Tol-in-Gaurhoth XXV: All Star Crossed With Nowhere to Go

[Kath]

Lhuna's Lover Jenny not mine, he was just trying to get me killed.

Now, to this Farael/Holby battle. I have seen this style of playing before from Farael and it does give me cause for concern, but I have not seen this style of playing before from Holby and that also worries me.

However, everybody here knows that the only way we can find out the truth is if they are lynched during the Day or killed at Night. Unfortunately, if they both turn out to be innocents, and it's possible, we're totally screwed. Even if Farael were the WereBird's lover and Holby the WereHamster or whatever we've actually got coming after us, there are still 4 other candidates out there.

We need not to get lost in pointless battles and this really is one. If we don't check it, it will turn into a feud with some on one side, some on another and some just trying to stay out of it. Other possibilities will be overlooked and it won't be good for us at all.

By all means we need to keep an eye on these two, but not to the exclusion of everyone else. Personally I would like to see Farael calm down. It is quite possible you don't realise it Farael but the tone you are using is causing everyone to bristle. A few susbstantial posts from Holby would be nice too so that we can actually get a feel for her.

[JennyHallu]

Thank you for your correction. I knew Lhuna was involved and for some reason mentally reversed you two.

And an excellent point. I think I'll take a good long look at someone being mostly ignored...if I find anything that'll be cool, but mostly I want to make sure every name stays in the debate.

[mormegil]

Originally Posted by Farael

And let me start another accusation on flimsy grounds that will cost my neck for sure. Yes, I know he has expressed doubts about me, but does anyone else find morm being alive slightly curious? Unless we are dealing with a group of werecreatures that have never played with him before, out of FOUR kills, no-one thought of getting rid of that mormegil? he's a danger to them if he is an ordo, and he's even more perilious as a lover or a werething.

Yet I'm not going to say "lynch him because he survived"... just keep an eye on him.

I'm not all the way caught up but this caught my eye.

Okay, this makes me even more concerned about Farael. Allow me to explain, this is a very intelligent thing to do as a were-creature. Think about it! Farael has the power to kill anybody he wanted last night...or at least influence it as a lover but I suspect that he is the actual were-creature, and yet he's 'wondering' why I'm still alive. Perfect way to get rid of me without actually doing the job plus it will help distance himself from seeming guilty if/when I die.

[Macalaure]

Originally Posted by Farael

And let me start another accusation on flimsy grounds that will cost my neck for sure. Yes, I know he has expressed doubts about me, but does anyone else find morm being alive slightly curious? Unless we are dealing with a group of werecreatures that have never played with him before, out of FOUR kills, no-one thought of getting rid of that mormegil? he's a danger to them if he is an ordo, and he's even more perilious as a lover or a werething.

That is a bad argument. If morm would be suspicious automatically if he survives only one night he would never see the end of a game, which is just unfair. I could see your point if the werethings could work together, but they can't. Four (or three if he's guilty) pairs indepentantly made the decision not to go for morm. Why should opposing couples spare him, even if he is a lover?

Holby, I'm quite male actually.
(Macalaure is Quenya for Maglor)
It's four males and eight females. I doubt there's a male-male-pair given these numbers. But if there's one female-female-pair, then two of four males are guilty and four of eight females are guilty. This makes lynching the males first not a real advantage.

[Farael]

Originally Posted by Macalaure

That is a bad argument. If morm would be suspicious automatically if he survives only one night he would never see the end of a game, which is just unfair. I could see your point if the werethings could work together, but they can't. Four (or three if he's guilty) pairs indepentantly made the decision not to go for morm. Why should opposing couples spare him, even if he is a lover?
.

See, the thing is, my argument is based on the fact that the werethings are NOT working together. If he was indeed on one of the three evil teams remaning, the odds of him getting eaten at night decrease. You say, why should opposing couples spare him? I ask, howcome they DID spare him?

And I'm not saying condemn him yet, I'm saying keep an eye on him, because as much as he is a powerfull ally, he is much more of a dangerous enemy.

