Nightmares & Dreams Anyone?

[littlemanpoet]

Originally Posted by Lindale

Why're all the dreams related to the Nazgul??

THey are the embodiment of our worst fear: endless existence in the void.

[Lindale]

Originally Posted by littlemanpoet

THey are the embodiment of our worst fear: endless existence in the void.

Nice point. Although if I may add, why not Melkor? The embodiment of the ancient evil who is condemned to live in the void till the End? Or is it because there has to be an End... which brings me to another quasi-stupid question: what becomes of the Nazgul? (ooh, it's off topic! but any specs?)

[littlemanpoet]

Originally Posted by Lindale

Nice point. Although if I may add, why not Melkor? The embodiment of the ancient evil who is condemned to live in the void till the End? Or is it because there has to be an End... which brings me to another quasi-stupid question: what becomes of the Nazgul? (ooh, it's off topic! but any specs?)

Not Melkor, to my thinking, because he is not made so vividly real to the reader as are the Nazgul. Perhaps this is because we are made in LotR to identify with the hobbits, whereas the Sil is more heroic and we don't feel him. Besides, Melkor is merely thrown there. The Nazgul are undead and can reach us. Us? Well, whatever.

Originally Posted by alatar

Or the embodiment of LotR fans' of 'things that go bump in the night.'

I can remember, into my early teens, pulling the covers up even over my head because if I was covered the Nazgul might know I was there but couldn't get to me. Totally irrational, of course.

Originally Posted by Bethberry

Tolkien fans' fears or everyone's?

Certainly mine. It's distressing that there are not more folks who have the same fear. (sigh) As in, what's wrong with me? (not asking for answers )

Originally Posted by Bb

which race do most Tolkien fans most identify with?

I wonder if a poll-thread could be concocted on that?

Originally Posted by SonofNumenor

...sunrise and sunset are not forever.

That just gives me the chills. Brrrr!

[MatthewM]

Yeah! I've had a bunch of Lord of the Rings related dreams. They're all too intense to explain, partly because I don't know how I would even be able to explain them!

[alatar]

Originally Posted by littlemanpoet

The Nazgul are undead and can reach us. Us? Well, whatever.

I can remember, into my early teens, pulling the covers up even over my head because if I was covered the Nazgul might know I was there but couldn't get to me. Totally irrational, of course.

Certainly mine. It's distressing that there are not more folks who have the same fear. (sigh) As in, what's wrong with me? (not asking for answers)

Can't remember ever having a nightmare involving the Nazgul. Sure, they were creepy scary, but unlike the usual undead, never desired my blood, brains or flesh. If one were to stand in their way, most likely one would feel their wrath (pun intended), but sans Ring, would you even see one? You just have to face it, lmp, they're just not into you (or just what does lmp have in his pocketses...).

Sam's Gaffer spoke with one and lived to tell about it. Glorfindel and Aragorn never seemed too afraid. Eowyn bags the worst of the worst when he was at his best.

Can remember reading the scene at Weathertop and wondering even more 'just what makes these things tick?' What were their histories? Etc.

Got to get one into the lab someday.

[Nerwen]

Interesting perspective, alatar.

Now, post- Night of the Living Dead flesh-eating zombies have never scared me at all, whereas I've had plenty of Black Rider nightmares. Yes, theirs is a relatively subtle form of horror, but I find that a lot more effective than gore all over the place.

[alatar]

Originally Posted by Nerwen

Interesting perspective, alatar.

Now, post- Night of the Living Dead flesh-eating zombies have never scared me at all, whereas I've had plenty of Black Rider nightmares. Yes, theirs is a relatively subtle form of horror, but I find that a lot more effective than gore all over the place.

Being chased/hunted to me could be one of those 'common' nightmares that we all have, like being unprepared for a test/presentation. What's doing the chasing may come from what's on your mind that day (or not). Guess that my mind, even in its weirdest state, could never put together a scenario where the Black Riders would want something from me.

