Tol-in-Gaurhoth Threefold and Six: The Night Guard

[Nilpaurion Felagund]

Boro's the only person I trust in this village. Can you hold your vote in reserve in case there's some voting shinenigans near the end?

(Sorry for the floodposting, only got the net back a few minutes ago after losing it for more than a DAY. )

[Boromir88]

Originally Posted by Nilpaurion Felagund

Boro's the only person I trust in this village. Can you hold your vote in reserve in case there's some voting shinenigans near the end?

I don't see why not, but it is a little unsettling as to why you have so much trust in me.

Dah, nah, nah, nah, nah...Swineman! Swineman! Oh you have to love the late nighters.

[Nilpaurion Felagund]

Inziladun Guard-voted for you three hours before DAY 1 ended. A Werewolf would not take unnecessary risk in having a fellow Night Guarded.

Nienna I thought was an innocent who's making sure nobody stays hidden, making cases against other villagers and such, but after yesterDAY she might just be spreading suspicion evenly throughout the village, helping the Werewolves hide in the general aura of suspicion.

Brinniel's posts are too clean, so little to read there. My only points against her are Inziladun's DAY 3 vote and yesterDAY's bandwaggon, but they are, I believe, strong enough points for me not to trust her.

Sally's always been hard to read for me, as she seems to be able to sustain whatever insanity I use up in DAY 1. For that reason I've always been getting evil vibes from her, almost always wrongly. But again, after yesterDAY's bandwaggon, and now her early vote . . .

My major points against McCaber are his DAY 2 change of attitude towards Legate and his general hiddenness. I have this creepy feeling that most of our Werewolves are submarines. I have the same feeling of uneasiness with Greenie, even though I have no other points of suspicion against her.

Pitchwife is a clueless innocent or a very bold Werewolf. I'm inclined to think the former, but there's enough doubt that I do not trust him to cast the possible saving vote for the village.

I think that's all of them? I may have issues with some of your posting, Boro (happily no major ones), but the fact is that Inziladun vote convinced me enough in your innocence. Is that good enough?

[Boromir88]

I just went through Inzil's posts again, wow has he left absolutely nothing. Anyone he rarely defended anyone, and most people who he did interact with are dead.

The live ones then that Inzil had some kind of interaction with.

Nienna in #235 and #239, looks a little odd, he basically bluntly calls her a wolf and jokes that she will kill him during the night.

In #406 he says that Nilp has a cunning mind and he responds to Pitch

In #412 he says he almost wanted to vote for Nilp, but decides to vote Brinn and guard Pitch.

Inzil's track record on Day 1 and 2 were to vote for innocents (Kitanna and Legate) and guard innocents (me and Nogrod)...I'm innocent at this point you'll have to believe me or not.

Unknowns are on Day 3 vote for Brinn and guard Pitch. Inzil has had to of interacted with one wolf, if not multiple ones, but the problem is he played very tight to the vest and limitted the number of people he mentioned.

Another interesting thing to note about Inzil's behavior, is after my suspicions of him on Day 1, he comes back and jokes around if I've had anything to do with Mnemo's death. After Nienna and Nilp go after him, he turns into a jokester again towards them. So, that makes Nienna and Nilp look pretty innocent to me. Usually, I take a joking towards other players as a suspicious sign, but it should really depend upon the players (evidence sally and my performance in Lari's game, which was an utter disaster).

However, I think Inzil's reactions to Nienna's suspicions make Nienna look innocent:

Did I say I suspected you? I was just noting that you and Legate appear to have a quite good understanding of the Code of the Wolves.~#257

I've used this as a wolf, and seen it many times from other wolves..."What? Oh, I wasn't suspecting you, me calling you a wolf was all a misunderstanding."

From the unknowns that Inzil interacted with, from most suspicious to least:

Pitch
Brinn
Nilp
Nienna

I will get to what all the living players said about Inzil sometime after work.

[Nilpaurion Felagund]

Words. I'm more of a numbers guy, though.

So my thoughts in summary:

Will not vote for:
Boro
Pitchwife
Green

Might not vote for, but keeping an eye on:
Brinniel
Nienna

Wil most likely vote for:
McCaber
Sally

What do we do with the Guard vote, btw? In case we get a Werewolf today do we risk keeping the Ranger from doing xyr NIGHT work? (I'm inclined not to vote Guard toDAY, but am willing to listen to someone else's plan.)

