Is it possible: 1 Silmaril found: The Arkenstone

[Eönwë]

Anyway, how did she get the pearl?

[Ibrîniðilpathânezel]

It may not exactly fit with the Melian story, but it does give a pointer, I think. Not all of the Noldor were unfriendly with the Elves, and I suspect that if Feanor had other gems of his making, he might well have taken them with him when he left Valinor (especially given his anger at the Valar, and his unwillingness to have others touch his creations without his leave). Even if it didn't come from Feanor, he wasn't the only jewel-smith in Middle-earth. Celebrimbor was the greatest jewel-smith of Eregion, and by one version of the story in UT, created the version of the Elessar that came down to Aragorn through Galadriel. Since the smiths of Eregion were at one time friendly with Durin's folk, it's entirely possible the Arkenstone was made by them and given to the Dwarves of Khazad-dum as a token of the peace between them. Thorin was a direct descendant of Durin's line, so such a gift might well have become a treasured heirloom of his house, despite the animosity that eventually grew between the Elves and Dwarves.

Then again, this could be an example of what happens when things change in rewriting and revising. New things are substituted, but not all of the loose ends are removed. Could happen.

[skip spence]

If we are going to speculate I may offer an alternative.

If I'm not mistaken, Finrod Felagund were said to have brought more riches out of Tirion than all the other elven princes put together. Maybe the Arkenstone, in this case quite possibly a work of Feanor, was a part of the Dwarves' payment for helping Felagund delve out Nargothrond?

(then again, would Feanor really give anything to Finrod, son of Finarfin, son of Indis?)

[skip spence]

Originally Posted by Eönwë

Anyway, how did she get the pearl?

If my memory serves me well the great pearl was fished up in the Bay of Balar by Cirdan (maybe not personally but you get my point) and given to Thingol among many others of lesser scale and beauty. The Dwarves went crazy about 'em as they'd seen nothing like it before. Remember, a mere glimpse of the ocean was enough to make a dwarf shriek like a sissy.

[William Cloud Hicklin]

The story of Melian's gem seems lijke an (abortive) attempt by Tolkien to create a backstory for the Arkenstone ( and demonstrate it was not, in fact, a Silmaril); but elsewhaere he says, I believe in App a Durin's Folk, that Thrain I discovered the Arkenstone digging under Erebor. So it doesn't quite fit the gift-of-the-Noldor theory.

[Eönwë]

Ok, well maybe other stones went into the earth with the Arkenstone, or from Angband. Just a suggestion (I don't have any evidence anywhere to back this up)

[Morthoron]

I'm not near any reference material, but I seem to recall the Arkenstone described as much larger than the Silmarils. After all, one Sil fit in Beren's clenched fist, and I seem to remember the Arkenstone as a much bigger gem for Bilbo to carry (although the size difference between Hobbit and Man could be a variable).

[Morthoron]

Regarding the comparative size of the Arkenstone to a Silmaril, there is this from the Hobbit:

His [Bilbo's] small hand would not close about it, for it was a large and heavy gem.

Again, I realize there was a marked difference in size between Bilbo and Beren (who clutched a Silmaril in his closed fist), but it does give one pause to consider a size difference in the two gems. In addition, The Hobbit text states that the Arkenstone 'was cut and fashioned by the dwarves', meaning it was faceted and shaped from a larger raw stone. Would the dwarves ever consider cutting and fashioning a peerless gem such as a Silmaril? The dwarves of Nogrod refashioned the Nauglamir to fit the Silmaril, but they did not tamper with the gem itself (after all, who better than a dwarf to understand all the facets of such perfection?).

[Formendacil]

Originally Posted by Morthoron

Would the dwarves ever consider cutting and fashioning a peerless gem such as a Silmaril?

A stronger objection in the same vein might run thus: COULD the Dwarves even cut and fashion a Silmaril? I believe there is something in the Silmarillion to the effect that the Silmarils were unbreakable except by Fëanor himself, so craftily were they made.

Or it's too late at night and I'm getting things confused. Don't think so though...

In any case, without giving a fuller argument at all, count me down as quite opposed to any suggestion that the Arkenstone was a Silmaril.