TIG: LXV - Our fate lies with...them?

[Boromir88]

Originally Posted by alonariel

Blasphemy! I went to the midnight release with Lari and blew about 30 dollars on it, ticket and Redvines included.

Sally, traveller has two L's in it? Who knew?

My roommate went to the mid-night release...not sure what I was doing that night.

It's quite funny because that's what wilwa is leaving to see, and I'm pretty sure she spelled it with 1 L....now I'm terribly confused

[satansaloser2005]

Originally Posted by Boromir88

It's quite funny because that's what wilwa is leaving to see, and I'm pretty sure she spelled it with 1 L....now I'm terribly confused

It can be spelled either way. I believe the movie title is with one, though I spell it with two because it looks better to me. Also, is that the UK way to spell it? 'Cause that might explain why I'm weird and spell it that way. Never know.


And I digress. Back to Shasta.

[alonariel]

Originally Posted by Boromir88

My roommate went to the mid-night release...not sure what I was doing that night.

It's quite funny because that's what wilwa is leaving to see, and I'm pretty sure she spelled it with 1 L....now I'm terribly confused

Microsoft Word says it's spelled with one L...

[mormegil]

Wow! There sure is a lot of productive talk going on *glares at Boromir*

Now, I've been keeping this in the back of my mind since day 1 but haven't done much about it yet. However, I notice some are picking up on it too so I'd like to mention what I've noticed about Formendacil. I've reread many of his post just recently to either help persuade is dissuade my suspicion of him. What I decided is he looks more villainous than before. One of the recurring themes that kept being woven into many posts was his past. He kept referring to this is how he always does things, or when something was not normal he made a point to show us that it wasn't normal. Either way he kept trying to tell us he is overall acting very normal and trying reassure us when he doesn't. Ordos don't worry about that stuff.

++Formendacil

I am almost certain he is our bear and that Sally and Atume are wolves.

[Boromir88]

Originally Posted by mormegil

Wow! There sure is a lot of productive talk going on *glares at Boromir*

*runs off to make himself supper to avoid morm's glare* I'll remain strictly observational until the deadline.

[Formendacil]

Originally Posted by mormegil

Wow! There sure is a lot of productive talk going on *glares at Boromir*

Now, I've been keeping this in the back of my mind since day 1 but haven't done much about it yet. However, I notice some are picking up on it too so I'd like to mention what I've noticed about Formendacil. I've reread many of his post just recently to either help persuade is dissuade my suspicion of him. What I decided is he looks more villainous than before. One of the recurring themes that kept being woven into many posts was his past. He kept referring to this is how he always does things, or when something was not normal he made a point to show us that it wasn't normal. Either way he kept trying to tell us he is overall acting very normal and trying reassure us when he doesn't. Ordos don't worry about that stuff.

++Formendacil

I am almost certain he is our bear and that Sally and Atume are wolves.

While, admittedly, I am on nearly a full hour later than I expected to be (I am totally blaming the used bookstore, especially since anyone here who disapproves of getting a copy of Tolkien's Pictures is an Inktomi Slurp Spider and deserves death!), but I'm still highly--very highly--amused that after bothering to warn against an Inziladun-vote-for-Morm (ie. saying when I'd be back), I get almost that.

Really, though, Morm, you're memory is grossly flawed if you don't remember that I constantly refer to normal playing styles. Granted, my own playing style can hardly be called "normal" when I play about 2 games a year, but even so, having recently gone through old games to update my Grimoire just after the last game, I feel confident in saying this is normal. You can either take my word for it, or read through half a dozen old and buried threads to confirm it.

I'm rather more miffed that you voted for me after sparing me so little attention--a couple of minor "Form looks a touch suspicious"-type posts early toDay, and lots of banter then about other stuff, and then this is as in-depth as I get? The old Morm would have given me the full police-style breakdown.

Oh wait... there's another reference to the old days. My abject apologies.