As for Holby... c'mon, kill all the males? with this ratios Diamond would be rather unwise not to have a few same-sex couples... while I'm not privy to her thoughts, by systematically killing all males we guarantee that a few werethings will survive FOUR days. If they don't kill each other by night, we'll give them a HUGE advantage. Also, systematically doing ANYTHING helps the baddies, as they KNOW what we will do not only on a specific day but also on days to come and they can plan accordingly.

Having said so, I do not hold this alone against Holby, it may look like a good idea and it has been proposed before.

But it does add up to my existing doubts about her... after all, she IS a her.

[Macalaure]

Originally Posted by Farael

See, the thing is, my argument is based on the fact that the werethings are NOT working together. If he was indeed on one of the three evil teams remaning, the odds of him getting eaten at night decrease. You say, why should opposing couples spare him? I ask, howcome they DID spare him?

Three or four doesn't alter the chances dramatically. Maybe they were afraid the ranger would protect him. Look at the kills: arctic, Kitanna, Rune and Nogrod. Except Nogrod, those weren't especially daring picks.

[Farael]

Originally Posted by Macalaure

Three or four doesn't alter the chances dramatically. Maybe they were afraid the ranger would protect him. Look at the kills: arctic, Kitanna, Rune and Nogrod. Except Nogrod, those weren't especially daring picks.

I concede there, you have a point that the other picks weren't too daring, but I still think that otherwise it may have made enough of a difference.

I admit, it's an unfair statement to say "he's alive, he's too smart to be alive, so kill him" but at times it MAY just be true.

This place is dead and I may have to vote soon...

[Holbytlass]

Farael
Fintaeph
Morm

Durelin
Holby
JennyHallu
Kath
Lhuna
Lommy
Mac
Rikae
Valier

As I was going through the thread looking for possible lover strategies when it occured to me that (assuming i have everyone's gender correct) there are more females than males.

I put out for discussion lynching the males first, it would take care of any female/male pairs and male/male pairs. Any innocent male would maybe consider this for the good of the village.

I'm not that good with numbers so I'm not sure if that would work with DAY/Night kills.

[Kath]

Umm, Holby I'm assuming you mean there are more females than males right?

I don't like to say much about the idea of lynching everyone from one gender. This isn't the first time such a plan has been suggested and it's always met with a lot of argument. In this case there are so few males left it might actually be viable, but I'd be loathe to lose morm if he's on our side, and I would for Fin to be able to play a while longer. I'm waiting to pass judgement on Farael, as I'm hoping he will calm down, but that said it is looking increasingly bad for him.

Thing is, if we go with a 'planed' lynch then everyone who takes part in it basically has a get out of jail free card. If they're pointed out for having voted for someone who it has been decided shall be lynched, all they need to say is that they were following the plan.

morm, yes I caught that from Farael as well. Problem is that it's a two-way street. He's right, the longer you're left alive the more suspicious you will look, but that doesn't necessarily mean that he's the Werecreature keeping you alive, it could be any of them. And the same holds true whether you be innocent or guilty.

[Holbytlass]

Lhuna for Farael (Farael 1)
Thinlo for Mac (Farael 3, Macalaure 1)
Macalaure for Rune (Farael 4, Macalaure 1, Rune 1)
JennyHallu for Valier (Farael 4, Macalaure 1, Rune 1, Valier 1)
Valier for JennyHallu (Farael 4, Macalaure 1, Rune 1, Valier 1, Menel 1, Jenny 1)
Durelin for Kitanna (Farael 4, Macalaure 1, Rune 1, Valier 1, Menel 1, Jenny 1, Kitanna 1)

While werecreatures are known to bandwagon, it is also a safe position to vote for someone first.

Lhuna (the very first) vote for Fareal. A random vote for someone who hadn't even posted yet let alone rubbed some people the wrong way. In and of itself not suspicious, especially with hertimezone issues.

Lommy for Mac. Had suspicions about him and kept with the vote.

Mac for Rune. had suspicions kept with the vote, sus of Fareal but wanted competition for lynching

Jenny for Valier. came on late (RL issue) saw that Valier was as speechless as her and voted Valier.