[Boromir88]

Oh and that leave the living ones who Inzil had no interaction with at all (or nothing major that struck my attention)

sally
McCaber
Greenie

I said a while ago about how out of all the Legate and Nogrod guard votes the only repeat was wilwa, which made me think that the wolves were playing really spread apart from eachother, not trying to leave any connections. So, the 3 listed here also look mighty suspicious, just based on Inzil not mentioning them.

We'll see about their posts too. Nienna and Nilp, since I feel good about you right now, mind if we split up sally's votes? There is no way I'm going to be able to get through all of them I don't care how much free time I have tomorrow.

[A Little Green]

Whoa. YesterDay really took me by surprise. When I went to bed two hours before DL the situation was McCaber with two votes and Pitch and Sally with one, and people were talking about how suspicious Pitch was. When I went to check the thread I expected to find McCaber or Pitchwife lynched. I was stunned to see it was Wilwa - I don't think she was even considered an option two hours before DL! That was some serious bit of last-minute bandwaggoning, I'd say.

Actually, I wonder if the wolves orchestrated that. If so, why? If those in danger of getting lynched (McCaber, Pitchwife, Sally to some extent) were all innocent, why bother? Therefore, if the bandwagon was manipulated by a wolf, it would make sense that one of the potential lynchees was one too.

[Nilpaurion Felagund]

Might McCaber have been wilwa's Hunter target yesterDAY?

http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showpos...&postcount=576

Aside from the obvious (she thought he's a Wolf, so she voted for him), notice the arrow sign. She usually uses the Silmaril sign in her posts (when she's not beginning with a quote).

Grasping at straws much?

If we lynch an innocent toDAY, it's game over. I have to be sure that the recipient of my vote is a Werewolf.

[Nilpaurion Felagund]

Originally Posted by A Little Green

Actually, I wonder if the wolves orchestrated that. If so, why? If those in danger of getting lynched (McCaber, Pitchwife, Sally to some extent) were all innocent, why bother? Therefore, if the bandwagon was manipulated by a wolf, it would make sense that one of the potential lynchees was one too.

That's what I was thinking, too. The Werewolves might have started using their numbers to their advantage with that last-minute bandwaggon, when they saw an opening due to the vote spread.

This is why we must spread our votes as little as possible toDAY. We do not want giving the Werewolves the chance to use their numbers again.

[A Little Green]

Another thing that just popped into my mind, just wondering if it's too crazy to be true. If a wolf saw that his fellow is in danger of getting lynched, why wouldn't he just make a bandwagon against someone who had already received votes? What I'm saying is, what if both Pitchwife and McCaber are wolves and that is why the third wolf decided to start a bandwagon against Wilwa instead? *off to check that bandwagon for candidates for the third wolf in my theory*

[A Little Green]

Hmm. The third wolf, if my theory holds water, would be either Brinn or Nienna. Brinn was the one to bring up a big case against Wilwa, to explain why exactly she felt suspicious about her. Nienna jumped in and suggested a Wilwa lynch. Out of those two, I think Nienna looks the worse. Rather like a wolf seeing a sudden chance in Brinn's big Wilwa-post and seizing it. It would make more sense than a wolf Brinn making a very long post analysing Wilwa's posts quite close to DL seemingly in response to someone's question about why she suspected her in order to save her fellows. The problem is, if Nienna is a wolf we might well be dealing with a new WW mastermind since she has looked so so so so innocent all the time.

So: according to my theory the wolves would be McCaber, Pitchwife and Nienna. I'm quite doubtful still, I should probably try and analyse the interactions between these three and see if it fits. Right now, though, I need to go and study English grammar. Blah.

[Nilpaurion Felagund]

All right, the more I read the post I mentioned, the more I believe wilwa tried to hunt McCaber. So most likely I'll not vote for him toDAY.

And the more I read yesterday's posts the more Nienna becomes suspicious to me.

Originally Posted by Nienna

I wonder why Nerwen and not Nog or Nilp? Nerwen was trusted by some but recently it seemed as if more people trusted Nog and Nilp. Thoughts?

Trying to get people suspicious with the two of us? If you're the Werewolf of course you'd know why Nerwen was killed . . .

Originally Posted by Nienna

Nog: I thought that post pretty self-explanatory. At the time I didn't really know where her suspicion of Wilwa was coming from. Today I have asked and found out so am now feeling better about Brinn and worse about Wilwa.

