The Entwives

[cookieman]

I wonder why Pippin and Mary didn't mention to Treebeard about the friend of Sam's who said he saw a tree walking around up in the shire?

[Larien Telemnar]

Which chapter was that? Nevermind, I'm going to find it! *Runs off excitedly*

Pippin did say that the trees in the Old Forest were rumored to move (Chapter VI The old forest) and that they even attacked the hedge once, and that they would surround travelers at night. I suppose it slipped their minds.

We have to remember though that the trees in the Old Forest were very hostile towards people, and weren't trees that the Ent Wives would have liked to hang around, in my opinion. Is it another chapter you're talking about? If so I prolly missed it.

[cookieman]

In The Fellowship of the Rings, very early in the book Sam is in a pub and he mentions that someone he knows claims to have seen a tree walking. I'll have to look it up for specifics.

[Larien Telemnar]

Okee thankee! I'll look for it, let's see who gets there first! I race you!

[cookieman]

I found it! It's in chapter two: The Shadow of the Past. About three pages into the chapter.
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"All right," said Sam,"But what about those Tree-men, these giants, as you might call them? They do say that one bigger than a tree was seen up away beyond the North Moors not long back."

"Who's they?"

"My cousin Hal for one. He works for Mr. Boffin at Overhill and goes up to the Northfarthing for the hunting. He saw one."

"Says he did, perhaps. Your Hal's always saying he's seen things; and maybe he sees things that ain't there."

"But this one was as big as an elm tree, and walking - walking seven yards to a stride, if it was an inch."

[cookieman]

At one time The Old Forrest was connected to Fangorn forrest.

Three remain of the first Ents: Fangorn (Treebeard), Finglas (Leaflock), and Fladrif (Skinbark). There were more ents, though. I wonder how far spread out they were. What are your thoughts. Were there still ents scattered throughout the forrests of ME? I think so.

[Larien Telemnar]

Awww you beat me! I just found it, too, haha! Foiled again.

Weel, there was that one Ent that Merry and Pippin befriended. OH! What was his name............ Umum...... quick-something, right? ACH! I'm gonna have to look it up!

AHA! Quickbeam, that's who I'm looking for. My favorite Ent was Quickbeam, but I always favored the name Finglas. More poetic, I think.

I'll look to see if there are others.

[Eomer of the Rohirrim]

Maybe Merry and Pippin did not know about Sam's tale. Maybe, after being mocked in said pub, Sam just didn't bother to tell anyone else. And remember that he didn't have too much contact with Merry or Pippin until Frodo left home.

[Folwren]

Maybe Merry and Pippin did not know about Sam's tale. Maybe, after being mocked in said pub, Sam just didn't bother to tell anyone else. And remember that he didn't have too much contact with Merry or Pippin until Frodo left home.

They may not have known about his story, but they were having contact with him because he was the one doing all their spying up at Bag End.

And I don't know why Pippin or Merry didn't mention anything to Treebeard...I've never thought about it. But it could easily have slipped their mind, seeing as the poor chaps had just been through a lot.

I highly doubt Sam was daunted by Ted's jeering in the Green Dragon.

[the guy who be short]

The complex theory:

Sam never told Merry and Pippin because it's not really a subject that crops up often. "Hey Sam, have you seen any walking trees recently?

If you thought that was simple... the simple theory:

Tolkien forgot about it. Posibly he put it in intending to have some connection to the Ents or some later relevance and then forgot. He was only human, after all, despite contrary opinion.

[Kuruharan]

I bet they talked about it afterwards, since Merry and Pippin had been in contact with walking trees.

However, I suspect that dear cousin Hal might have had a few more than was quite good for him (awfully boring out there on the moor). I seriously doubt he saw an Ent.

[the guy who be short]

I took the question to mean why M&P didn't tell Treebeard when they first met him and he asked about the sight of Entwives. Who's to say that afterwards, they didn't go back, and the Ents didn't have a last bloom before their fall?

This is quite interesting actually. Why did Tolkien put the line about Hal in? Did he forget about it afterwards? Does it imply that the Ents and Entwives were reunited afterwards?

[Folwren]

He may have forgotten about it later...but he might have added that line in at the very beginning just becaue he thought walking trees would be cool and he wanted to develope Sam's and Ted Sandyman's character right there in your first introduction of the two of them. He might have been thinking more Old Forest than Ent when he had Sam bring the topic up.

[Kuruharan]

Why did Tolkien put the line about Hal in?

I think it was all part of making the world around the hobbits less stable and explainable.

I don't recall that Merry and Pippin went back and talked to Treebeard again, but I may be forgetting something.

Does it imply that the Ents and Entwives were reunited afterwards?

Hopeful souls have thought so, but I really doubt it.

[turgon]

thats a good question cookie. (side thought here)
I always assumed the'entwives' were in valinor when eru reshaped the world at the fall of numenor

[Kuruharan]

I always assumed the'entwives' were in valinor when eru reshaped the world at the fall of numenor

I doubt that. The Entwives' gardens in what became the Brown Lands were still in one piece. They were not destroyed until Sauron burned them to hamper the advance of the Last Alliance.

[Guinevere]

When I first read the part where Treebeard asks the hobbits to look for Entwives in the Shire, I , too, remembered the mention of the "walking Elm-tree", and I rather hoped they would find some Entwives (after all, Sam found his pony Bill again, though that had seemed improbable too)

Tolkien wrote about the Entwives in letter # 144

What had happened to them is not resolved in this book.

And in letter #338 (1972)

But I think in Volume II (the song of the Ent and Entwife) it is plain that there would be for Ents no re-union in "history", but Ents and their wives being rational creatures would find some "earthly paradise" until the end of this world: beyond which the wisdom neither of Elves or Ents could see. Though maybe they shared the hope of Aragorn that they were "not bound for ever to the circles of the world and beyond them is more than memory."

What exactly " earthly paradise" means, is a mystery to me. But it reminds me of Galadriel's last words to Treebeard when he says that he thinks they will never meet again:

"Not in Middle-earth, nor until the lands that lie under the wave are lifted up again. Then in the willow-meads of Tasarinan we may meet in the Spring. Farewell!"

that is equally mysterious to me! Is that to be after the "worlds end" ? (I haven't got the book of Lost Tales) but perhaps someone here has an explanation?

[Kuruharan]

that is equally mysterious to me! Is that to be after the "worlds end"

Yes.