Valier for Jenny. in seemingly retaliation

Durelin for Kittana. finds Kitt "under the radar" and votes for her.

Other than as I stated voting for someone first is a safe position (can't be accused of bandwaggoning) the only ones that stand out is the Jenny/Valier voting as Morm had pointed out.

Neither were high on anyone's suspicion list and both voted for each other for not posting much. Could be the female/female team. So these two are now high on my suspect list.

P.S. sorry Mac for the gender mix-up.

[Rikae]

I was preparing a long post and missed the deadline yet again.
See assigned to Mordor for some explanation.
If I can still vote:
++Morm

[Diamond18]

Moderator note: Only posts and votes before the deadline count. Posting after the deadline potentially skews the game and is unfair to the other players so please do not do it. If you've missed it, you've missed it.

--

The villagers turned on Holbytlass, determining to kill her. Farael wisely leapt to fasten a gag over her mouth so that she could not whisper for the Oliphaunts to come to her rescue. Just before she was silenced Holby protested that Valier should be the one to die instead. Mac and Fintaeph agreed, but it was not enough. Jenny, Durelin, and Valier ignored the suggestion and joined Farael's cause.

"One, two, three, four votes for Holby," counted Jenny. "Eh eh eh eh."

Durelin struck a tragic pose, then struck Holby across the cheek with a pair of leather gauntlets. "I say we burn, burn, burn! the evildoer at the stake!" she cried, shaking one fist dramatically.

Valier agreed and proceeded to arrange the logs for the fire as the others lashed Holby to a pole.

Fintaeph, meanwhile, began to pace nervously and gnaw on his fingernails. From time to time he ventured, "Wouldn't you rather kill Valier instead?" But the others ignored him and went about their work, till finally the bonfire was ready.

"Fare thee well," said Durelin, lighting a match with thespian flare. She dropped it on the tinder and stepped back as the pile of wood burst into flame.

Holby made stressful noises from behind her gag, flailing as the fire snaked its way towards her. Just as it caught the hem of her dress and began to singe her flesh, Fintaeph gave a sudden cry of anguish that turned midway into a rageful screech. He leapt forward and took flight, rushing to snatch Holby up in his talons.

She was well-tied to the poll, however, and he was delayed for a few crucial moments as he sought to gnaw her bonds free with his beak. He got her free, but not before the hungry flames had raced up her body to catch hold of the Werebird's feathers.

The Elves watched in mingled horror and fascination as the Werebird rose from the flames, phoenix-like, and flew off into the desert with the still burning Holby in tow. Alas for the lovers, neither of them were the actual phoenix and instead of rising to new lives, they crashed and burned into a sand dune on the outskirts of the oasis.

~*~*~*~

The Living Elves:

Lommy - Ostrich Chaser
Mac - Builder of Gibbets, unemployed for millennia
Kath - Flower Girl
JennyHallu - Countess
Valier - Arranger
Durelin - Lead Tragic Actor
morm - City Street Cleaner
Lhuna - Beautiful Girl with Sleeping Sickness
Farael - Patient suffering from Mad Elf Disease
Rikae - Contortionist

The Dead 'Uns

tgwbs - Tragic Elven Hero and Lover of Diamond - (co-mod) - Stabbed himself eight times and subsequently eaten by the Werebird

Diamond - Elven Maid - (mod) - Crushed in the embrace of the Werebear

Menel - Mad Scientist - (ordo) - Beaten with an undead leg and a chamber pot and stabbed with red hot tongs (Day 1)

Nogrod - a Smith of the Billmarins - (watcher) - Savagely murdered by the Werecat and devoured in the long grass (Night 2)

Arctic Storm - Raving Alcoholic, Resident Moocher, and Lover of Naria - (lover) - Devoured head first by the Werebird (Night 2)

Naria - Lemba Baker - (werecat) - Dashed out her brains on the Ringbearer's Rock (Night 2)

Kitanna - One Legged Chambermaid - (ordo) - Ripped in two by the Werebear (Night 2)

Rune - Humungous Fungus Grower - (ordo) - Minced up into fertilizer by the Werewolf (Night 2)

Holbytlass - Oliphaunt Whisperer and Lover of Fintaeph - (lover) - Burned at the stake (Day 2)

Fintaeph - Mutton Herder and Purveyor of Fine-Quality Undead Prosthetic Limbs - (werebird) - Died a fiery death trying to save his lover from the flames

[Diamond18]

After the light show the Elves retreated to their homes, oohing and aahing as they reflected upon the evening's entertainment. But they knew that evil still lurked in the shadows, so they bolted their doors soundly.

