how do you like the portrayal of frodo? - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

MatthewM · 08-20-2007, 02:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Folwren

No, no. You misunderstood. Because they lowered Frodo's character strength, they lowered every other character's strength.

But I would like to hear how--- Denethor's depression was twisted into insanity in the movies, and I can not see how Frodo's wrongly portrayed character affected Denethor's situation in any way.

Finduilas · 08-20-2007, 03:14 PM

Because if Denethor, the mad steward, had more courage that Frodo, one of the main heros, there would be major problems.

And Theoden may have been cowardized for Aragorns sake, who seemed afraid of becoming king. They may not have been as directly related to Frodo as Faramir, but it seemed to me as if almost everyone was more of a coward. There are of course exceptions, like Eomer and Eowyn.

Elladan and Elrohir · 08-20-2007, 04:18 PM

I don't think the weakening of Frodo had anything to do with the weakening of other characters; it was more of an across-the-board decision made by the filmmakers to go for more complexity and thus elicit more empathy from the audience.

As to which Frodo I like better, of course it's the book, as in pretty much every other area. But I like film Frodo, too. You have to accept that he is different, that he is more complex, that he deteriorates more quickly. Elijah Wood had the monumental task of portraying this Frodo, a very different one from the books, a character who could easily come across as unlikeable if not played with skill, but nonetheless the anchoring role of the cast. If I have any complaints with the film Frodo, it's with the way he was written, not with Wood's magnificent portrayal (though I do wish his voice wasn't so high-pitched).

Folwren · 08-20-2007, 05:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elladan and Elrohir

But I like film Frodo, too. You have to accept that he is different, that he is more complex, that he deteriorates more quickly. Elijah Wood had the monumental task of portraying this Frodo, a very different one from the books, a character who could easily come across as unlikeable if not played with skill, but nonetheless the anchoring role of the cast. If I have any complaints with the film Frodo, it's with the way he was written, not with Wood's magnificent portrayal (though I do wish his voice wasn't so high-pitched).

More complex? Reading the LotR for the sixth time at present, I am finding Frodo a fantastic, complex, and amazing character. The Frodo protrayed in the movie is shallow and weak.

I'd agree with you in as much as I like Elijah Wood as Frodo, I just don't like how he was written. I think Wood could have done well if they had written it differently. You can see promise in the way he executes certain lines like the "What must I do?" and "I will take it! I will take the Ring to Mordor...though...I do not know the way." They just didn't give him a chance of playing the real Frodo.

-- Folwren

Child of the 7th Age · 08-21-2007, 01:24 AM

You might enjoy reading over this earlier discussion that touched on some of these same points: http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showthr...ighlight=Frodo

William Cloud Hicklin · 08-21-2007, 08:57 AM

I must differ with the majority so far who liked Elijah Wood in the role. Now don't get me wrong- I like Elijah Wood as an actor. But he's all wrong for Frodo. To begin with, he's much, much too young and innocent and wide-eyed. Frodo is older and wiser than the other hobbits, more of an intellectual, and more measured (which is not the same as unsure or indecisive). Jackson's lessening of Frodo's character as a whole is in many ways a juvenilisation.

(Note on age: Christopher Tolkien, following his father I'm sure, considers hobbits to age as the same rate as Men: the 'coming of age' at 33 just reflects the wisdom of Shire society in considering young people in their 20s to be irresponsible and not ready for adulthood. "Fifty is fifty." At any rate, Frodo is the same age that Bilbo was during his adventure; and Bilbo was emphatically a middle-aged bachelor, set in his ways, not a doll-faced youth.)

Folwren · 08-21-2007, 09:06 AM

'Cept, Frodo got the ring when he was thirty-three and not fifty.

Yes, Elijah Wood was too young for the role.

smeagollives · 08-21-2007, 11:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Folwren

More complex? Reading the LotR for the sixth time at present, I am finding Frodo a fantastic, complex, and amazing character. The Frodo protrayed in the movie is shallow and weak.
-- Folwren

i have to agree with that. book-frodo is definetly a complex chracter. much more complex as movie frodo.

what do we know about movie frodo?

he loves the shire, he wants to save it, he is tempted be the ring and he shows some compassion for gollum. we do not know much more about him. *repeating myself*

: he is they guy next door-type. the poor lad to whom happened horrible things and who was broken by this.

i think book-frodo has much more character. i always imagined him to be like one of my college professors. may be a little bit like tolkien.

to my mind book-frodo is much more intellectual than film frodo. he is a quiet and friendly person. he talks about his emotions less and rarely shows he is feeling. he is scared of being a burden.

Sauron the White · 08-21-2007, 12:45 PM

Quote:

book-frodo is definetly a complex chracter. much more complex as movie frodo

Given that every 100 pages of book was turned into about 50 minutes of film, is that anything less than a glaringly obvious reality? I have yet to see a film where the characters are MORE complex when compared to a well written, comparatvely much longer book.

This is comparing apples to cinder-blocks.

Sauron the White · 08-21-2007, 12:51 PM

WCH -- why do you persist in battling strawmen of your own making - not once but over and over again?

My point was certainly NOT the McDonalds argument as you call it. The fact is this - and this is NOT news. Normally, films which are embraced by the masses - as evidenced by their dollars and ticket purchases - are not well reviewed by the professional critics. And those same fan favorites usually are not the big winners for industry proffessional awards such as the BAFTA's and Academy Awards. Those three categories of measurement of a films success usually are mutuall exclusive - at least for one factor out of the three.