[alonariel]

Okay, so a serious post for now. I've got class at 7 tonight that goes until 10, so I'm going to have to decide my vote (or no-vote) within the next few hours. So, a narrowed down list for now:

Durelin - what I posted earlier still stands - why did she vote based only on the three way tie?
morm - I had a hunch about him yesterDay, but was surprised to see that other people voted for him, too. I think I stated it was just a hunch. I'm less certain of his being evil after re-reading through Day 2, however.
autume - People think she's being chummy, I think it's just being nice. We're turning out to have a similar style so far. Still keeping an eye out, as she could be a newbie wolf, but that's less than a hunch right now.
Sally - I honestly believe it was just a mistake, though her attempt to explain it all out has created quite some confusion and, consequently, some suspicion from me.
Nerwen - unsure, but keeping an eye on her
Lommy - Grateful comment still bugs me, but other than that, I don't have a whole lot of suspicion for her at this point

[Thinlómien]

Morm, you just made me postpone my bed-time and go to read through Form's posts to see whether what you say makes sense and whether my fix idée is grounded or not.

[Thinlómien]

Originally Posted by Form

We have one retraction in this game, right? *seems to remember that we have a potential No Vote and can retract that as our single retraction, so uses that as his self-evidence*
++ Mirandir
...because she's first on my grumpy list and I can change it later when I'm more awake. For now, it's 1:10 am in my timezone, I have a cough, and I'm grouchy. Sorry, Mira darling. But not very sorry.

He uses quite a lot of energy to say it's just a retractable grumpy vote.

Originally Posted by Form

I realise, for those older players who remember (or the younger ones who may have read back), that this may seem a trifle anti-Formendacil in style, since it makes it sound like I think we have a good chance of catching a baddie on Day 1. We don't--let me make that clear--or, rather, we have exactly as much a chance as usual. I continue to aver, as I always have, that we're grossly unlikely to reason our way to finding a Wolf (or Bear, for that matter) on Day 1, but the stats show that Fenris lynches are not impossible, so we may as well at least try for one of those. Also, to emphasize the often forgotten second half of my anti-Day 1 thesis: "Day 1s are useless to analyse on Day 1." My point being that we'll be wanting a voting record tomorrow to analyze, and voting for Fea is an abdication of that, every bit as much as No Voting, but with the psychological pretension that it's an actual vote.

Explaining himself too much again. Why would it occur to explain a thing most people would not even think about it unless it is something sinister? If a normal Form prefers to be careful and hates Day1 lynches, what would drive him to act differently, if not the role of a bear? (A bear needs to maximise the destruction because it takes him ages to get to the situation where he wins.)

I noticed this though:

Originally Posted by Form

My second thought regards Hakon. I more or less agree (bearing in mind that I skim read a page or two of this thread...) with everything Rikae said in argument against his plots and schemes, but he is the spitting image of the "All-Too-Easy Day 1 Scapegoat" vote... who might be a newbie in some games, or just too noisy... or too quiet... or too easy... or whatever... in others. He's rubbed me enough the wrong way with his suggestions that I can't honestly say he seems a village asset, but that has all the hallmarks of a Village Ordo.

I'm not sure if he would have killed him if this is what he thought.

Originally Posted by Form

Innocent:
Formendacil

Sorry Alona and Boro, I will be the smiley dictator yet for a while - but doesn't that smiley seem somewhat disturbing? I think it looks sort of... nervous to add it there.

Originally Posted by Form

Brinn baffles me too--her death, that is. After the Hakon death, I was expecting a somewhat wilder kill from the Bear--one of the village loudmouths or noisemakers. Well, "expecting" is a strong word, but I definitely would have inclined that way. As it is, however, Brinn has been quite quiet, and thus less readable. Her death, however, takes the Bear in completely the opposite direction of Hakon's--unless they were both completely unconnected to the Bear as far as posts went. I was more expecting, though, to wake up and find someone like Alona gone--someone making more noise, and generally more suspicious.

And this still rubs me the wrong way - he is too analytical about the bear's picking patterns and tactics and generally just thinking too much of the bear not to be the bear himself.

