How do you perceive Tom Bombadil?

[PrinceOfTheHalflings]

Originally Posted by Zigûr

Personally I don't think the Ring was a "living thing" either. I'm fairly sure it was a mindless object. It contained much of Sauron's potency, but that is not exactly the same thing as his soul (which as far as I'm aware includes will/consciousness/even identity, perhaps). I know I've mentioned this a few times lately, but my interpretation is that the Ring had the effect on people that it did not because it had a will of its own (or even a facsimile of Sauron's will) but rather because it was made with evil intent, because its very functioning was to commit evil (dominating the wills of others is objectively evil according to the natural moral laws of Arda) and perhaps it took its power from an individual whose own power had become an "evil" power.

I feel as if there is actually a remark from Professor Tolkien that the Ring had no mind or will of its own but I cannot remember where I think I read such a remark.

Try these quotes for size:

Gandalf says, "The ring wants to be found. It wants to return to its Master," and also "The Ring was trying to get back to its Master. It had slipped from Isildur's hand and betrayed him..."

"It was not Gollum, Frodo, but the Ring itself that decided things. The Ring left him..."

which would all indicate that the Ring DID have a will of its own. Quotes are from Fellowship, Chapter 2, The Shadow of The Past.

As for Bombadil - since he is essentially a neutral in terms of Middle-Earth "politics" (like Treebeard, as has been pointed out) his helping Frodo is clearly an indication to me that Frodo's purpose is truly good.

[Zigûr]

Originally Posted by PrinceOfTheHalflings

Try these quotes for size:

Erm... okay.

Originally Posted by PrinceOfTheHalflings

which would all indicate that the Ring DID have a will of its own.

Yes I suppose it did have "will" in a sense, but I don't think it necessarily had "consciousness" or "identity" as it would conventionally be understood. Some very basic malevolent impulses evidently operated within it but I don't think this is the same as it being "alive" (which was my original argument).

Also, my point about the nature of its evil is more to do with the effect it had on people, ie making them suspicious and mistrustful, giving them delusions of grandeur, etc. The power within it "speaks" to something in the human heart without literally being conscious communication, in my view.

[Alcuin]

Tolkien describes the Rings as machines, though I don’t think he meant of the cog-and-wheel (or steampunk) variety: they seem more like computers on steroids. (Phones, cars, televisions, and nearly all lmodern appliances are computerized machines of this sort.)

I understand the US government has sponsored research into implantable computer chips, leading to a chip that has undone some of the memory loss of Alzheimer’s patients.

This idea lends itself immediately to the Rings of Power. Offsetting memory loss, alleviating the pain of PTSD, or allowing immediate access to massive database and computing power are all tremendous boons. Of course, there is no such thing as an unhackable computer. Moreover, anyone with a chip implant is vulnerable to (1) EMP, corresponding roughly to what happened to the Nazgûl when the One Ring was destroyed (and to a lesser extent to the Guardians of the Three: that’s probably why Elrond left Middle-earth: his phenomenal memory began to fail); and (2) “hacking” by Sauron via the One Ring, to whom the mind of anyone with a Great Ring was open as long as Sauron possessed the One.

Nor do I believe the Great Rings made the Noldor of Eregion invisible. One of the principal incentives to the Elves in making the Rings was arresting the process of fading, which caused their bodies (hröa) to be “consumed” by their spirits (fëar). Had the Rings made their Elven makers invisible, it would negate one of their most important reasons for making them! The effect on Men, however, could be quite different, since their hröa and fëar stood in a different relationship than those of Elves - the hröa of Men died and their fëar always left Arda, while the fëar of Elves could never leave Arda regardless of the condition or life of their hröa. There was no effect on Dwarves.

