Art in Middle Earth.

[Mithalwen]

By smart I presume you mean intelligent? In which case I don't think it is fair. There is a difference between intelligence and knowledge. Modern teenagers may be educated and have lots of technology but most probably couldn't survive without them.

[Mumriken]

No I mean knowledge, with no public education at all men and dwarves knew little of anything but how to survive in the wild and how to fight. Most probably weren't encouraged to become scholars. The elves live long and had vast fields of knowledge. But I don't think they had any need for fiction like we do today.

We use fiction to escape reality, the elves created statues and monuments in memory of people to honor them. Do one honor a falling warrior by painting a portrait of him? Actually in a lot of ways they live more in reality in the fictional world of middle earth than we do today in our modern world.

[Inziladun]

Originally Posted by Mithalwen

By smart I presume you mean intelligent? In which case I don't think it is fair. There is a difference between intelligence and knowledge. Modern teenagers may be educated and have lots of technology but most probably couldn't survive without them.

Look at the "smartest people in the room" (at least as far as Men were concerned) in ME, the Númenóreans. Things didn't work out so well for them as a people.

There was a passing mention though in he Silmarillion of artworks in Númenor.

[QUOTE]Then suddenly fire burst from the Meneltarma, and there came a mighty wind and a tumult of the earth....and Númenor went down into the sea....with....all ....its riches, and its jewels and its webs and its things painted and carven....they vanished forever./QUOTE] Akallabêth

Like Mith said, it's not really fair to generalize our RL world as being so much the better for technology and such. I think a lot of people would prefer to live in ME, at least the 'Downs lot.

x/d with Mumriken

[Galadriel55]

If you put a man from ME into a com tech class he'd fail, but he'd live. If you were put into ME wilderness, I'm not so certain.

One type of knowledge does not make another worthless. One is not better than another. The ME man would most likely think you an idiot because you would not be able to do tasks that are simple and basic to him, while you think him an idiot because he can't do maths and etc. But both require knowledge. Don't scoff at the likes of Sam Gamgee and the Gaffer - they might know more about life, even if they know less about books.

But I can't really see how education - or lack of it - is relevant to making art. In those days you did not have to attend art school or anything like that to make it. I guess if you're a smith you won't carve statues, but you can still make art within your profession.

[Mumriken]

Cry me a river, all I'm saying is that most lived in hunter/gatherer societies or on farming. There were no intellectual centers in middle earth. The elves were too much caught up in reality to bury themself in fiction...which art basically is.

[Galadriel55]

Originally Posted by Mumriken

Cry me a river, all I'm saying is that most lived in hunter/gatherer societies or on farming. There were no intellectual centers in middle earth. The elves were too much caught up in reality to bury themself in fiction...which art basically is.

Once again, why do you need an intellectual centre to make art?

And why does art have to be fiction?

[Mumriken]

There is a difference between these two, i will say no more:

[Rumil]

There does appear to be a lack of descriptions of paintings in Middle Earth, but that doesn't really mean that there weren't any.

There aren't many places that you'd expect them to be described. Edoras had its tapestries - far more appropriate for Rohan's culture than oil paintings, frescoes or icons to my mind. I'd certainly expect to see this sort of art in Gondor, but we are only really shown the description of the Avenue of Kings as Faramir Jones posted above. Now this fair but cold hall of stone and sculpture fits Minas Tirith so very well, especially Denethor's character. It's maybe a reminder of classical architecture as an instrument of power - big and impressive to overawe visitors, impersonal too, no natural colours etc.

This does rather hint at Greece and Rome, but as we know today classical sculpture etc was usually brighly painted, even to the extent of appearing gaudy to us.

So maybe painted art was widespread in Minas Tirith but we just didn't get to see any. To be fair there was a war on, so perhaps Pippin just didn't have the time to tour the gallery.

Apart from what's mentioned above, the only hint of paintings I can think of aren't mentioned in the books, but are just possibly shown in one of Tolkien's own drawings. Where? Well, the front hall of Bag End of course.



Now these might be paintings or possibly mirrors. The one on the left might be reflecting the view out of the front door, or it might be a painting of that view. The perspective seems a bit off for it to be a mirror, and a curved mirror should give a distorted image but JRRT wasn't really a professional artist so could well have got it a bit wrong. The other picture/mirror shows just a swirl. No way of guessing what this is. But as said above I could certainly see the Gentle-hobbitry hanging paintings of notable ancestors or nice landscapes.