The Fellowship - doomed to fail

[Zigûr]

Originally Posted by IxnaY AintsaY

Saruman's expropriation of Orthanc soon after the last White Council seems like it would have been more than enough to cement him in Denethor's mind as untrustworthy; probably a rival, and possible an usurper. This would have been shortly after the last White Council, and decades before Denethor became Steward.

A very fair point, but it's also worth considering this statement from Appendix A:

"Thorongil had never himself vied with Denethor, nor held himself higher than the servant of his father. And in one matter only were their counsels to the Steward at variance: Thorongil often warned Ecthelion not to put trust in Saruman the White in Isengard, but to welcome rather Gandalf the Grey. But there was little love between Denethor and Gandalf; and after the days of Ecthelion there was less welcome for the Grey Pilgrim in Minas Tirith."

Saruman claimed Isengard in 2953, while Aragorn (as Thorongil) was in Gondor between 2957 and 2980. The fact that he and Denethor disagreed in counsel concerning wizards suggests that, for whatever reason, even after Saruman had claimed Isengard, Denethor still advocated Saruman as an ally at that time. On the other hand, as it is implied that Denethor may have already determined Thorongil's true identity by this point, it is possible that he did so more to spite Gandalf than out of genuine belief in Saruman's credibility. I suppose it's also possible that Aragorn was saying "Traditionally you've taken counsel from Saruman; trust Gandalf instead" while Denethor was arguing "Forsake the counsel of wizards altogether."

It's quite a knotty problem.