Sniffing the air for signs of a bandwaggon? Perhaps the pack (or some of them) got the Hunter-clues wilwa left behind and tried to get her lynched instead of wasting a NIGHT kill. I don't know if Brinn's been unwittingly used as a bird-dog or a co-conspirator; I'm inclined to think the latter. However she was suspicious of wilwa even before this DAY, which attenuates my suspicion towards her. But not by much.

Originally Posted by Nienna

I'd be game for last minute Wilwa lynch. She has just been a little off and looking at others opinions of her I think the same... I'm not entirely comfortable voting for Pitchwife or McCaber right now...

Here we go. Setting up the whole thing. Her vote for wilwa follows (along with Nogrod's and Brinn's, not five minutes apart.)

Why kill Nogrod, though? Nog's a part of that sudden bandwaggon, and would therefore be suspicious the next DAY . . . (Come to think of it, 'twas Nienna who first pointed out that the Guard tally was miscounted--the Night Guard shifted from Nogrod to Boro, who would have been a better kill candidate in this scenario. Why, though? It would have been better if they did not point it out . . . Blast, I've just created reasonable doubt in my own case.

Perhaps it would have been noticed by someone else, anyway, and pointing it out herself helps her cover. Perhaps killing Nogrod would have helped make her (them if Brinniel and/or Sally's part of the pack) look innocent in a roundabout way. A bluff to the effect of, 'See? Nogrod who voted for wilwa is innocent. The whole thing's an innocent mistake.' But . . . I dunno. )

Originally Posted by Nienna

*Bangs head against wall*

I take full responsibility for Wilwa's death. I'm terribly sorry... I was worried about another Hakon-like lynch with McCaber and Brinn and Boro had made some good points against Wilwa... I totally second guessed myself and that sucks.

A Little Green
Boromir88
Brinniel
McCaber
Nienna
Nilpaurion Felagund
Pitchwife
satansaloser2005

In this list are 3 wolves. We need to lynch one today or we are pretty much doomed.

I'm thinking there is a wolf in either McCaber or Pitchwife and the other two between Nilp, Greenie, and Brinn.

*Wonders if there will be people posting today*

I'm also thinking of taking the I will lynch-vote you if you have less than 10 posts today because it is crucial to have everyone making a contribution so the wolves can slip and so that the innocents can work together. If you aren't contributing (unless you have serious RL issues) then you don't deserve your win. [/emo-rant]

Takes full responsibility for wilwa's death. Haha, does that mean Brinniel is not part of the pack? Interesting that Sally was not mentioned in her possible wolf groups . . .

All in all, perhaps this was all a slip from Nienna's otherwise perfect Werewolf performance, probably induced by their proximity to a victory. But that thing with the Night Guard tally error and the NIGHT kill . . . *sigh* Does not compute.

[Nienna]

Though I would love to have a perfect ww performance it is not at all true. As an ordo my last minute jump onto Wilwa was terrible and I know that. This is not at all how I act as a wolf and after the last game where I won as a wolf I think I'd stay with what seems to be working.

Right before deadline yesterday I was frustrated and confused and was basically like "whatever something needs to happen" and I didn't want to be part of the Hakon-like McCaber lynch... though maybe it would have been better because then we would still have our Hunter.

Greenie is worrying me the most today. I'll go through some of her posts as well as some of Sally's though I'm pretty sure Sally is an innocent.

[McCaber]

Originally Posted by Nilpaurion Felagund

All right, the more I read the post I mentioned, the more I believe wilwa tried to hunt McCaber. So most likely I'll not vote for him toDAY.

That's what I picked up on, too, but I couldn't really say it given the situation.

I just had a discouraging thought. If an innocent votes for another ordinary villager, the game is lost. So it could be over already, depending on the alignments of sally and I. Rather a disturbing thing to wake up to, no?

Anyway, I'm back.

[Nienna]

Oh and PS about the guard vote mistake: I was counting the votes wondering who would be guarded and saw that Boro had more. When Mayor Steve posted that Nog was being saved I was very confused. So I asked. I also put that he was allowed to not answer me. If he didn't count Sally's vote then this would mean that there could be people who's votes aren't counting and it would have been interesting to discuss. So I wanted to know if it was a mistake and if it was then it needed to be fixed regardless of the people's roles and if it wasn't then it was something that could be talked about.

