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05-04-2014, 04:48 AM | #1 |
Wight
Join Date: Apr 2014
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why sauron cant breed werewolves/dragons?
Why sauron cant breed them,like morgoth did?is it because he dont have enough time?
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05-04-2014, 05:10 AM | #2 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
Join Date: Aug 2012
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I don't think he had enough power. The spiritual power of all Ainur was limited, but compared to that of, say, Morgoth, who bred the dragons and the werewolves, Sauron's power was miniscule.
Morgoth invested a great deal of his native power in his "superweapons" - the dragons in particular. Sauron's power was great, but not great enough to breed such creatures. Perhaps he might have come to control one, or bargain with one for alliance, as Gandalf believed he intended to do with Smaug, but such power as he had he needed to control his armies. This was sufficient, because by the Third Age especially his victory was inevitable due to sheer weight of numbers, both of Orcs and of the fallen Men enslaved to him. I think we can see Sauron's awareness of the limitations of his power in the fact that his policies towards both Elves and Men in the West began with subterfuge, involving the Rings, rather than main force. We might see the Ringwraiths as Sauron's equivalent of servants like dragons and werewolves, although their position was obviously more comparable to that of the Balrogs.
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05-04-2014, 05:16 AM | #3 |
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Did sauron breed the werewolves?if so,why he dont breed them anymore?the werewolves would have wrecked gondor,and the rangers of ithilien wouldnt be so effective.after all,why would anyone patrolling in a land full of werewolves?
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05-04-2014, 05:17 AM | #4 |
Wight
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I read the tolkien ateway,and they say sauron is the one who breed them.
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05-04-2014, 05:21 AM | #5 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
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He was certainly their master in the First Age, and Gandalf mentions werewolves among Sauron's servants in The Lord of the Rings ("Wargs and werewolves"), so perhaps he did have sufficient power for them - although given how little we see of the "Hounds of Sauron" evidently they were either not numerous or not as useful as they might have been.
I think dragons were probably beyond his power.
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"Since the evening of that day we have journeyed from the shadow of Tol Brandir." "On foot?" cried Éomer. |
05-04-2014, 05:30 AM | #6 |
Wight
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Dragon is undoubtebly beyond sauron's power,but werewolves seem not far fetched.the reason why werewolves not showing that much was maybe sauron fear the elves would hunt them,of he made them his personal guard at barad-dur.
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05-04-2014, 05:32 PM | #7 | |
Shade of Carn Dūm
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Quote:
It seems Sauron was doing other things. Making the trolls more cunning, the introduction of a new breed of trolls, the Rings of Power et cetera. It appears that Sauron may have had a hand in the making/breeding of Orcs himself. Melkor came up with the idea, and sometimes he'd grow frustrated in projects which Sauron would complete.
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05-04-2014, 08:26 PM | #8 | ||
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Quote:
Quote:
Going by the published works there's a huge period of time when Melkor was in captivity and Sauron would have had command of the Orcs, and it's also probable that it was actually Sauron who was the one who "appeared among us, in our own form visible" (because Melkor was either in captivity, or had already become the Morgoth, by the time Men awoke). Like I said - it's a mess.
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05-04-2014, 01:03 PM | #9 | |
Shade of Carn Dūm
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"Men called him Thu, and as a god in after days beneath his rod bewildered bowed to him, and made his ghastly temples in the shade. Not yet by Men enthralled adored, now was he Morgoth's mightiest lord, Master of Wolves, whose shivering howl for ever echoed in the hills, and foul enchantments and dark sigaldry did weave and wield. In glamoury that necromancer held his hosts of phantoms and of wandering ghosts of misbegotten or spell-wronged monsters that about him thronged, working his bidding dark and vile: the werewolves of the Wizard's Isle." [Lay of Leithian, v. 2064-2079] Sauron is even called the Master of Wolves. So he could, and did, make werewolves. I'm not sure why he did not in later Ages, or if he did.
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"For believe me: the secret for harvesting from existence the greatest fruitfulness and the greatest enjoyment is - to live dangerously!" - G.S.; F. Nietzsche |
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05-04-2014, 01:53 PM | #10 | ||
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The evidence is stacking up.
From Of the Ruin of Beleriand and the Fall of Fingolfin: Quote:
Quote:
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Then one appeared among us, in our own form visible, but greater and more beautiful; and he said that he had come out of pity. |
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05-06-2014, 08:07 PM | #11 |
Shade of Carn Dūm
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As no Ainur, but of Maian stock, his understanding of creation as an offspring of Eru's thought, was limited, I imagine. I recall reading that Sauron was a Maia of Aule's lineage, originally, which was all about craftsmanship more than living (though look at the Dwarves--Aule's creation--pretty awesome really). By the time Sauron had corrupted and ruined long enough, he also lost the ability to assume fair form. Another theme Tolkien seems to replay over is about devolution of power, or about a kind of 'one way' path a Maia can take (e.g. Melian, when she assumed Elvish form, kinda got caught at that evolutionary point). Melkor lost the power of shape changing at some point I seem to remember....
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