McDonalds may indeed have a large number of customers but they DO NOT win industry awards for the quality of their food, ambience or service. And I have never read a review of a professional food critic in which McDonalds is ranked with the likes of The French Laundry or other five star restaurants. Your attempt at being clever with the phrase using McDonalds is not even an apt one.

The three LOTR films were wildly successful by all three measurements of a film success. This is a very rare occurence. That should tell you that the vast opinion of both the average person, professional critics, and industry professionals all felt the films worked and were very good films.

Of course, the inside intelligensia who feel they are the true holders of the JRRT flame conveniently ignore this and prefer to compare apples to cinder blocks and surprise nobody when they declare that yes indeed folks, apples taste better and cinder blocks are much harder.

Like Claude Rains in CASABLANCA, I am shocked.

MatthewM · 08-20-2007, 05:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Finduilas

Because if Denethor, the mad steward, had more courage that Frodo, one of the main heros, there would be major problems.

I really just do not understand what you mean here.

08-20-2007, 03:14 PM	#2
Finduilas Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Home. Where rolling green hills and clear rivers are practically my backyard. Posts: 595	Because if Denethor, the mad steward, had more courage that Frodo, one of the main heros, there would be major problems. And Theoden may have been cowardized for Aragorns sake, who seemed afraid of becoming king. They may not have been as directly related to Frodo as Faramir, but it seemed to me as if almost everyone was more of a coward. There are of course exceptions, like Eomer and Eowyn. __________________ One (1) book of rules and traffic regulations, which may not be bent or broken. ~ The Phantom Tollbooth

08-20-2007, 04:18 PM	#3
Elladan and Elrohir Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Halls of Mandos Posts: 332	I don't think the weakening of Frodo had anything to do with the weakening of other characters; it was more of an across-the-board decision made by the filmmakers to go for more complexity and thus elicit more empathy from the audience. As to which Frodo I like better, of course it's the book, as in pretty much every other area. But I like film Frodo, too. You have to accept that he is different, that he is more complex, that he deteriorates more quickly. Elijah Wood had the monumental task of portraying this Frodo, a very different one from the books, a character who could easily come across as unlikeable if not played with skill, but nonetheless the anchoring role of the cast. If I have any complaints with the film Frodo, it's with the way he was written, not with Wood's magnificent portrayal (though I do wish his voice wasn't so high-pitched). __________________ "If you're referring to the incident with the dragon, I was barely involved. All I did was give your uncle a little nudge out of the door." THE HOBBIT - IT'S COMING

08-21-2007, 01:24 AM	#5
Child of the 7th Age Spirit of the Lonely Star Join Date: Mar 2002 Posts: 5,133	You might enjoy reading over this earlier discussion that touched on some of these same points: http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showthr...ighlight=Frodo __________________ Multitasking women are never too busy to vote.

08-21-2007, 08:57 AM	#6
William Cloud Hicklin Loremaster of Annúminas Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 2,330	I must differ with the majority so far who liked Elijah Wood in the role. Now don't get me wrong- I like Elijah Wood as an actor. But he's all wrong for Frodo. To begin with, he's much, much too young and innocent and wide-eyed. Frodo is older and wiser than the other hobbits, more of an intellectual, and more measured (which is not the same as unsure or indecisive). Jackson's lessening of Frodo's character as a whole is in many ways a juvenilisation. (Note on age: Christopher Tolkien, following his father I'm sure, considers hobbits to age as the same rate as Men: the 'coming of age' at 33 just reflects the wisdom of Shire society in considering young people in their 20s to be irresponsible and not ready for adulthood. "Fifty is fifty." At any rate, Frodo is the same age that Bilbo was during his adventure; and Bilbo was emphatically a middle-aged bachelor, set in his ways, not a doll-faced youth.) __________________ The entire plot of The Lord of the Rings could be said to turn on what Sauron didn’t know, and when he didn’t know it.

08-21-2007, 09:06 AM	#7
Folwren Messenger of Hope Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: In a tiny, insignificant little town in one of the many States. Posts: 5,076	'Cept, Frodo got the ring when he was thirty-three and not fifty. Yes, Elijah Wood was too young for the role. __________________ A young man who wishes to remain a sound atheist cannot be too careful of his reading. - C.S. Lewis

08-21-2007, 12:51 PM	#10
Sauron the White Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 903	WCH -- why do you persist in battling strawmen of your own making - not once but over and over again? My point was certainly NOT the McDonalds argument as you call it. The fact is this - and this is NOT news. Normally, films which are embraced by the masses - as evidenced by their dollars and ticket purchases - are not well reviewed by the professional critics. And those same fan favorites usually are not the big winners for industry proffessional awards such as the BAFTA's and Academy Awards. Those three categories of measurement of a films success usually are mutuall exclusive - at least for one factor out of the three. McDonalds may indeed have a large number of customers but they DO NOT win industry awards for the quality of their food, ambience or service. And I have never read a review of a professional food critic in which McDonalds is ranked with the likes of The French Laundry or other five star restaurants. Your attempt at being clever with the phrase using McDonalds is not even an apt one. The three LOTR films were wildly successful by all three measurements of a film success. This is a very rare occurence. That should tell you that the vast opinion of both the average person, professional critics, and industry professionals all felt the films worked and were very good films. Of course, the inside intelligensia who feel they are the true holders of the JRRT flame conveniently ignore this and prefer to compare apples to cinder blocks and surprise nobody when they declare that yes indeed folks, apples taste better and cinder blocks are much harder. Like Claude Rains in CASABLANCA, I am shocked. Last edited by Sauron the White; 08-21-2007 at 02:58 PM.

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