T-I-G WW LXXIV: War of the Wolves

[wilwarin538]

Originally Posted by Isabellkya

If Wilwa is not going to help us, then why should we spare her? Her win depends on her survivial. Which entails that we are helping her, by not voting for her - or in the wolves' case, not killing her at Night. So why exactly should we help you, Wilwa?

In the villager's case: you can't afford to waste a lynch on me, there are 4 wolves around and there are only 2 of you. So I'm not worried.

In the wolve's case: they have to get rid of the other pack before they can win, and there's a Ranger around that is a bigger threat to them. Yeah, they could kill me, but I'm certainly not their biggest priority right now, and I'm also a *potential* ally for them. So I'm slightly worried there, but not too too worried at this point.

Basically: I'm not asking for your help.

[Boromir88]

Phew, that was close...nasty evils of Time Warner. First cable box goes capoot, now internet's sketchy.

I am quite nervous about Kitanna's vote...I'm not nervous out of revenge, I just don't get it. I can see how in an round-about way being level-headed and calm could = wolvish, but she's reading my offer to wilwa in a way that's just not there. How was anything I said "Be on my team or I kill you?" I admitted to the exact opposite, we literally can't lynch her.

Wilwa's made her decision, at indecision, so be it. I sad we needed her, but if she's going to dangle her position of power in front of our faces, I'm going to take some dignity back. She's going to need us if she wants to win.

So yep, not liking that vote and I'm really not likely no one has come in to say "Got a wolf for you, vote ______ (insert one of the remaining names)"

[Boromir88]

Umm does that mean it's DL then?

[wilwarin538]

Originally Posted by Boro

She's going to need us if she wants to win.

If by 'us' you mean that you're a wolf, yes. If by 'us' you mean that you're an innocent, no. I can win without the village ya know, and your threats are just annoying me a bit, especially if you really are an innocent.

[Isabellkya]

Why exactly are you voting for Kitanna, Pitch?

[Pitchwife]

Izzy - what I said in my last list, and before, + a bit of wild guessing, + running out of time.

[Boromir88]

Originally Posted by wilwarin538

If by 'us' you mean that you're a wolf, yes. If by 'us' you mean that you're an innocent, no. I can win without the village ya know, and your threats are just annoying me a bit, especially if you really are an innocent.

You know I love you, but if you think I'm going to like someone dragging us around for amusement I'm not going to like it much.

With that said...

++Izzy

Don't have much of a good reason more of a crap shoot with good odds

Edit: highlighting vote

[satansaloser2005]

*cough* highlight *cough*


Three minutes. ^_^

[Isabellkya]

++Boromir

Mostly because there is less than two minutes left, and I am unsure about Kitanna.. too many wolves.

[wilwarin538]

Originally Posted by Boromir88

You know I love you, but if you think I'm going to like someone dragging us around for amusement I'm not going to like it much.

Dragging? That's a bit harsh. Maybe pulling would be a better word.

My vote then:

++Boro

Sorry love.

[satansaloser2005]

DL!

Gimme a tick to double check, k? K.

[Boromir88]

Originally Posted by Isabellkya

Mostly because there is less than two minutes left, and I am unsure about Kitanna.. too many wolves.

So you're the other wolf seer! Dah da dum

[satansaloser2005]

YOU'RE BACK! *hugs Boro* Heh we missed you!

[Isabellkya]

Crap, I forgot about the fifteen minute thing, was stuck in traffic.

So.. two minutes or so left?

X'd with Pitch and Dun.

[satansaloser2005]

Originally Posted by Isabellkya

Crap, I forgot about the fifteen minute thing, was stuck in traffic.

So.. two minutes or so left?

X'd with Pitch and Dun.

DL is back to normal.

[satansaloser2005]

DL in ~15 minutes, dears.

[Inziladun]

I forgot about the DL shift too. That last post took forever to write, and this lousy computer logged me off before I could send it.

Bloody hell.

++Kitanna

I don't know what Boro is, but I don't have time to do anything else toDay. The odds are with us getting a wolf, though.

x/d with Sally. Gah!

[Inziladun]

I apologise for being such a non-entity toDay. I left work only 2 hours ago, and now I'm working an extra job, using an elderly laptop. :

I wanted to look at all the ones who'd been among the quiet ones, meaning Boro, Izzy, and Kitanna. All three appear to have been more active toDay though. But anyway...

Originally Posted by Kitanna

Wilwa does make a point we'd be helping the second wolfpack by getting rid of the first since Pack A can't win until Pack B is gone. However, I'll have to go with the sentiment that "a wolf is a wolf" at this point. We have to lynch one before we can put him/her into a team. Still, I don't see this as a real sign against Wilwa.

I refreshed my page and I could have sworn there was more to this quote. Something about how it looked like Wilwa was advising us not to lynch wolves, but it seems to have disappeared. *stares suspiciously at Nerwen*

First post. Maybe a bit wishy-washy. Says Wilwa has a point, but she doesn't agree with her. Then adds Wilwa shouldn't be suspected for her statement about helping one pack get rid of the other.
Also starts what became a rather large point of discussion that Day, Nerwen's 'slip' about the post-edit she made. Of course, we now know Nerwen was innocent.

