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Old 08-10-2011, 01:20 PM   #1
almiel
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White Tree translation help

I'm not sure if this is the right place to post, but I'd love some help with a translation!

While trying to figure it out, I stumbled upon an archived post on the translation of "Child of the Lord" (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/archive...p?t-16559.html).

I am also toying with a tattoo idea, and was wondering what the translation for "child of the universe" would be. I know Eä is the Quenya word for universe (not sure if there's a Sindarin equivalent?). From reading those threads, I'm supposing it would be something approximating Eähín (for universe-child), and possibly hína i Eä (? for child of the universe).

But I might be completely off track! Any help would be appreciated.
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Old 08-12-2011, 07:40 AM   #2
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Welcome to the Downs, almiel! As we don't have a special language forum, I'd say this is a good place to post your question.

hína i Eä is fine for "child of the universe" as far as the meaning goes, but Quenya being an inflecting language (unlike Sindarin), you'd have to stick the appropriate case ending to *; for the genitive, this would be -o, giving Eäo, which however looks/sounds horribly awkward with its three vowels in a row (not that it's wrong, it's just a matter of phonaesthetic taste).

Also, Tolkien tends to use as a sort of proper name of the universe, without the article, so I'd drop the i, leaving hína Eäo; but if you'd like to avoid the three-vowel-cluster, your compound Eähin (modelled on Eruhin) actually seems like a good alternative to me.
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*(especially because can also mean "it is" in the sense of "it exists", and i can also be the relative pronoun, so hína i eä could be misread as "a child that exists".)
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Old 08-13-2011, 10:11 AM   #3
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Ahh, thank you so much. The grammar was one reason I wanted to check, since I knew it was more complicated than Sindarin.

Follow up inquiry - rendering these into Tengwar. There's an online generator, but I'm not sure if it's correct. This is what it made for both:



Thank you for your help so far.
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Old 08-13-2011, 12:21 PM   #4
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While examples are scarce enough, and if ea is wanted anyway, a form in Namárie suggests that the genitive marker displaces final -a, as there we find Vardo for instance, rather than *Vardao.

I can't recall at the moment if other examples exist where -a is retained.
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Old 08-13-2011, 02:50 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by Galin View Post
While examples are scarce enough, and if ea is wanted anyway, a form in Namárie suggests that the genitive marker displaces final -a, as there we find Vardo for instance, rather than *Vardao.

I can't recall at the moment if other examples exist where -a is retained.
Methinks you're right - I was misled by Oiolossëo, where the final vowel is retained before the ending, but that's probably because e and o (unlike a and o) are dissimilar enough not to make the resulting cluster too uncouth. We also have in Namárië the form Calaciryo, genitive of Calacirya, so that looks like a rule - which leaves us with hína Eö.
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Old 08-13-2011, 11:19 PM   #6
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Ahh that makes sense, Galin. What would you (either of you, or anyone else, lol) recommend for the Tengwar script then? (I am more than way too rusty on transcribing.)
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Old 08-15-2011, 07:54 AM   #7
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Well I'm no expert, but your second example is almost how I would write hína eo, and by 'almost' I mean take out the carrier for the vowel a (along with the vowel of course), but leave the rest -- hína e[a]o -- and pick a font you find pleasing.

That still leaves you with two vowel carriers for eo, but I'm not sure how else to write this (as it's not a diphthong) if it's the correct form for 'of the universe'.

That is, I'm not sure how else to write it if one necessarily finds two carriers less pleasing to the eye.
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