WWLXII: Dead Men Do Tell Tales

[Mithalwen]

I do understand a moddess' dilemma - it was having faced so many that perhaps made me suspect Gwath was being spared for a reason. Only comment was that it would have been fairer if we had been told he would NOT be mod killed (which the rules provided for in exceptional cases) so perhaps he would have been considered sooner.
And while it was a handicap losing Mira the wolves did have the upper hand in knowledge - it isn't like we KNEW we were a wolf down. Really miraculous how close we came.

[Boromir88]

First I'll just say I'm not angry with anyone, win or lose, it doesn't matter there will always be another game. And as others have said the play on both sides was just stunning.

But the point I was trying to make is do you want a "thrilling" game, or do you want to win/or lose by the "rules." I think we all like the thrilling games, but not all of them can possibly end that way, and how much rule bending had to take place to create the "thriller?" Every game can't be thrilling, or down to the wire, and to try and create those types of games, when you punish the village for their good play (or reward the wolves for a mistake)...I'm sorry I don't agree with that.

Mira was an accidental surprise, but it was still fair, and admirable play by the innoncents (and I think Gwath too! ). There have been surprise wolf-lynching before. (Keep in mind we had no clue at the time Mira was a wolf)

Kath was lynched for a couple reasons, but she got lynched because enough innocents thought her vote and what she was saying was suspicious (keep in mind we had not clue at the time Kath was a wolf).

Mac was finally () lynched because he was caught and faked a ranger claim. That was his choice, and after being pushed into a corner he certainly went down fighting. I will say, I think mostly we were all pretty certain Mac was a wolf.

Gwath should have be killed based on the mod-fire rule, for not posting or voting for 3 days. I'm not saying Gwath got a cheap win, or shouldn't be proud of the way he played, because he made some great plays and won because of that.

The reason I always felt any mod-fire rule was in place was to make the game more even for all it's players. It's like a football game (sorry Mith, bare with me on this analogy). It would be like if the Lions and Cowboys were playing, and the Cowboys decided the Lions were not going to be allowed to watch any of their game-films, and so the Lions are left in the dark about the Cowboys' formations, plays, and strategy, in their upcoming match. If the mutineers didn't do anything, say anything, or post at all, for multiple days it makes it near impossible for the innocents.

Ok, we already knew that the rule was going to be loosely applied and not the "2 no votes and you're gone." But why have it at all if you aren't going to apply it fairly? Had an ordo missed 2 straight votes would they have been mod-fired? But the rule obviously wasn't intended for wolves?

Why was Wilwa immediately removed from our count? That was the night the wolves didn't send in the kill...they made a mistake, they messed up, why did they get rewarded with Wilwa's removal? See what I mean? Mira and Gwath were given the chance to come back if they could, but Wilwa was removed right away.

I don't mean any disrespect to the mutineers, I thought the way you played during the day was spectacular, but you were caught, we got you. Add on top of that, you made a flub by not sending in a night kill. This wasn't a matter of a game imbalance, the mutineers got lynched because the village worked well together and the mutineers made mistakes. You were awarded special rule-bending for the mistakes, and in return the innocents got nothing back. No one's role was given to us, we had no idea the situation we were up against for most of the agme (which may have changed the lynches/outcome), we got nothing.

This just felt like one that not only did the crew win 'legally' but one they deserved by their play and it was taken away. Like I said, I'm not angry at anyone for the decisions or what happened. I'm just trying to give my perspective, for next time, and that is I don't agree with rewarding a wolf-team (or innocent team) after making mistakes, so you have an 'entertaining' game.

[Nogrod]

I don't know why you guys keep on playing werewolf time after time. But I know why I am doing it.

It's a social thing of course and it's fun to meet you people in new games and just share the experience.

It's also a game of winning or losing therefore creating adrenaline and team-effort (even if as goodies it's hard to get that working - but when it does it's just splendid!). That is always fun as well (whatever the end-result is).

But I also do love the possibility of deducing things from what people have said and done. And when you suddenly realise: "Haa, X said this and formerly she said that - and because she voted for Y at that point but then tried to avoid Z being lynched... hmm... that must mean she's a wolf!", it's just soo great a feeling - especially if you get it right...

So I must say I also love the "intellectual-side" of this game. The power of reasoning, the possibility of catching the wolves and their schemes - or pulling out a scheme to outwit the villagers if being a wolf.

Why all this, then?

Well to my surprise I realised on the last few Days of this game that even in a game insane enough where nothing is told to us we can still make reasoned theories and build backed-up arguments! That was just great!

So sad if some of you thought I must be a baddie of some sort because I hung around to the wee hours with my computer, for it was only being excited about the possibility of actually being able to deduce something in a game like this!

Sadly as well, I was so wrong with my theory concerning Izzy vs. Gwath - even if I had also entertained quite seriously it the other way and even laid the reasons out why it could be the other way...


And even if I understand (or think I do) what Boro means and can sympathize with his view, I think I will side with Brinn on this one. You made good decisions in hard situations making this game an unforgettable one - no matter who won or lost. And that I think is in the last stance the most important thing - that we have fun.

If the game would have ended with Gwath being modfired and Mac giving up without his ranger-stunt - and missing the last Days altogether (when it actually started to be really interesting)... well it would have been a great victory for the village but much less interesting or mind-boggling game it turned out in the end.