Edit: Ex-ed with McCaber

[Boromir88]

McCaber on Inzil, nothing much to be honest. He votes for Inzil Day 2 (interesting enough the Day when it's pretty clear Legate will be lynched. However, I can't find any reason why Inzil was his "top suspect" for the 1st 2 days.

It seems some of the biggest points against me are voting for Inzil twice, both when he was in no danger of being lynched.~#590

Problem is McCaber, you only voted for Inzil once. You voted wilwa on Day 1.

The most suspicious thing about McCaber, is his back and forth about Legate:

This is from Day 1:

Although we shouldn't be hasty to lynch someone we protected if there's only one kill. That seems to be a very easy way for the pack to manipulate the village. Granted, it would only work one time at most, but it could still backfire horribly.

[Boromir88]

In the post above I accidentally hit enter when I didn't mean to. So, I will just continue. Then Day 2 McCaber changes his tune:

In 198

Well so far I don't have any more brilliant insights. Although for what it's worth I think we have time for a Legate lynch toDay, and be ready to sort things out later.

Saying a Legate lynch would be good today, despite the day before saying the wolves could easily manipulate the guard vote?

In 305

Well, I'm back. And toDay has certainly been more interesting than I originally wanted. We have Legate arguing his innocence, and ... just about everyone but Legate wanting to lynch him.

Right now I'm not prepared to argue either way, but I'll stay connected and think about what this shows about the "everyone but Legate" crowd.

Pointing out that everyone except Legate seems to believe Legate is guilty, but McCaber stays back and plays it cautiously, saying he won't argue either way.

In #319 he then says he can't vote for Legate, based on what he pointed out on Day 1, so he votes Inzil...and this is a vote he would know full well would not pick up any steam. Since, Day 2, it was clear Legate was going to be lynched.

In #368, brags about being correct on Legate:

Well, all that I can say is that I was right. The guarding was an extremely easy tactic for the wolves to manipulate. In fact, I would not be surprised if the Legate lynch was largely driven by the wolves to see how much they could get away with.

In #514 he suspects Hakon, but defends Pitch:

Hakon is doing his level best to appear suspicious, while Pitchwife is doing the exact opposite. He's taking actions which look suspicious, but he explains himself well and seems genuine. I know, a rather simple analysis, but it works for me.

But then in #590, after calling Pitch geniune he stays away from the Hakon wagon, and votes Pitch in #591.

Flip-flopping back and forth about people is one thing, but how does Pitch go from geniune to a vote? Your voting McCaber has appeared to be conscious attempts to stay out of lynching innocents. Day 1, it was wilwa, Day 2 it was Inzil when it was clear Legate would be lynched, and Day 4 you steer from the Hakon wagon, to vote for someone you thought was genuinely innocent?

[satansaloser2005]

Hey, I'm here but I can't stay. Got suddenly handed an assignment at work so I'll be out most of the Day. When I get back I'll try to catch up really quick but I can't promise much. Sorry again.

[Nienna]

Sally:

69: Doesn’t think Mnemo is evil for The Plan but thinks it is cheap or too easy
77: Wants to catch ww the ‘old fashioned way’ but wouldn’t think poorly on The Plan later in the game
96: Up for guarding those who look suspicious
101: Guards Mnemo for being innovative and wanting to have someone on her team who has a different point of view
115: Doesn’t like Kit’s guard vote for Hakon… thinks that if she is innocent then it isn’t the best strategy, gives lots of possiblities
117: Responds to McCaber saying we should be too hasty to lynch someone who was NG if there was only one kill. She thinks that in certain circumstances it would be worth the risk to kill off the NGed if there was only one kill
123: More about protecting those we trust or those who are suspicious
133: Mentions that if we guard someone and there are 2 kills then we know that person is an innocent
172: Votes to lynch Kit at the very last moment
177: Thinks that Legate is probably a wolf because it seems unlikely that the wolves would give up a kill
266: Defends her Kit vote, still doesn’t think that the wolves would give up a kill in order to frame Legate, gets bad vibes from Wilwa
277: Defends her vote some more
Bunch of back and forth between Sally and Legate
339: Mentions the weird parroting thing between Hakon, McCaber, and Zil, votes to lynch Legate and guard me.
423: Random mention of Fish….
448: Guard vote for Shasta at the end of the day but no lynch vote... interesting… the day we lynched a wolf…
494: Defends her vote for Shasta and kicks herself for tying things up further (aka the 3 person tie)
518: Analysis of McCaber – finds him a top suspect
537: Analysis of Hakon – finds him evil
541: Hesitant in joining a bandwagon
557: Would rather see Hakon dead than Wilwa so lynch votes Hakon
609: Defends her vote to Brinn
613: Considering a Wilwa lynch
629: Late vote to lynch Wilwa and guard Nog
635: Very early lynch vote for McCaber

Sally: you confuse me. I’ve spent a good portion of the game thinking that you are innocent but now I’m second guessing myself. This is not good… I think that it is safe to leave you alive another day… I hope. What is most bothering is your early vote… bah.