If only they all had the good sense to stay indoors.

Lommy awoke in the middle of the night and sensed something was amiss. She peered out her window and saw that her ostrich pen was empty, and gasped. For a moment she wondered if she should go out, but decided to throw caution to the wind. She donned a red hood and ran outside to see a stray ostrich frolicking in the moonlight. Lommy chased after it, but when she caught up with it, she noticed something strange.

"My, Ostrich, what big hairy feet you have," she observed.

"All the better to run away with," the Ostrich replied, coyly shuffling to the side.

Lommy was unable to resist a good chase. "My, Ostrich," she said as she followed it, "what big hairy ears you have!"

"Uh huh," said the Ostrich, luring Lommy into a dark alley. "Whatever."

"And my! Ostrich, what big teeth you have!" Lommy gasped.

"Bwah ha ha ha ha!" said the pseudo-Ostrich, and threw off its costume to reveal the menacing visage of the Werewolf. "All the better to eat you with!"

"Eeeeee!" cried Lommy, turning to run. But it was too late. The Werewolf chased her down and leapt upon her, growling triumphantly as it engulfed her in its massive jaws. There was a sickening crunching noise as the wolf softened her skeletal frame up, then came a noisy slurping as the flesh and blood went down. Finally, a burp.

An Elf came up and offered the wolf a napkin, running Elven hands threw wolfish fur and cooing, "Was she a tasty morsel? Is my love all full?"

JennyHallu sat back and sighed, "Ah, my MormyWolf, how do I love thee? Let me count the ways...."

Suddenly, this tender moment of sated hunger and mathematical affection was interrupted by a rumbling growl from afar. MormWolf snapped to attention. He crept to the end of the alley and looked both ways. Suddenly, he noticed a piece of trash lying on the street, and his wolfish ears perked up in indignation. He went to pick it up and put it in the trash, where such things belong, not cluttering up the street thank you very much!

As soon as that was cleaned up, he noticed another piece, and went to clean that up too. And then there was another, and another, and another! Morm ran from pile of rubbish to trash to pile of rubbish to trash, growling to himself about how he was going to eat each and every one of those filthy Elves.

As he was doing this, he heard a blood-curdling scream from back in the alley. He turned and ran back as fast as he could, but he was too late! When he reached the alley he found Jenny scattered about in little pieces, more pieces than even she could have counted.

He rocked back on his haunches and let loose a howl of agony. The Werebear had been and gone! Too late he realized that the trash was put there by the Werebear's lover to lure him away! Horror! Shock! Let this be a lesson to all neat freaks!

Anyway, Morm was devastated and lost all hope for life. The usual. He lay down amongst the pieces of Jenny and sighed his last. Not even the Ranger could save him from his own despair.

In the morning the Elves found him dead, and no one was quite sure if he had died of a broken heart or Lommy induced indigestion.

~*~*~*~

The Living Elves:

Mac - Builder of Gibbets, unemployed for millennia
Kath - Flower Girl
Valier - Arranger
Durelin - Lead Tragic Actor
Lhuna - Beautiful Girl with Sleeping Sickness
Farael - Patient suffering from Mad Elf Disease
Rikae - Contortionist

The Dead 'Uns

tgwbs - Tragic Elven Hero and Lover of Diamond - (co-mod) - Stabbed himself eight times and subsequently eaten by the Werebird

Diamond - Elven Maid - (mod) - Crushed in the embrace of the Werebear

Menel - Mad Scientist - (ordo) - Beaten with an undead leg and a chamber pot and stabbed with red hot tongs (Day 1)

Nogrod - a Smith of the Billmarins - (watcher) - Savagely murdered by the Werecat and devoured in the long grass (Night 2)

