I just don't understand. - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Folwren · 10-27-2006, 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boromir88

FOTR:

'Something draws near. I can feel it!'

TTT:

'They run as if the very whips of their master's will were behind them.'

ROTK:

'The stars are veiled. Something stirs in the East. A sleepless malice. The eye of the enemy is moving. He is here!'

'The horses are restless, and the Men are quiet.'

*grumbles* These are elf-like quotes, thanks much.

Really, would you all have liked him better if he had had the quotes from the book?

FOTR:

'Well, I have not brought the Sun. She is walking in the blue fields of the South.'

'A plague on the Dwarves and their stiff necks!'

I'm not going to search for any others...I've not read the books in a long time and don't remember Legolas' quotes readily.

He made a good elf, I think...except for a few of his stunts, but not even many of those were ridiculous. Alright, yes, some of his lines were laughable, but that's not his fault...and it's not even for his lines that he's made fun of so often.

-- Folwren

Macalaure · 10-27-2006, 05:30 PM

a definite YES!

I'd give a little finger if he said "Only I hear the stones lament them: deep they delved us, fair they wrought us, high they builded us, but they are gone." or "It is old, very old. So old that almost I feel young again, as I have not felt since I journeyed with you children." or only "Do not spoil the wonder with haste."

Well, maybe a fingernail.

Folwren · 10-27-2006, 06:53 PM

Well, yes, of course his lines in the book are better, but there are laughable lines in the book as well, if put on screen. It was a question that was almost sarcasm but not quite.

-- Folwren

Macalaure · 10-28-2006, 10:34 AM

I know you meant your question ironic. The lines are laughable indeed - but only if put out of context. If said in the same context as in the book, they would fit as perfectly on screen as on paper. I mean, even the two quotes you gave ironically are from two of the most funny scenes of the whole LotR.

Folwren · 10-29-2006, 07:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Macalaure

I mean, even the two quotes you gave ironically are from two of the most funny scenes of the whole LotR.

Yes, I know. I loved both those parts! Have you ever read the part of Caradras (sp) as is written in the book The Treason of Isengard? It's absolutely hilarious!!! Gandalf is SO grumpy and Legolas is so funny!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bethberry

Folwren, I think movie Elrond also came in for his share of jibes. Perhaps PJ had difficulty integrating Tolkien's concept of male elf with his action man perspective?

Well, I haven't heard as many. I think Elrond was pretty cool, too...besides the fact that he was so grumpy and kept trying to talk Arwen into breakingher promise.

-- Folwren

Lhunardawen · 10-30-2006, 04:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bêthberry

Folwren, I think movie Elrond also came in for his share of jibes. Perhaps PJ had difficulty integrating Tolkien's concept of male elf with his action man perspective?

Hmm...shouldn't we be adding Haldir and Celeborn to the list? And Haldir's company of androgynous Elves in film FotR?

Bêthberry · 11-02-2006, 11:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lhunardawen

Hmm...shouldn't we be adding Haldir and Celeborn to the list? And Haldir's company of androgynous Elves in film FotR?

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Moddess

. . . can you imagine Peter Jackson, with his rather "hasty" personality, embracing that philosophy in today's society of instant gratification?! I think he did not have a fundamental understanding of the Elves and if you don't grasp something yourself, you can't make others understand it.

A late reply to you both. It was all the elves--including, to me, Galadriel--which suffered and not merely Legolas.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Imladris

To elaborate more on this point, can you have an "ent like" personality/philosophy when filming a movie? No, you can't.

There is only so much money.

There is only so much time to film the story. Deadlines are dreadful things (or so I'm told, I haven't really experienced them yet).

And you have to catch the audiences attention. Some people were complaining that the theatrical release was "too long." The Entertainment business is about pleasing people so that they will dish out money and buy your product. You have to make a profit in the business...so you have to make your product appealing to everyone -- not just the nerds but the fan girls and the people who want a few hours entertainment, etc.

as I've said -- translating a book to a movie doesn't work. There are bookish elements and there are movie elements and the elves, I think, are decidedly bookish.

Hmm. Hmmm. Who is being hasty?

This assumes that there is no "art" in movies, only depiction of already existing reality, no representation, just presentation.

David Lean could have depicted the elves or, for a more contemporary director, Zhang Yimou. I thinkEsty is bang on that Jackson's filmic style or philosophy doesn't incorporate qualities needed to imagine elves on the screen.