As for Bombadil, in Letters of JRR Tolkien #19, Tolkien says he is “the spirit of the (vanishing) Oxford and Berkshire countryside”; and in Letter #144, he calls Bombadil an “intentional” enigma. In a footnote to Letter 153 regarding Goldberry’s description, "He is," Tolkien remarks, "I can say ‘he is’ of Winston Churchill as well as of Tom Bombadil, surely?" in other words, Bombadil is not Eru. In Letter 237, Tolkien tells Rayner Unwin that Bombadil was "inserted" into the Lord of the Rings: the character existed before LotR, even before The Hobbit.

Going back to Letter 144, Tolkien continues,

… Bombadil is not an important person – to the narrative. I suppose he has some importance as a “comment”. [H]e is just an invention … and he represents something that I feel important, though I would not be prepared to analyze the feeling precisely. I would not, however, have left him in, if he did not have some kind of function. I might put it this way. The story is cast in terms of a good side, and a bad side, beauty against ruthless ugliness, tyranny against kingship, … and so on; … both sides in some degree … want a measure of control. But if you have … taken “a vow of poverty”, renounced control, and take your delight in things for themselves without reference to yourself, … then the question of the rights and wrongs of power and control might become utterly meaningless to you, and the means of power quite valueless. It is a natural pacifist view... [T]he view of Rivendell [is] that it is an excellent thing to have represented, but that there are in fact things with which it cannot cope, upon which its existence nonetheless depends. Ultimately only the victory of the West will allow Bombadil to continue, or even to survive. Nothing would be left for him in the world of Sauron.

What is this mysterious “comment” to which Tolkien refers? What function does Bombadil serve for Tolkien? Is it so obvious we miss it?

[littlemanpoet]

Originally Posted by Alcuin

What is this mysterious “comment” to which Tolkien refers? What function does Bombadil serve for Tolkien? Is it so obvious we miss it?

Perhaps. However, these are not the things asked for in this thread. The original post asked, what is Tom Bombadil to you?

[blantyr]

I don't take this seriously, but there are some who suggest Tom is Eru. If this is the case, he wanted a companion, and that in order to have Goldberry he had to create Middle Earth. Just a silly notion, but...

He's the loner that needs friends, but who chooses them carefully. He will do anything for those he befriends, but mostly leaves everyone alone. He and Goldberry have an ideal life, and just want to live it, but will make enough room for others who happen to wander through.

He has so much power that it is unimportant to him. He has enough that he need not hoard it or covet it. The games of power are trivial. He was born with a winning hand so why would he want to play the game? Still, even with all that power he cannot right every wrong in the world and doesn't see it as his role to try. He has his place, his lady, and his life to live, and he'll live it with simple joy.

I see Tom and Goldberry as an example of what could have been had Morgoth not poisoned the Song. What if the two trees had lived? What if the desire for power had not tainted creation? This was obviously not the case, but Tom could wish it so and make it so.

[Balfrog]

On the web-site, thstudioexec.com, it's reported that PJ is to direct a Tom Bombadil movie with Jeff Bribdges in the lead role. I have a feeling that even how scholars perceive TB may end up being influenced by the movie - eventually and subconsciously that is!

[littlemanpoet]

I hope it's not true. That would be awful. Something new to assign to Mordor, even.

[Zigûr]

Originally Posted by Balfrog

On the web-site, thstudioexec.com, it's reported that PJ is to direct a Tom Bombadil movie with Jeff Bribdges in the lead role. I have a feeling that even how scholars perceive TB may end up being influenced by the movie - eventually and subconsciously that is!

Originally Posted by littlemanpoet

I hope it's not true. That would be awful. Something new to assign to Mordor, even.

I very seriously doubt that it is true, given that a quick Google search reveals it stated on exactly that website alone and nowhere else. But, to be honest, I didn't need to Google it to know an unsubstantiated rumour when I see one. Such an announcement would be all over social media. This? Not a peep.

I even checked TORN to see if the film-worshippers were losing their minds over the idea. Nothing I could see. I'm fairly sure it's well-established that Peter Jackson has no further interest in "Tolkien films".

The point stands, however. Whenever I tell fellow academics at conferences that I study Professor Tolkien's works, they immediately ask me about my opinion of the films. They have coloured all manner of discourse.