Arctic Storm - Raving Alcoholic, Resident Moocher, and Lover of Naria - (lover) - Devoured head first by the Werebird (Night 2)

Naria - Lemba Baker - (werecat) - Dashed out her brains on the Ringbearer's Rock (Night 2)

Kitanna - One Legged Chambermaid - (ordo) - Ripped in two by the Werebear (Night 2)

Rune - Humungous Fungus Grower - (ordo) - Minced up into fertilizer by the Werewolf (Night 2)

Holbytlass - Oliphaunt Whisperer and Lover of Fintaeph - (lover) - Burned at the stake (Day 2)

Fintaeph - Mutton Herder and Purveyor of Fine-Quality Undead Prosthetic Limbs - (werebird) - Died a fiery death trying to save his lover from the flames

Lommy - Ostrich Chaser - (ordo) - Lured into a dark alley and devoured by the Werewolf

JennyHallu - Countess and Lover of mormegil - (lover) - Ripped apart and scattered in countless pieces by the Werebear

Mormegil - City Street Cleaner - (werewolf) - Despaired and died amongst the shreds of his lover

[JennyHallu]

Macalaure...

#10

Mac was certainly not the first person to post, nor the last. Nothing seems odd to me about his post placement.

This post seems mostly noncommital. He discusses possibilities for the behavior of the were-creatures and their lovers, but concludes with two widely disparate theories, and doesn't put more weight on either. He says not to look for pairs on the early days, but brings up the possibility that it will be more useful later. He bemoans Lhuna's random vote, but says he'll let it pass.

I think it is safe to say that we are looking at the post of a careful player, but it doesn't really point to what role he might have.

Reactions to this post:
Naria (WERECAT)- doesn't like an "if" post to be a day one/first post. Thinks it looks shady. The beauty of hindsight...now this response looks shady itself. A careful poster, a cautious poster, these things Mac certainly was, but an "if" poster? I don't see it.
Lommy - agrees with Naria, votes Mac. Says she dislikes the fact that his post is from the were-creature's POV.
Nogrod (WATCHER)- mentions it raises questions, doesn't really add anything.

#29

Asks, rhetorically, what is so suspicious about trying to see the werecreatures' point of view. Mentions suspicion of Farael, for questioning things Mac finds trivial, and suspicion of Rune for being overly aggressive in attacking Farael.

Again, seems to be a careful post...short and to the point, unlike Mac's usual eloquence. But again, nothing seems really suspicious, except that I would have protested more to three people thinking I was suspicious. That might just be me, I tend to be really defensive, but it's a thought.

Reactions:
Nogrod (WATCHER) - backs off his suspicion of Mac a little...well, he says he's uncomfortable with his reasons for that suspicion.

#35

Votes for Rune, to widen the field. Still doesn't say much.

Reactions:
arcticstorm (WERECAT LOVER)- asks Mac to elaborate on why he finds Rune suspicious, says he does not.

Mac does not show up again for the remainder of the day, which doesn't really worry me, as he's already voted.

I'll come back later, and may or may not continue with Mac's posts. Depends. I will say that I feel better about how vocal he is today compared to yesterday.

[Macalaure]

An analysis of me!

Again, seems to be a careful post...short and to the point, unlike Mac's usual eloquence. But again, nothing seems really suspicious, except that I would have protested more to three people thinking I was suspicious. That might just be me, I tend to be really defensive, but it's a thought.

Jenny calls me careful, Lommy calls me soft. You're either lovers - or right. I like to play aggressive and edgy, but only if I have something to play this way with. I only had weak suspicions yet and I don't like to accuse somebody loudly if I'm not sure about it.
I used to defend myself quite vehemently in my past games, that's true. However, I grew familiar with the feeling of being suspected. I don't know what it is, but I always attract the suspicion of two or three people on the first day. It doesn't bother me that much any more.
Thanks for calling me eloquent.

I forgot to answer arctic's question. I found Rune a little suspicious because of his aggressive yet unfounded and regretting vote for Farael. I didn't like the Farael-waggon and so I went with the only other person I felt bad about.