[Nienna]

Oh thought I should mention that those aren't all of Sally's posts. I went through quickly and pulled the one's I thought important. Someone else might want to go through them as well.

[satansaloser2005]

Originally Posted by Nienna

What is most bothering is your early vote… bah.

Yeah, I really am sorry about that. I knew I'd be busy around DL and didn't want to forget (or not be able to vote, the way my internet's been acting lately) so I didn't have much choice. And now it looks like I won't be around most of the day anyway.


Have to go now. Back as soon as I can.

[Boromir88]

Greenie and Brinn will follow after lunch and a trip to the store.

[McCaber]

Well, in the one game that I absolutely should not be lynched, look what happened. I guess now is as good a time as any. I am the ranger. I know, I've been doing a terrible job as far as the guarding goes. Here's a list of the people I tried to save:

Boro
Little Green
Nilp
Nogrod
Brinn

Nerwen was my second choice the night she was killed, and I spent quite a while thinking about that one. And then when Nog bit it the day after, it wasn't a good thing at all.

The night that the sun rose early, I guarded Nilp. Just on the off chance that it actually was a save and not something like the wolves not sending in a kill or one of those other special abilities.

I led off with Boro, because he's always a target, and the quicker I can figure him out the easier game I would have had. Greenie was more or less a random pick, and Nilp and Nog were because the wolves had been targeting people who were making solid contributions and throwing things around. Brinn I chose because I knew the wolves probably were going to kill Nog, so I wanted my next night to be open for someone I thought to be innocent. Not that I'm throwing any heavy suspicion her way, I just thought there are at least two people here I see as more innocent than her.

I do realize I have one vote already, so I'm taking a very large risk here. Talia jacta est.

[satansaloser2005]

Originally Posted by McCaber

Well, in the one game that I absolutely should not be lynched, look what happened. I guess now is as good a time as any. I am the ranger. I know, I've been doing a terrible job as far as the guarding goes. Here's a list of the people I tried to save:

Boro
Little Green
Nilp
Nogrod
Brinn

Nerwen was my second choice the night she was killed, and I spent quite a while thinking about that one. And then when Nog bit it the day after, it wasn't a good thing at all.

The night that the sun rose early, I guarded Nilp. Just on the off chance that it actually was a save and not something like the wolves not sending in a kill or one of those other special abilities.

I led off with Boro, because he's always a target, and the quicker I can figure him out the easier game I would have had. Greenie was more or less a random pick, and Nilp and Nog were because the wolves had been targeting people who were making solid contributions and throwing things around. Brinn I chose because I knew the wolves probably were going to kill Nog, so I wanted my next night to be open for someone I thought to be innocent. Not that I'm throwing any heavy suspicion her way, I just thought there are at least two people here I see as more innocent than her.

I do realize I have one vote already, so I'm taking a very large risk here. Talia jacta est.

[Pitchwife]

Present and catching up.

[Nienna]

This definitely makes things more interesting... we shall see if there are any counter-reveals. This definitely gives us some more stuff to talk about. McCaber do you have thoughts on people?

[satansaloser2005]

Meh, let's kill him anyway. It's probably been a while since a village had a full set of lynched gifteds.


Aka

--Cabbie


*headdesks, eats lunch, gets ready to head out again*

[McCaber]

Originally Posted by satansaloser2005

And that's why I don't vote early.

Originally Posted by Nienna

McCaber do you have thoughts on people?

Well, I've been thinking that Nilp's innocent since about Day 2. Boro looks pretty ok, and Brinn I completely failed to read, so I saw her as a "disposable choice", if you will. Someone to waste time on until a better option opened up.

[Boromir88]

Brinn looks pretty good, I really like #530, she has a large list of suspects. Maybe she was just throwing anything out to see what sticks, but, small, focused on the minimum number of people is very suspicious, and that has not been Brinn.

Plus her defense against sally, because of her wilwa vote looks innocent.

