ “But Finrod walks with Finarfin his father beneath the trees in Eldamar.” Christopher Tolkien, Requiescat in pace

06-12-2011, 12:20 PM	#6576
Galadriel55 Blossom of Dwimordene Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: The realm of forgotten words Posts: 10,311	Person - no Object - no Place - no Geographical feature - not that either Something immaterial then (like a word, idea, concept or some such)? - yes! Immaterial thing, used by the Elves - it is immaterial, but I can't say that it is "used" by Elves, even though they are involved Girdle of Melian - no, even less "material" __________________ You passed from under darkened dome, you enter now the secret land. - Take me to Finrod's fabled home!... ~ Finrod: The Rock Opera

06-12-2011, 12:41 PM	#6577
Mithalwen Pilgrim Soul Join Date: May 2004 Location: watching the wonga-wonga birds circle... Posts: 9,916	The Doom of Mandos? __________________ “But Finrod walks with Finarfin his father beneath the trees in Eldamar.” Christopher Tolkien, Requiescat in pace

06-12-2011, 12:48 PM	#6578
Galadriel55 Blossom of Dwimordene Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: The realm of forgotten words Posts: 10,311	Person - no Object - no Place - no Geographical feature - not that either Something immaterial then (like a word, idea, concept or some such)? - yes! Immaterial thing, used by the Elves - it is immaterial, but I can't say that it is "used" by Elves, even though they are involved Girdle of Melian - no, even less "material" Doom of Mandos - no, but getting closer. It is more, uuum, common than that. __________________ You passed from under darkened dome, you enter now the secret land. - Take me to Finrod's fabled home!... ~ Finrod: The Rock Opera

06-12-2011, 01:03 PM	#6579
Mithalwen Pilgrim Soul Join Date: May 2004 Location: watching the wonga-wonga birds circle... Posts: 9,916	The gift of men? __________________ “But Finrod walks with Finarfin his father beneath the trees in Eldamar.” Christopher Tolkien, Requiescat in pace

06-12-2011, 01:04 PM	#6580
Galadriel55 Blossom of Dwimordene Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: The realm of forgotten words Posts: 10,311	Person - no Object - no Place - no Geographical feature - not that either Something immaterial then (like a word, idea, concept or some such)? - yes! Immaterial thing, used by the Elves - it is immaterial, but I can't say that it is "used" by Elves, even though they are involved Girdle of Melian - no, even less "material" Doom of Mandos - no, but getting closer. It is more, uuum, common than that. Gift of men - no, but another good guess __________________ You passed from under darkened dome, you enter now the secret land. - Take me to Finrod's fabled home!... ~ Finrod: The Rock Opera

06-12-2011, 04:04 PM	#6581
Mithalwen Pilgrim Soul Join Date: May 2004 Location: watching the wonga-wonga birds circle... Posts: 9,916	Does it appear/is mentioned in Lord of the Rings? __________________ “But Finrod walks with Finarfin his father beneath the trees in Eldamar.” Christopher Tolkien, Requiescat in pace

06-12-2011, 04:07 PM	#6582
Galadriel55 Blossom of Dwimordene Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: The realm of forgotten words Posts: 10,311	Person - no Object - no Place - no Geographical feature - not that either Something immaterial then (like a word, idea, concept or some such)? - yes! Immaterial thing, used by the Elves - it is immaterial, but I can't say that it is "used" by Elves, even though they are involved Girdle of Melian - no, even less "material" Doom of Mandos - no, but getting closer. It is more, uuum, common than that. Gift of men - no, but another good guess Appears/mentoned in LOTR - yes __________________ You passed from under darkened dome, you enter now the secret land. - Take me to Finrod's fabled home!... ~ Finrod: The Rock Opera

06-12-2011, 04:11 PM	#6583
Tuor in Gondolin Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Southeast Pennsylvania Posts: 3,651	Does it appear/is mentioned in The Fellowship of the Ring in the Lord of the Rings? __________________ The poster formerly known as Tuor of Gondolin. Walking To Rivendell and beyond 12,555 miles passed Nt./Day 5: Pass the beacon on Nardol, the 'Fire Hill.'

