Elrond's speech - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Inziladun · 08-20-2013, 04:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pervinca Took

What was the old crowning tradition? I'm away from my books and can't remember.

That the new king would either be given the crown by his father, the old king, or that he would take it from the body of the previous king in the Hallows.

Pervinca Took · 08-20-2013, 04:57 PM

Thanks. That makes sense. It's made me wonder, though, if all Aragorn's descendants would be allowed to "give back the gift" when they chose, or if this would alter as the Numenorean blood dwindled (as I would have thought it must, there being so few of Aragorn's kin left) - does it say in the Tale of Aragorn and Arwen that Aragorn surrendered the sceptre to Eldarion before closing his eyes? (Away from my books, so can't check at the moment).

Also wonder about the daughters, and whether they could lie down and die in old age, when weary.

Sorry, I know that this probably belongs in another thread.

Alfirin · 08-20-2013, 05:56 PM

Interesting question. I suppose it depends on if they'd ever get to that point. Whether or not the ability to "give back the gift" comes into play the simple fact is that lifespans among the heirs of Isildur do seem to get progressively shorter as the blood gets diluted. By our standards Aragorn lifespan is incredible (especially if you add on the theoretic "decline" years he probably would have had if he hadn't relinquished when he did, but it is only a fraction of what some of his ancestors had. And it is a safe bet his decedents would be shorter too..Though the fact that Eldarion has maternal Elvish blood in him may have given a bit of a re-infusion (Since Arven also "gave up life" it is unclear what kind of a mortal lifespan she was granted. After all, if ME is supposed to be our own far history, than eventually the lifespans on the people would have to come down to what the were in our own recorded past. Aragorn had no problem giving in in his time, but by that point he had had well over a century of prime of life. For someone of our time, who had only had 50 or so, It might be a harder choice. If dying in your prime meant dying at 30-40 (yes I know that the "everyone in the ancient times died young" is a fallacy, people living into the 60-70's and 80's was not all that uncommon (especially in the upper classes), but it still wasn't exactly the norm) with the first 20 or so years spent in childhood, adolescence, youth (not quite "your prime") hanging on a little longer might seem quite attractive. So after a while, the question might have become moot.

08-20-2013, 04:57 PM	#2
Pervinca Took Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: The Treetops, C/O Great Smials Posts: 5,035	Thanks. That makes sense. It's made me wonder, though, if all Aragorn's descendants would be allowed to "give back the gift" when they chose, or if this would alter as the Numenorean blood dwindled (as I would have thought it must, there being so few of Aragorn's kin left) - does it say in the Tale of Aragorn and Arwen that Aragorn surrendered the sceptre to Eldarion before closing his eyes? (Away from my books, so can't check at the moment). Also wonder about the daughters, and whether they could lie down and die in old age, when weary. Sorry, I know that this probably belongs in another thread. __________________ "Sit by the firelight's glow; tell us an old tale we know. Tell of adventures strange and rare; never to change, ever to share! Stories we tell will cast their spell, now and for always."

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08-20-2013, 05:56 PM	#3
Alfirin Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 435	Interesting question. I suppose it depends on if they'd ever get to that point. Whether or not the ability to "give back the gift" comes into play the simple fact is that lifespans among the heirs of Isildur do seem to get progressively shorter as the blood gets diluted. By our standards Aragorn lifespan is incredible (especially if you add on the theoretic "decline" years he probably would have had if he hadn't relinquished when he did, but it is only a fraction of what some of his ancestors had. And it is a safe bet his decedents would be shorter too..Though the fact that Eldarion has maternal Elvish blood in him may have given a bit of a re-infusion (Since Arven also "gave up life" it is unclear what kind of a mortal lifespan she was granted. After all, if ME is supposed to be our own far history, than eventually the lifespans on the people would have to come down to what the were in our own recorded past. Aragorn had no problem giving in in his time, but by that point he had had well over a century of prime of life. For someone of our time, who had only had 50 or so, It might be a harder choice. If dying in your prime meant dying at 30-40 (yes I know that the "everyone in the ancient times died young" is a fallacy, people living into the 60-70's and 80's was not all that uncommon (especially in the upper classes), but it still wasn't exactly the norm) with the first 20 or so years spent in childhood, adolescence, youth (not quite "your prime") hanging on a little longer might seem quite attractive. So after a while, the question might have become moot.