She was suspicious on Inzil for most of Day 2 and Day 3 and votes for him on Day 3.

I can't fault her for her logic on wanting to lynch Legate, because the same thing was virtually in my mind...I would have smothered myself if we had a wolf-Legate from a guard vote and just let him get a free pass.

Sorry I'm getting terribly sloppy and quick in my comments.

Edit: crossed with a bunches, might as well take a blind shot at someone

[Boromir88]

Nilp, why won't you consider to vote for Pitch or Greenie?

[Nienna]

Trying to find patterns... I deleted everyone's votes who is no longer alive (except the last day I kept Nog's in because he was important)

DAY ONE:

Lynch:
Nilp-->Nilp
Brinn-->Cabbie
Boro-->Kit (2)
Greenie-->Nog
Cabbie-->Wilwa (2)
Pitchie-->Kit (4)
Nienna-->Dun
Sally-->Kit (6)

Guard:
Brinn-->Legate
Sally-->Mnemo
Boro-->Nienna
Greenie-->Nienna (2)
Nienna-->Mnemo (2)
Pitchie-->Boro (4)

DAY TWO

Lynch
Nilp-->Dun
Boro-->Legate (2)
Greenie-->Legate (4)
Nienna-->Legate (5)
Brinn-->Legate (7)
Pitch-->Legate (8)
Cabbie-->Dun (3)
Sally-->Legate (12)


Guard
Nilp-->Wilwa
Boro-->Nerwen
Greenie-->Nog
Nienna-->Nerwen (2)
Brinn-->Shasta
Pitch-->Nog (2)
Cabbie-->Noggie (3)
Sally-->Nienna

DAY THREE

Lynch:
Nilp-->Dun
Nienna-->Dun (3)
Brinn-->Dun (5)
Greenie-->Sally
Pitchie-->Boro

Guard:
Nilp-->Boro
Nienna-->Shasta
Brinn-->Nerwen (3)
Greenie-->Pitchie (3)
Pitchie-->Shasta (2)
Sally-->Shasta (3)

Day Four

Lynch:
Greenie-->Hakon (2)
Boro-->Wilwa
Brinn-->Wilwa (3)
Nienna-->Hakon (3)
Sally--> Hakon (5)
Pitchwife--> McCaber

Guard:
Greenie-->Boro
Sally-->Nienna (2)
Nienna-->Sally
Pitchwife--> Nerwen
Brinn--> Nog

Day Five:

Lynch:
Nilp--> McCaber (2)
McCaber--> Pitchwife
Greenie--> Sally
Boro--> Pitchwife (2)
Brinn--> Wilwa
Nienna--> Wilwa (2)
Nog--> Wilwa (3)
Sally--> Wilwa (didn’t count)

Guard:
Nilp--> Boro
McCaber--> Nilp
Greenie--> Nienna
--Greenie-- Nienna
Greenie --> Wilwa
Boro--> Nog
Brinn--> Boro (2)
Nienna--> Nog (2)
Nog--> Boro (3)
Sally--> Nog (didn’t count)

[Nienna]

Evil:
Greenie

Leaning Evil:
Nilp
Pitchwife

No Idea:
Sally
Brinn

Leaning Innocent:
Boro

Innocent:
Nienna
McCaber

[satansaloser2005]

I had a think and came to this conclusion.

Good:
Sally (duh)
Cabbie (apparently)
Nienna

Meh:
Nilp
Boro
Brinn

Evil:
Greenie
Pitchie



I know, I know, my list looks a lot like Nienna's, but hers has nothing to do with mine. If Cabbie's innocent it changes my opinion on Pitch dramatically, and I've thought Greenie rather weird for a while. Wish I could explain more thoroughly, but alas, I can't.


Oh, and although it should be obvious....


++Cabbie

[Pitchwife]