That's it. Seems like my fix idée has some base (but it could have more). It still gets my vote:

++Formendacil

Better get rid of the bear early and thus lower the amount of kills during the Nights.


edit: xed with everybody except Boro's first post after mine

[Nessa Telrunya]

Mmmm, neither alona or Form are looking very good right now. I just can't figure out who looks more suspicious...


Who to vote for?

[Rikae]

The Form case looks rather weak. He's one to reminisce about the old days quite a lot in any event - and the smiley? I like it. It's funny.

Lommy (not just for the Form stuff) and Nienna are just somehow creepy. I have to give this more thought... but they both give a going-with-the-flow, looking-for-a-wagon-to-join-rather-than-a-wolf sort of feel. More later, I have to go make ice cream sundaes.

[Durelin]

Originally Posted by Lommy

And this still rubs me the wrong way - he is too analytical about the bear's picking patterns and tactics and generally just thinking too much of the bear not to be the bear himself.

The bear can think about being the bear all he/she likes, but it's a different matter entirely to type up his/her thoughts and post them. In other words, I don't think that argument has much to it.

I was under the impression Form always explains himself, among other things, a lot. Explaining is a favorite past-time of many people I know, and I am at least under the impression that he is one of them.

I do tend to trust Form rather than distrust, and I cannot say I can read him, but I have absolutely no idea where people are getting some huge bear vibe, maybe particularly because I don't know what a bear vibe is. All anyone seems to have to offer is that a bear likes to talk about his/herself, which I don't buy.

Anyway...sudden attention so completely away from Sally (and alona) is not *necessarily* bad, but is definitely weird.

Originally Posted by Nienna

I went through all of Sally's posts and she doesn't seem like the wolf/baddie-Sally that I have seen and called out in previous games.

So what does a wolf/baddie-Sally look like?

Originally Posted by alona

Durelin - what I posted earlier still stands - why did she vote based only on the three way tie?

You're just hung up on it cause I picked you. I did not want to leave the lynch up to chance, and I wanted my vote to count for something. I waited as long as I felt it was safe to vote, waiting to see if someone else would break the tie, and making up my mind whether I needed to break the tie or could just vote for Mira (though by the end I had decided that tie or not, I was going to vote you rather than throw away my vote). But no one chose to break it until the last minute. Inziladun and morm seemed innocent to me, you did not. And I am still perfectly happy with my vote.

[Durelin]

Originally Posted by Nessa

Who to vote for?

How about whom you think to be suspicious, and not just someone who looks to be on the lynching block other than Sally?

[alonariel]

Originally Posted by Durelin

Anyway...sudden attention so completely away from Sally (and alona) is not *necessarily* bad, but is definitely weird.

This Form suspicion has seemed to come not from nowhere, but definitely almost as a sidetrack from me and Sally. It's confusing and is inadvertently adding to my suspicion of Sally. I think I'm gonna go back and do another read-through of Day 2...

Originally Posted by Durelin

So what does a wolf/baddie-Sally look like?

When I played with her last game, she was very wolfish. Very obvious to the point where I didn't think she could be a wolf because it was so obvious. Does that make sense?

Originally Posted by Durelin

You're just hung up on it cause I picked you. I did not want to leave the lynch up to chance, and I wanted my vote to count for something. I waited as long as I felt it was safe to vote, waiting to see if someone else would break the tie, and making up my mind whether I needed to break the tie or could just vote for Mira (though by the end I had decided that tie or not, I was going to vote you rather than throw away my vote). But no one chose to break it until the last minute. Inziladun and morm seemed innocent to me, you did not. And I am still perfectly happy with my vote.

That's probably true! It's just the wording that caught me off guard, but I understand your reasoning.

[Formendacil]

To respond to Lommy's sundry accusations...

Originally Posted by Thinlómien

He uses quite a lot of energy to say it's just a retractable grumpy vote.



Explaining himself too much again. Why would it occur to explain a thing most people would not even think about it unless it is something sinister? If a normal Form prefers to be careful and hates Day1 lynches, what would drive him to act differently, if not the role of a bear? (A bear needs to maximise the destruction because it takes him ages to get to the situation where he wins.)