Estelyn Telcontar · 10-30-2006, 07:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Macalaure quoting Legolas

"Do not spoil the wonder with haste."

That is a wonderful line, one of my personal favourites, but can you imagine Peter Jackson, with his rather "hasty" personality, embracing that philosophy in today's society of instant gratification?! I think he did not have a fundamental understanding of the Elves and if you don't grasp something yourself, you can't make others understand it.

Folwren · 10-30-2006, 08:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Estelyn Telcontar

That is a wonderful line, one of my personal favourites, but can you imagine Peter Jackson, with his rather "hasty" personality, embracing that philosophy in today's society of instant gratification?! I think he did not have a fundamental understanding of the Elves and if you don't grasp something yourself, you can't make others understand it.

That is true. I had not considered that. Do you suppose that if he had had some understanding of the elves he could have, without making the movie longer, made the elves more acceptable to the audience? That is...portray so that even the non-LotR readers would understand what they were? (Other than the perfect appearance character who says very little....)

Still, I've met some people who don't think he was badly done. For instance, one boy I know, he's 12, I think, has read the book and seen the movies and he says that Legolas is his favorite character in both the books and movies. Now, you can't say that he only likes him because he looks good, because this particular boy is part of a family who's all for very masculine boys and men and despises whimpy males, and probably doesn't care two cents about how they look.

So, to some people, maybe he was portrayed correctly....

-- Folwren

Imladris · 10-30-2006, 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Estelyn Telcontar

That is a wonderful line, one of my personal favourites, but can you imagine Peter Jackson, with his rather "hasty" personality, embracing that philosophy in today's society of instant gratification?! I think he did not have a fundamental understanding of the Elves and if you don't grasp something yourself, you can't make others understand it.

To elaborate more on this point, can you have an "ent like" personality/philosophy when filming a movie? No, you can't.

There is only so much money.

There is only so much time to film the story. Deadlines are dreadful things (or so I'm told, I haven't really experienced them yet).

And you have to catch the audiences attention. Some people were complaining that the theatrical release was "too long." The Entertainment business is about pleasing people so that they will dish out money and buy your product. You have to make a profit in the business...so you have to make your product appealing to everyone -- not just the nerds but the fan girls and the people who want a few hours entertainment, etc.

as I've said -- translating a book to a movie doesn't work. There are bookish elements and there are movie elements and the elves, I think, are decidedly bookish.

Edit:

On a completely different note:

Quote:

I wonder who will play the elves in The Hobbit Movie. I really hope it's not a ''handsome'' actor, because it just brings the spirit of Tolkien down. People will only go to the movie because people will say: '' Have you already seen that Elf in The Hobbit? He is SO hot, you got to watch it!''
Tolkien can't be forgotten...

Should we not have beautiful music or beautiful scenery or beautiful cinema so that people won't watch the movie for its aesthetic qualities?

No. Of course not.

We should be able to appreciate beauty in all it's shapes, including hot males.

Why should the movie director or whoever chooses the casting not choose a "hot" person to play an elf (who are beautiful people, by the way) because of what a few immature girls will say?

10-27-2006, 06:53 PM	#3
Folwren Messenger of Hope Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: In a tiny, insignificant little town in one of the many States. Posts: 5,076	Well, yes, of course his lines in the book are better, but there are laughable lines in the book as well, if put on screen. It was a question that was almost sarcasm but not quite. -- Folwren __________________ A young man who wishes to remain a sound atheist cannot be too careful of his reading. - C.S. Lewis

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10-27-2006, 05:30 PM	#2
Macalaure Fading Fëanorion Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: into the flood again Posts: 2,911	a definite YES! I'd give a little finger if he said "Only I hear the stones lament them: deep they delved us, fair they wrought us, high they builded us, but they are gone." or "It is old, very old. So old that almost I feel young again, as I have not felt since I journeyed with you children." or only "Do not spoil the wonder with haste." Well, maybe a fingernail.

10-28-2006, 10:34 AM	#4
Macalaure Fading Fëanorion Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: into the flood again Posts: 2,911	I know you meant your question ironic. The lines are laughable indeed - but only if put out of context. If said in the same context as in the book, they would fit as perfectly on screen as on paper. I mean, even the two quotes you gave ironically are from two of the most funny scenes of the whole LotR.