Well, this is a nice mess to come back to. Alas for wilwa, our poor Hunter, and alas for Nogrod!
It hasn't been mentioned yet, but some of you may wonder whether I had a hand in Nog's death for coming after me yesterDay - and if the wolves are indeed trying to frame me, he was a consequent choice for the Night-kill. Truth is, there's no drop of his blood on my hands. I actually appreciated his grilling me and forcing me to explain myself, as it made me think things over and see more clearly, and I really regret he's not around any more to hear me defend myself.
These were the points of suspicion against me he brought forward yesterDay:
1. My Guard vote for Nerwen the Day before yesterDay
When I said 'obviously a good choice' I meant it. She looked innocent to me, and she'd been very reasonable and helpful all game long, so I thought she might well be the wolves' next victim - as indeed she was. Whatever doubts had kept me from Guard-voting her earlier dated back to the time when I suspected Boro, because of connections between them, and had dissolved by then.
2. My suspicion of Boro in #403 and the reasons given
Points 1, 2, 5 and 6 (pity I didn't number them) don't really hold any more, and weren't really crucial back then. What mattered most to me was that he tried very hard to convince us the wolves weren't using the NG for a frame, and his lack of comment after it had become clear they had in fact done so - but I later admitted that this lack may have been due to time issues.
'Creepy' probably was too strong a word to describe my impression of him. The thing is, I actually find it quite easy to trust him and was afraid I might therefore overlook something suspicious, so when I looked at him closely and found what looked to me like some fair reasons to suspect him, it kinda gave me the shivers.
3. My 'please suspect me' post (#432, quoted by Nog in #604)
Case of 'careful what you wish, you might get it'. Well, after my abominable voting on the first two Days, I thought people might have reason to be suspicious of me, and was a little surprised it hadn't happened yet. At the time, of course, I was still deluded enough to think that my defense of Zil was a good idea and I was actually doing better, or I would never have been sarcastic about it.
So in short, I do plead guilty of having made some serious mistakes, but I'm innocent of wolvery.

And now I'd like to concentrate on finding out who the real wolves are. I've not quite digested McCaber's reveal yet, but for the moment I tend to believe him.

[Pitchwife]

Originally Posted by McCaber

The night that the sun rose early, I guarded Nilp. Just on the off chance that it actually was a save and not something like the wolves not sending in a kill or one of those other special abilities.

I think it's clear that no save occurred that Night, as Eönwe said he would mention a save in the narration. So Nilp can't have been the wolves' target - there must be another explanation.
Talking about those secret roles again, I'm wondering whether we're ever going to find out about them. Has anybody else noticed Nog's armour and sword in last Night's narration?

[satansaloser2005]

Good news (for you lot at least). The person I was to interview had to leave town early so I came home and will be here for....another hour or so. But I'll definitely have to vote an hour before DL if not earlier.

[Nilpaurion Felagund]

Checking in @4AM local. Man, I must be crazy . . .

[Boromir88]

Post #104 is unsettling:

Legate, when you come back, would you mind explaining the reasoning behind your Guarding suggestions (Nerwen and Lommy)? I agree that Nerwen's been rather reasonable in her few posts, Lommy slightly less so from my perspective; I certainly don't grudge either of them the protection, but what exactly makes them stand out from others who have talked as much? (Not meaning myself - I'm just an ordo, no use Guarding me.)

He questions Legate about his guard choices, but asks them why he thinks those two stand out from the others. Looking to hone in on possible gifteds Pitch? Plus you just non-chalantly throw out there you'r innocent so there's no point in guarding you, but would the wolves want to be night-guarded?

In #107 he suspects Kitanna for the reasons given by me and Nerwen.

#113:

Kit, just when I've reluctantly decided you're my prime suspect, you have to say something I can see sense in (even if I don't agree)!*sigh*
You forgot McCaber, by the way. (Cancel that - he just showed up.)

But you still end up voting for Kitanna. And if she was your prime suspect why would you have to reluctantly decide it?

#134:

Sally, I think we can safely rule out Kit speculating on actually getting a majority for her Guard Hakon vote when there are several much more promising candidates around. Looks a little bit like a throwaway vote on her part.

But wasn't heard guard Hakon, and guarding the quiet the thing that you said was sensible?

#145:

Dang it, here I go again, wavering and second-guessing myself about my Kit suspicion. Her last post sounds agreeable enough on the surface, but looking closer at it, it seems just a little bit too noncommittal. The reason she gives for her vote for Brinn is a plain case of plagiarism, if I may say so; and however much I disagree with Brinn's own vote myself, I don't find it sufficient to condemn her.

Oh, like your own suspicions against Kitanna were not in fact, plagiarism? *points to #107

Day 2, #285:
Funny how Inzil said wilwa and Nienna seemed to know too much about the wolve's mind, but I don't recall Inzil saying anything towards Pitch about it:

There remains the one kill last Night when he was guarded. I can see the possibility of the wolves framing him - with the Seer dead, they may think they could afford losing one kill; and if he's innocent, he's attracting so much suspicion right now, detracting it from the wolves themselves, that they would be in no hurry to see him killed or lynched.