Originally Posted by Kitanna

I have forty minutes to read the thread, make my decision, and vote. Ugh, work days.

My first thought (and I should have mentioned it earlier) goes make to what Nogrod said in regards to Wilwa. After he highlighted her little bit about "helping" one team by destroying the other, I found it interesting both Nerwen and Inziladun commented on it. On Inziladun's part it was "hey yeah, this is interesting" but no further comment on it. Nerwen said something more along the lines that would Wolf-Wilwa be so careless in her speech?

Nerwen asks for her editing to not be blown out of proportion. Nogrod says this on the subject:

I agree with him on the fact she chose not to make her change public. However, I think innocents are just as conscious to what is being posted because they're as likely as a wolf to be lynched for mistyping or misconstruing their point. No one wants to be killed regardless of side and I don't follow Nogrod's reasoning completely on Nerwen as suspicious because what player isn't conscious of mistakes they make?

Defends Nerwen.

Originally Posted by Kitanna

I hate that I have to do it this way, knowing full well the possible repercussions of such an early vote, but I need to get back to work.

Here's the only person that has popped out to me more than once at this point.

++Inziladun

Nogrod pointed out Wilwa's post about "helping" one wolf team by eliminating the other. Inziladun agrees. Nogrod points out Nerwen's editing and how she didn't make it public. Again Inziladun agrees, but doesn't really cast suspicion on Wilwa or Nerwen.

Before Norgrod says anything about Nerwen Inziladun says:
After Norgrod posts, he says:

Granted he never said he thought Nerwen was innocent or anything, but he changes his tune from her edit was just a mistake to she's suspicious because of it and all in light of someone else's comment.

I wish I could stay longer and didn't have to vote so hastily, but such as life I suppose.

A vote for me, based upon what I said about Nerwen. She says I flip-flopped, but herself admitted I never said Nerwen was innocent because of her mistake. Someone else said that though.....

Originally Posted by Kitanna

I..er...wow. That's...wow. Such the bloodbath last night.


If you look at the rest of that list Izzy is the only one she had felt good about. And she admits she has no real reason. It's a stretch that Lommy dreamt Izzy and revealed it in her first post, but maybe it's something to take into account. There is definitely something strange with Lommy's reasons for Izzy in that first post.

But in her third post she has this to say:

Lommy seems to give no reasons for trusting any of these people. In fact she's all over the place. I do believe she probably listed her dream, but by post three she's listed five people who she is inclined to believe are innocent and she only had one dream. I doubt she dreamt of Nogrod or she'd have tried very hard to have him lynched. Perhaps Nerwen was her dream? That would explain why at least Lommy's pack went after her in the night. However, by Lommy's post she's moved Nerwen to the enigma category. Me thinks my tired brain is looking for a hint in Lommy's posts that simply isn't there.

I will return after some sleep to make sense of Lommy's posts and my thoughts on them.

Spends time trying to puzzle out Lommy's dream. Maybe that wasn't a waste of time, like I thought at the time, but I didn't get anything from thinking on it.

Originally Posted by Kitanna

I went back to read all the posts AFTER Nogrod pegs Lommy as a wolf in the hopes maybe one of her packmates slipped up. I ignored posts by Shasta, Sally, Nerwen, and Morsul.

Wilwa: Believes him to be the seer, seeing that it makes sense for an innocent seer to reveal as he did rather than run the risk of being killed in the night. In a later post she defends Nogrod's reveal from Sally and Boro.

Legate: Placed Nogrod in his yellow area, but he also admitted he didn't have the time to recheck the thread before turning in for the night. He placed Lommy in his green section. At the end of his post he added an edit about having seen what Nogrod revealed.

Boro: Asks if a wolf seer would reveal so soon. Puts forth several possibilities to other avenues. (such as wolf seer trying to look good, non-wolf seer trying to benefit his pack, I'm guessing he means lead the village away from the real wolf seer.) In a later post explains why he didn't want to jump on board and trust Nogrod without considering other options.

Izzy: Seems to agree with Wilwa and trusts Nogrod. Feels Legate is buttering Nog up.

Zil: Trusts Nogrod it looks like, but finds it unusual that he revealed when he was in no danger.

Pitch: Believes Nogrod to be a seer because no one would be foolish enough to lead us to lynch an innocent.

TEW: Knows it's a seer claim, nothing else really said.

Conclusions:
Wilwa: At first I was wary because she so readily agreed with Nogrod. But as I read on in her posts after that initial one she made good points as to why an innocent Nogrod would reveal so soon. Her continued defense of his reveal speaks more innocent to me than wolfish.

Boro: I like that Boro considered other options as to Nogrod being a wolf revealing to look good. I'm inclined to trust for this because he continued to defend this position that he didn't want to enthusiastically jump into believing Nogrod without giving it some thought. The fact that Wilwa and Boro both felt strongly enough in one direction or the other that they kept defending their points rather than just agreeing and voting makes me think more innocent at this point.

Legate: Didn't have time to really react in full to the reveal, but his brief reaction was suspect to me. He immediately glomped onto Nogrod it looked like and had a sort of "oh darn I was wrong about you and Lommy" all along.

