A paradise on Middle-Earth

[alatar]

Originally Posted by Bêthberry

Well now are you saying that any paradise should include a health plan? Does Rivendell have a gymnasium or workout room? Do elves play basketball or volleyball? Would orcs be inclined to rugger or American football? Would dwarves prefer hockey as it requires the smithing of strong blades and mighty sticks?

Not sure that it has to go that far. One walks wherever one goes, and that seems to impart some healthy living naturally. Elves, constantly singing and always being required to say both yea and nay, expend extra calories that way even when they aren't primping their hair. Dwarves, as posited elsewhere, have different metabolisms from us humans, and so few of them need any exercise (except fat Bombur who provides a workout for others). Orcs are underfed as a rule, and their constant nervousness of having their heads removed gives them a natural cardio workout daily - and if that fails, well, where there's a whip, there's a way. And orcs don't have many health care choices - get well or get into the pot...

Is a paradise in fairie the same thing as a paradise in the primary world?

You've asked the right question...and no, they are different.

Or, in fact, does fairie not admit of paradise, because it is the Perilous Realm? So that, when we speak of paradise in Middle-earth, are we really just talking about our own inclinations rather than what is in Middle-earth?

Aren't I always talking about my own inclinations? Are we asking what our paradise is or what our paradise is if we existed within Middle Earth's confines? For some, the Shire might be Heaven - Sam, in the despair of Mordor, surely at that moment would think so. When he's first tramping along with Frodo, heaven might have been the Golden Perch. Lothlorien was no heaven on earth for poor Boromir, and Ar-Pharazôn found Aman not to his liking.

Where is fancy bread?

[Bêthberry]

Originally Posted by alatar

Where is fancy bread?

According to my own inclinations, France.

[alatar]

Originally Posted by Bêthberry

According to my own inclinations, France.

I assume they deliver?

[Bêthberry]

Originally Posted by alatar

I assume they deliver?

I can't say as all French do, but certainly I suspect we would agree that Tolkien does, paradisically speaking.

[Lalwendë]

Ordinarily it ought to be by the sea. However, The Grey Havens are a bit depressing and there are too many Elves around; and although it might sound exciting thinking about Wizards landing there you get the impression that any bored long-term residents would be moaning "You wait thousands of years here for a Wizard to come along and then five of them arrive all at once! Tch." Another option, Dol Amroth, is too far south and I think they'd get jellyfish and I really don't like the thought of that; plus it might get over-run by day-trippers from Minas Tirith on bank holidays. Alqualonde sounds just beautiful, but the name also sounds too much like a drug to deal with excessive water retention. So unless I could find a forgotten fishing village somewhere on the Western shores of Middle-earth then it has to be The Shire.

It's got nothing extreme about it, no overly large rivers that might flood, no volcanoes, not too many wars. It has some nice woodland and fields and whatnot. Plus it also has all the major things you might need in life like ale, cakes, pipe-weed, taters, coffee, books, maps etc. It has decent pubs. Not too troubled by Elves and Orcs and things though you get the odd Wizard or Dwarf. And what's more, you get presents when it's not even your birthday!

[Eönwë]

Possibly Gondolin (While it remained).

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Originally Posted by Lalwendë

Ordinarily it ought to be by the sea. However, The Grey Havens are a bit depressing and there are too many Elves around; and although it might sound exciting thinking about Wizards landing there you get the impression that any bored long-term residents would be moaning "You wait thousands of years here for a Wizard to come along and then five of them arrive all at once! Tch."

*Mr. Picky arrives* Not necessarily! According to one quite popular version, they did not arrive all at once, but one by one (or two, at maximum).

Originally Posted by Lal

So unless I could find a forgotten fishing village somewhere on the Western shores of Middle-earth then it has to be The Shire.

There were many like that in Enedwaith/Minhiriath...

And what about Brithombar/Eglarest? Or Númenor? Both, of course, only at certain time - but that goes even for the others you named.

Also, I take it that you are limiting your choices to cities or settlements at least. Because otherwise, there are many, many, many beautiful places that could be labelled "paradise", only there is no settlement in there. Not that the words "paradise" and "settlement" seem in any way logically connected in my mind

I already noted above that the surroundings of Vinyamar is the real paradise, and it was even inhabited at one time, so perhaps you could find that one suitable?

[Lalwendë]

Originally Posted by Legate of Amon Lanc

*Mr. Picky arrives* Not necessarily! According to one quite popular version, they did not arrive all at once, but one by one (or two, at maximum).

You should never let facts get in the way of a good joke.

Or even a bad one!

There were many like that in Enedwaith/Minhiriath...

And what about Brithombar/Eglarest? Or Númenor? Both, of course, only at certain time - but that goes even for the others you named.

Also, I take it that you are limiting your choices to cities or settlements at least. Because otherwise, there are many, many, many beautiful places that could be labelled "paradise", only there is no settlement in there. Not that the words "paradise" and "settlement" seem in any way logically connected in my mind

I already noted above that the surroundings of Vinyamar is the real paradise, and it was even inhabited at one time, so perhaps you could find that one suitable?

There would have to be some kind of human habitation or else I'd end up like Tom Hanks in that film where he starts going insane and having conversations with a football. Preferably this habitation would not feature Elves as their singing would get on my wick