#311 his 'fellow' Kit voters:

Sally - has been very active and helpful yesterDay and toDay, so I fail to see how her retiring to do tallies for the last hour makes her suspicious (actually, it makes me wonder about Brinn and Nog suspecting her for such a frail reason).
Inzil - if I remember correctly from my other games with him, he behaved somewhat inscrutably both as a wolf and an innocent. I'd like to hear a little more from him, as most of his posts have been rather shortish.
Boro - looks good, all in all.
Nerwen - looks really good.
wilwa - has made some outstanding contributions, especially in her latest post; rather unsuspicious.
Lommy - now that's a hard one. I don't really know what to make of her, and her attempts to defend Legate (unless they have to do with life outside the village) don't sit right with me. But is it really probable she and Legs are wolves together?

Discards Nerwen and Me as simply looking good. Yet has quite a bit to say about Lommy, sally, and Inzil. 1 known innocent, 1 unknown, and 1 known wolf.

His reasons for not suspecting sally has nothing to do with her vote for Kitanna, but her vote tallies. And he turns suspicions on Nog and Brinn for pointing out sally's vote tallies.

He makes no statement of feelings about Inzil at all, the only person in his list of fellow Kit voters, he just wishes to hear more.

#316:

Sorry if you're innocent, but you'll understand we have to find out. (And I do sincerely hope you're not gifted!)

This is what he says when he votes Legate, kind of a wierd statement to make. You can tell us if you were secretly hoping he was gifted, Pitch, go on the truth sets us free.

#373 and #375 is more of Pitch sharing his mind about the wolf kills. Again, how come Inzil never pointed out you seemed to know the wolve's mind very well Pitchers? In both he also defense Inzil, and defends Nogrod.

#391:

That would be very funny indeed - even more if we actually managed to win that way against you veterans! (And NO, that was NOT a confession, of course!)

The truth will set you free.

#403

says Inzil feels wolfish quite early, for what seem to me very flimsy reasons;
supports Mnemo's plan, though cautiously;
says he can't see the wolves wasting a night-kill to frame somebody, and
thinks McCaber needs watching for suggesting they might;
concurs with Nog's suspicion of Lommy;
suspects Kit (which persuaded myself at the time) and votes her;
argues for lynching Legate, dismisses Legate's defense that he was framed (see above!), and votes him;
hasn't said anything notable about the fact that Leg was indeed framed, and says Nog is still suspicious because of the one kill.

Instead of restating what I've done, please point out what it is that made those things make me look suspicious? As I recall, Inzil turned out to be a wolf, my only regret is not following up on a vote for him, or sticking to my guns. His cool reaction was a lot different from the last time I suspected Inzil of wolvery (and was correct).

I persuaded you to vote for Kit? I've taken responsibility for that crapper mistake, while you continue to blame me for persuading you.

What would the point be in actually stating Legate was framed? The reason I suspected Nogrod still, is because I thought after that night when there was one kill, Nogrod immediately came out and tried to pass off he was innocent. However, as I told Nogrod I made an error, it was wilwa and Hakon.

And me agreeing with someone about one of their suspicions is sketchy...because? Weren't you the one who became persuaded to vote for Kitanna, because of me and Nerwen?

The lab I'm at is closing in 10 minutes, I'll head back and finish Pitch in a bit.

[satansaloser2005]

Originally Posted by Nilpaurion Felagund

Checking in @4AM local. Man, I must be crazy . . .

GO TO BED, CHILD!!!!



EDIT: x'd with Boro. Also, I'm really tired for some reason, so if I disappear it's 'cause I fell asleep for a bit.

[Pitchwife]

It just occurred to me - among the surviving wilwa voters (those whose vote counted), Brinn and Nienna can't both be wolves. Both of them contributed to Zil's lynching on Day 3 (Brinn giving him the third vote, Nienna the fifth), and I can see one wolf doing that, but hardly two. Nienna's vote, late in the bandwagon when Zil already looked like a lost case, seems more suspicious to me.
As for Greenie - she joined forces with my misguided effort to avoid lynching Zil, and voted to Guard me on the same Day (following Zil's example?). I don't quite know what to make of this. As a wolf who found me useful, she would have known I was in no danger of being Night-killed. So, Greenie, did you honestly believe we were right (as I did) ?

(x-ed from Nilp #677 onwards)