The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum


Visit The *EVEN NEWER* Barrow-Downs Photo Page

Go Back   The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum > Middle-Earth Discussions > The Books
User Name
Password
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 01-07-2004, 07:32 AM   #1
Athaniel
Pile O'Bones
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Tirion
Posts: 13
Athaniel has just left Hobbiton.
Silmaril historical allegory/similarities between LOTR and human history

I am aware that the question whether LOTR resembles WW II has been discussed at length at this forum.

What I would like to talk about is whether historical allegory in a more general sense can be found in the books.
Is the story, as M. Steiner suggests in his excellent essay in the articles section, a portrayal of any given decade in human history where war is a predominant factor?
Or is there no historical allegory at all, since the process and conclusion of the war differ from any historical battle in human history.

I feel inclined to believe the latter, since I cannot think of any combat where the rulers would not have utilized the ring.

I admit that there are similarities between the story and historical phaenomena, such as the dread imposed by war, or the social and political structure of Rohan and Gondor, which resemble the feudal structure of medieval times. Tolkien's fictional world rests upon characteristics of the real world, but I would feel reluctant to describe them as allegory
__________________
elan síla lúmen' omentielvo
Athaniel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2004, 08:49 AM   #2
mark12_30
Stormdancer of Doom
 
mark12_30's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Elvish singing is not a thing to miss, in June under the stars
Posts: 4,407
mark12_30 has been trapped in the Barrow!
Send a message via AIM to mark12_30 Send a message via Yahoo to mark12_30
Sting

Oooo, quick, before half the forum jumps down your throat, change "Allegory" to "Applicability" in the title of your thread! "Allegory" is a four-letter-word, but "Applicability" is okay.

[img]smilies/wink.gif[/img] Neat topic!
__________________
...down to the water to see the elves dance and sing upon the midsummer's eve.
mark12_30 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2004, 07:31 PM   #3
Finwe
Deathless Sun
 
Finwe's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: The Royal Suite in the Halls of Mandos
Posts: 2,609
Finwe has just left Hobbiton.
Send a message via AIM to Finwe
Sting

I don't know if I'd call it allegory, but since Tolkien heavily based Middle-earth upon certain events, places, and peoples of our world, many similarities would exist. You said that one similarity was the dread caused by war. The reactions of the Rohirrim and the Gondorians are similar to our reactions because we are all human. We all share certain characteristics and personality traits that make us act in very similar ways. You cannot say the same thing about the Elves, though. They are a "humanoid" race, ergo we would share some characteristics, but not as many as we share with our counterparts, the Edain. They react to situations differently, because that is how they were "made," as a race. They were intended to react differently, ergo, they do.
__________________
But Melkor also was there, and he came to the house of Fëanor, and there he slew Finwë King of the Noldor before his doors, and spilled the first blood in the Blessed Realm; for Finwë alone had not fled from the horror of the Dark.
Finwe is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 08:19 AM.



Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.