Really?

Do you not read my LJ, Lommy? You're suspecting me on the basis of talking a lot and too much navel-gazing ramifications? I'm one of those people--believe it or not--who thinks things through too much and has an easier time writing five paragraphs on a subject than limiting myself to a single sentence, though I think I manage not to ramble entirely too much... but that's not for me to decide. All the same, I'm shocked you'd have me lynched on what is essentially my online hallmark.

Regarding your parenthetical comment about a bear wanting to maximize the destruction--I agree with that, as far as it goes, but you haven't thought things through far enough. I am not, in fact, in the post you quote, acting differently from my normal Day 1 self. I am, in fact, taking great pains to make it clear that what I am doing is consistent with my normal, much expressed opinion. Perhaps it's the philosophy student in me, perhaps it's the OCD, but I try quite hard to be consistent in the views I hold. If, therefore, my Day 1 action is suspicious, you're going to have to prove it on the grounds other than my own statement that I was doing something different--because I was not doing something at all inconsistent with my normal practice.

Originally Posted by Lommy

Sorry Alona and Boro, I will be the smiley dictator yet for a while - but doesn't that smiley seem somewhat disturbing? I think it looks sort of... nervous to add it there.

I'm... I'm not even going to dignify what with a written responce. But you can put these in your pipe and smoke them:

Originally Posted by Lommy

And this still rubs me the wrong way - he is too analytical about the bear's picking patterns and tactics and generally just thinking too much of the bear not to be the bear himself.

*blinks*

I'm too analytical?

We're playing Werewolf, of all things, and you think I'm being too analytical? I'm not saying I couldn't be the bear speculating out loud about my own strategies as the bear to misdirect people... but, at the same time, in a game that basically thrives on analysis and reading-into... you're going to convict me on that? Haven't you ever played with Nogrod? (*is being rhetorical... I know the answer)

Originally Posted by Lommy

Better get rid of the bear early and thus lower the amount of kills during the Nights.

Now that, Miss Lommy is a fair point. Unfortunately, it's the first one in this post. I'm not the bear, but apparently no one else is showing obvious Bear-signs. Though, really, why should the Bear be that obvious? S/he doesn't have inside knowledge of anyone's role but his/her own--like the Ordos. S/he doesn't dream about or talk to anyone--like the Ordos. And if a Bear has half a set of smarts, s/he should have the sense to eat people that won't leave a trail back to him/her. Really, anyone who appears suspicious during the Day is more likely to be a Wolf, because they're covering for other people that cripples how they can play. A Bear, on the other hand, has goals like a Wolf, but can play more like an Ordo.

All that being said, I still think we can catch the Bear... but I'm not sure we'll be able to distinguish him/her from a wolf before the narration... and you know how certain we can be in any case before that.

[Nienna]

The voice of dead Fea (who is currently re-reading the book) says "One. Don't tell me anything about it (the movie). Two. Go read the darned book."

Ok... back to ww. So I'm thinking this thing between Sally and Rikae is possibly just two ordos not agreeing and latching onto suspicions. I went through all of Sally's posts and she doesn't seem like the wolf/baddie-Sally that I have seen and called out in previous games.

Shasta still worries me. He hasn't been around very much and what he has done while around has been quite suspicious... especially his voting. I look forward to an analysis of him as I don't have time to do one myself.

[Boromir88]

Originally Posted by Nienna

The voice of dead Fea (who is currently re-reading the book) says "One. Don't tell me anything about it (the movie). Two. Go read the darned book."

That I have accomplished. I was hoping to get through the Deathly Hallows this summer, but seeing as I start in a week, and I have a more important book to get through, that won't happen.

Edit:

Originally Posted by Lariren Shadow

I would also like to say that I will not be able to be here at Deadline. I shall be at the A's vs. Yankees game.

Please tell me you are not a Yankees fan? One of you loves the Cowboys and if another is a Yanks fan...wow...I'm just without speech at the moment.

"Yes, morm...I know. Don't worry morm....I'm done now." *returns to bagel sandwhich*