06-12-2011, 04:15 PM	#6584
Galadriel55 Blossom of Dwimordene Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: The realm of forgotten words Posts: 10,311	Person - no Object - no Place - no Geographical feature - not that either Something immaterial then (like a word, idea, concept or some such)? - yes! Immaterial thing, used by the Elves - it is immaterial, but I can't say that it is "used" by Elves, even though they are involved Girdle of Melian - no, even less "material" Doom of Mandos - no, but getting closer. It is more, uuum, common than that. Gift of men - no, but another good guess Appears/mentoned in LOTR - yes Does it appear/is mentioned in The Fellowship of the Ring in LOTR? - hmm... I can't say that it is named directly, but with a stretch... __________________ You passed from under darkened dome, you enter now the secret land. - Take me to Finrod's fabled home!... ~ Finrod: The Rock Opera

06-13-2011, 07:52 AM	#6585
Mithalwen Pilgrim Soul Join Date: May 2004 Location: watching the wonga-wonga birds circle... Posts: 9,916	Is it unique to Middle Earth? __________________ “But Finrod walks with Finarfin his father beneath the trees in Eldamar.” Christopher Tolkien, Requiescat in pace

06-13-2011, 10:31 AM	#6586
Galadriel55 Blossom of Dwimordene Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: The realm of forgotten words Posts: 10,311	Person - no Object - no Place - no Geographical feature - not that either Something immaterial then (like a word, idea, concept or some such)? - yes! Immaterial thing, used by the Elves - it is immaterial, but I can't say that it is "used" by Elves, even though they are involved Girdle of Melian - no, even less "material" Doom of Mandos - no, but getting closer. It is more, uuum, common than that. Gift of men - no, but another good guess Appears/mentoned in LOTR - yes Does it appear/is mentioned in The Fellowship of the Ring in LOTR? - hmm... I can't say that it is named directly, but with a stretch... Unique to ME - I don't really understand the question, but I'd say no... __________________ You passed from under darkened dome, you enter now the secret land. - Take me to Finrod's fabled home!... ~ Finrod: The Rock Opera

06-13-2011, 11:30 AM	#6587
Mithalwen Pilgrim Soul Join Date: May 2004 Location: watching the wonga-wonga birds circle... Posts: 9,916	OK by unique to middle earth I mean say the Girdle of Melian or the osanwe kenta or the straight road as opposed to telepathy or the north wind or foresight __________________ “But Finrod walks with Finarfin his father beneath the trees in Eldamar.” Christopher Tolkien, Requiescat in pace

06-13-2011, 12:19 PM	#6589
Mithalwen Pilgrim Soul Join Date: May 2004 Location: watching the wonga-wonga birds circle... Posts: 9,916	OK ... I may have to do some reading... I may be some time.... __________________ “But Finrod walks with Finarfin his father beneath the trees in Eldamar.” Christopher Tolkien, Requiescat in pace

06-13-2011, 12:43 PM	#6590
LadyBrooke Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: The modern day version of Edoras: horses, wind, rolling plains =) Posts: 507	Immortality? __________________ Busy, Busy, Busy...hoping for more free time soon.

06-13-2011, 01:46 PM	#6591
Galadriel55 Blossom of Dwimordene Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: The realm of forgotten words Posts: 10,311	Immortality - no Here's a hint: both Elves and Men could be involved. I can't imagine a Dwarf being involved, though. Also, not all Elves and Men are involved... __________________ You passed from under darkened dome, you enter now the secret land. - Take me to Finrod's fabled home!... ~ Finrod: The Rock Opera

06-13-2011, 02:18 PM	#6592
LadyBrooke Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: The modern day version of Edoras: horses, wind, rolling plains =) Posts: 507	The choice of the Half-Elven?....but I wouldn't consider that more common then the Doom of Mandos....so...confused... __________________ Busy, Busy, Busy...hoping for more free time soon.

06-13-2011, 02:20 PM	#6593
Galadriel55 Blossom of Dwimordene Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: The realm of forgotten words Posts: 10,311	Not the choice of the half-elven. Although I do recall some peredhil being involved. The choice that you mention is only for specific people (Half-Elves: not too common). The thing that I have in mind could apply to anybody, although as I said many characters don't "feel" it while others do. __________________ You passed from under darkened dome, you enter now the secret land. - Take me to Finrod's fabled home!... ~ Finrod: The Rock Opera

06-13-2011, 03:07 PM	#6594
LadyBrooke Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: The modern day version of Edoras: horses, wind, rolling plains =) Posts: 507	I feel like I'm monopolizing the guessing, but the Sea Longing perhaps? It's something felt at least.... __________________ Busy, Busy, Busy...hoping for more free time soon.

06-13-2011, 03:56 PM	#6596
Mithalwen Pilgrim Soul Join Date: May 2004 Location: watching the wonga-wonga birds circle... Posts: 9,916	Oh I thought sea-longing then discounted it and I can't think why... I think I thought of it only in connection with Elvses... anyway nice to have a new chooser - I can certainly use a breather... __________________ “But Finrod walks with Finarfin his father beneath the trees in Eldamar.” Christopher Tolkien, Requiescat in pace

06-13-2011, 04:34 PM	#6598
Mithalwen Pilgrim Soul Join Date: May 2004 Location: watching the wonga-wonga birds circle... Posts: 9,916	Ooh I thought you hadn't read UT! I suppose cos I live a quarter mile from the sea i take it for granted! __________________ “But Finrod walks with Finarfin his father beneath the trees in Eldamar.” Christopher Tolkien, Requiescat in pace