Then again, this brain has given me dreams were I was pursuing the 'slasher,' against all reason. "Wouldn't it make more sense to run from Jason? Oh no, that's just what he expects you to do..."

[Groin Redbeard]

Once, I dreamt that I was standing in the middle a huge marsh that was covered with soggy soil and bushes. I was standing there when Orcs poured out from behind some bushes. I didn't have a sword with me, so I ran away. I ran until I found some soldiers of Gondor, and in an instant I was in the midst of a huge battle. I grabbed I sword from a dead Orc and began fighting (not too well I might add).

All seemed to be going well until I heard a Nazgul's scream. I couldn't see him but I knew that he was coming for me. I dropped everything that I was carrying and ran away; I was so shaken up that I was crying. I ran until the bushes hid me from view of the battle. I heard the Nazgul scream again, and all went silent. I hid behind a bush shaking from head to toe, when I heard the *splosh* *splosh* the Nazgul’s horse.

Mist began to surround me, and I stood up to see if he was gone yet. The Nazgul was sitting on his horse staring into the other direction. I tried to run, but I fell down in the soggy ground; the Nazgul slowly turned in my direction and gave those long sighs that that they do in the movies. He screamed as his horse reared on its hind legs; he urged the horse forward to where I was lying, his arms outstretched as if to grab me.

I woke up in a cold sweat. It was by far the worst nightmare I have ever had.

[littlemanpoet]

Originally Posted by alatar

If one were to stand in their way, most likely one would feel their wrath (pun intended), but sans Ring, would you even see one?

The hobbits fleeing them certainly saw what was visible of them in the Shire.

You just have to face it, lmp, they're just not into you (or just what does lmp have in his pocketses...).

It's what they represent, of course. Living death, ensnaring me and taking me forever to the void, where I am forever aware, powerless to escape the emptiness. But that was then; this is now.

[Borromino]

Never happened

[alatar]

Originally Posted by littlemanpoet

THey are the embodiment of our worst fear: endless existence in the void.

Or the embodiment of LotR fans' of 'things that go bump in the night.' We're daysiders, and so huddle in fear around the fire at night, hoping that the night hunting predators pass us by.

Nazgul are nocturnal predators, and even bring a bit of that darkness into the noon day. Sauron, bad as he was, never chased anyone. And though the Balrog did, it's a fire creature, and so you may dream that you'd see it coming in the dark. So, in terms of LotR, what's left?

[Bêthberry]

Originally Posted by littlemanpoet

THey are the embodiment of our worst fear: endless existence in the void.

Tolkien fans' fears or everyone's? A bit totalizing I think to say that we all have the same worst fear.

Perhaps its only the elvish amongst us who would have this fear, this great ennui? Not that Middle-earth itself is the void, but elves do seem to be chained to endless existence.

Which I suppose raises a question: which race do most Tolkien fans most identify with? Are those who have dreams or nightmares mainly elvish? Are the hobbitish amongst us fairly complacent sleepers? Do dwarves dream of smithyed sheep?

[Son of Númenor]

I've had some great LotR dreams, but the details elude me now.

Perhaps its only the elvish amongst us who would have this fear, this great ennui? Not that Middle-earth itself is the void, but elves do seem to be chained to endless existence.

That would be such a burden, to be bound to the world of form. That's one thing that's weird about Tolkien's cosmology: a whole race of beings that remains totally, eternally separate from the creator. Two actually, if you count the dwarves. What a boring afterlife they've got to look forward to. How long could one hang out with Aule and hew rocks before starting to wonder, "What's on the other side of the sky?" Maybe those races were a projection of Tolkien's fear of eternal existence as an embodied ego. Talk about a nightmare!

Of course, it doesn't take much to remind one that this life is fleeting, so I identify with Men and Hobbits. Pipe weed can pick up the spirits and food and ale can quiet the mind, but in the end we mortals live each day differently than the timeless Elves ever could: with the knowledge that sunrise and sunset are not forever.