TEW, Zil, Pitch, and Izzy: All are hard to read not giving much away after Nogrod's reveal. For the most part all fall into "Nogrod is telling the truth because why would he lie so early?" category. Legate falls into this too, but his "you were right, I was wrong" edit in his vote post seemed forced.

Unfortunately I can't come home from work on my lunch break to vote. There hasn't been a whole lot of activity today either and I was in a time crunch so I could only focus on a small number of posts. But here's my vote.

++ Legate

Of all those that reacted after the reveal of Nogrod his seemed the most forced. It looked as though he was trying to pull himself closer to Nogrod and distant himself from Lommy. Possible packmates?

Best of luck for the rest of the day.

Votes Legate, before Nog gave his dream. I don't think it's likely she's an Aphid, for that reason. Then again, it's not impossible that was a furry plan.

Originally Posted by Kitanna

You're missing a name there. What about Boro?

And we only have Wilwa's word that she's completely innocent of wolvery. Though it'd be very cunning or possibly very stupid for her to claim otherwise given the odds at this point.

Brings up we only have Wilwa to say she's the Anti-Lover. True, but as she says, unlikely to be a scheme of an evil Wilwa.

Originally Posted by Kitanna

"Help the 'village' Wilwa. *wink wink*"

Though his little plea does seem..shifty, Boro has a point. Wilwa is in a very uniqu]e position. She can choose to help the wolf teams and ally herself with those she feels are part of one team or another or she can help the village. The problem is we'd never know the path she took until it was potentially too late, but killing her isn't a good idea either. You, Wilwa, are going to be the slippery wild card.

Starts casting some suspicion Boro's way. Comments on Wilwa's freedom to pick her side.

Originally Posted by Kitanna

I'm been having a look at our odds.

Me
Pitchie
Zil
Elfie
Izzy
Boro
Wilwa

Four of our seven our wolves and Wilwa is a wild card so we really only have two innocents, our unicorn and ranger. But if I understand correctly if the unicorn dies an innocent comes back to life, so that's helpful, but I'd rather not have the unicorn killed just to return a known innocent who then becomes an easy target at night. And what of our ranger? He/she is in a tight spot because revealing in case of danger signs his/her death warrant at night. And we still have a seer wolf for Legate's team, which means if his/her dreams were chosen wisely that team has an edge over the rest of us.

So who are the four we've got lurking about? I need to get to work. I will come home on my lunch break to comment some more and vote.

All right, thinks a dead Unicorn would be helpful because a known innocent would replace xem, but doesn't want that to happen, because the Revived would then be a 'target'. I don't understand why she talks of the Ranger revealing, Of course xe shouldn't!

Originally Posted by Kitanna

Doesn't that usually herald a swift and painful death by night? Or so experience would have me believe.

I have a question about the Unicorns. They die and an innocent comes back in their place, correct? Well then is it really in the villages best interest to lynch one either? An innocent comes back and in the case of the wereunicorn a wolf is knocked out too, but then we have a known innocent that could potentially be only useful for a day before they become a nighttime kill. Two days if the ranger survives and protects them, but as a known innocent they become a likely target at night. So is it really in anyone's best interest to kill the unicorns? Maybe I've misunderstood how this role works, but it seems like it'll only benefit the village for a short while before we get thrown into confusion again over roles.


Is that a threat to get Wilwa on your side, Boro?

Says again the Unicorns shouldn't be killed because they ordos that replace them will just be killed at Night. I don't get that argument at all. More innocents=more work for the wolves. How is that bad? And the Were must be killed for a vilage win.

Originally Posted by Kitanna

I suppose. I guess I just find the whole idea silly and baffling. *shrug* I'll just hide and pretend the unicorns don't exists and we just have wolf and innocent right now.

Originally Posted by Kitanna

If the wolves go after the same kill it could potentially happen. I wasn't really thinking in terms of how many people we have left. Like i said, the role just confuses me. But I think my questions have been answered now.

So I realize I haven't really been able to keep up so well in this game. I usually have enough time to go over specific posts rather than all of them. It doesn't really provide the best basis for a vote, but a Kit has to work. That said, I was really only able to look at today's post and a few from yesterday.

++ Boro

He seemed level headed and helpful enough to start with. I liked that he didn't jump immediately into accepting Nogrod's seer claim and that he felt strongly enough to continue to defend it. Today, however, his pleas with Wilwa look none to right. His first one looked like he was trying to sweet talk her.

But then there's this:

Looks like he's saying "I can end you with one PM to our moddess tonight. Ally yourself with me toDay."

These posts look too far out of place for Boro and they don't look like the work of an innocent villager to me.

Originally Posted by Kitanna

Our hunter could be brought too or Morsul (though he dropped out on his own accord, so probably not.) We have no guarantee it'd be Nogrod. So would we want the risk?

edit: Best of luck. I won't return until day's over.

And a vote for Boro. Now, I'm not comfortable with Boro either, but it all seems to have come out of left field about him. Hmm.

[Pitchwife]

Oops - thanks for the correction.

++Kit

EDIT: x-ed with Zil