A Happy Ending... or is it? - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Azaelia of Willowbottom · 09-06-2006, 01:33 PM

I'd definitely say that it is neither happy nor sad...It's bittersweet, as stated before...

I came into this post thinking I'd say it was a happy ending, but then I got to thinking, ok, maybe it's technically happy: the good guys won, in as much as anyone can win in war. Aragorn became king, the Hobbits got to go home, Sam, Merry, and Pippin got married, and even Frodo found peace at last...

But I thought back, and wondered, what did I feel at the end? And the answer is this: I felt sad. I cry every time I read the end, and the tears aren't necessarily happy ones.

It's sad on one level, for me, a fan and someone who loves the book...It's sad that the story is drawing to a close, that after this, there is no more, but that's not the part that makes me cry.

On another level, as a reader, sadness is what Tolkien's ending conveyed to me. It's not sad like Shakespeare's tragic endings, where everyone dies, but all the same, I feel a definite sense of loss at the end of LOTR...I feel like I'm losing something, and that's just the only way to put it. It's probably all tied in with the fact that the characters I relate best to are the Hobbits, and particularly Sam. So I feel like I'm losing a dear friend, which isn't a happy feeling, even though it's obvious that it's better for Frodo that way...but is it better for the people who are left behind?

It's sad but true-to-life that even though the Fellowship accomplished its goal of destroying the Ring and ridding Middle-earth of evil for a while (I doubt permanently), life couldn't just go on for those involved. Legolas heard the Sea and had to live with the miserable, painful longing for it. Frodo was not whole after the experience, neither physically nor emotionally/psychologically. Sam, Merry, and Pippin ultimately lost one of their closest friends. Middle-earth lost Gandalf, and ultimately lost most of the Elves, too. (Though, of course, by then I guess the point was that the mortals were going to have to take care of themselves, and were hopefully ready for the responsibility).

So, I guess I'd say that on a logical level (a level on which I am not particularly good at thinking), the ending of LOTR is a happy one, but on an emotional, intuitive level, it is a sad ending, and it's that element that I feel more.

So sad ending is my answer, I guess, though I'm really not a pessimist at heart.

Raynor · 09-09-2006, 11:30 PM

According to letter #89, for Tolkien, Joy and Sorrow ultimately converge, even in the event of the eucatastrophe, the happy turn. He also notes in the Atrabeth that "sadness ... must come even from the unselfish love of anything less than Eru".

Lobelia · 09-10-2006, 02:58 AM

What a lovely thread. As it happens, I'm currently re-reading; Frodo and Sam are on the last part of their journey to the mountain and I'm sniffling with sadness. I have this feeling I am going to have to promise myself to start all over again as soon as I get to the last page of the story proper.

While going on the ship to the West is as much of a reward as Frodo can have, it's still sad. IMO, Frodo would rather be in the Shire, which he has saved, but he just can't go home again.However, I'd like to think that when Sam gets to the West, he'd find Frodo still alive, for a while at least, otherwise, what's the point? Maybe the healing would help Frodo to live his normal lifetime, and he was, after all, only 50ish when he left, which is not old for a Hobbit.

Bittersweet is right. Yet it's nice that, despite having his mind on the West, Gandalf still thinks to make sure Sam doesn't have to go home alone after the Grey Havens, by letting Merry and Pippin know what's happening. What a nice man - er, Maia.I would love to share a pint and a darts game at the pub with Gandalf... (I keep having this vision of Gandalf arriving home in Valinor and finding several thousand years' worth of mail waiting...

)

09-06-2006, 01:33 PM	#1
Azaelia of Willowbottom Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: By the Sea Posts: 446	I'd definitely say that it is neither happy nor sad...It's bittersweet, as stated before... I came into this post thinking I'd say it was a happy ending, but then I got to thinking, ok, maybe it's technically happy: the good guys won, in as much as anyone can win in war. Aragorn became king, the Hobbits got to go home, Sam, Merry, and Pippin got married, and even Frodo found peace at last... But I thought back, and wondered, what did I feel at the end? And the answer is this: I felt sad. I cry every time I read the end, and the tears aren't necessarily happy ones. It's sad on one level, for me, a fan and someone who loves the book...It's sad that the story is drawing to a close, that after this, there is no more, but that's not the part that makes me cry. On another level, as a reader, sadness is what Tolkien's ending conveyed to me. It's not sad like Shakespeare's tragic endings, where everyone dies, but all the same, I feel a definite sense of loss at the end of LOTR...I feel like I'm losing something, and that's just the only way to put it. It's probably all tied in with the fact that the characters I relate best to are the Hobbits, and particularly Sam. So I feel like I'm losing a dear friend, which isn't a happy feeling, even though it's obvious that it's better for Frodo that way...but is it better for the people who are left behind? It's sad but true-to-life that even though the Fellowship accomplished its goal of destroying the Ring and ridding Middle-earth of evil for a while (I doubt permanently), life couldn't just go on for those involved. Legolas heard the Sea and had to live with the miserable, painful longing for it. Frodo was not whole after the experience, neither physically nor emotionally/psychologically. Sam, Merry, and Pippin ultimately lost one of their closest friends. Middle-earth lost Gandalf, and ultimately lost most of the Elves, too. (Though, of course, by then I guess the point was that the mortals were going to have to take care of themselves, and were hopefully ready for the responsibility). So, I guess I'd say that on a logical level (a level on which I am not particularly good at thinking), the ending of LOTR is a happy one, but on an emotional, intuitive level, it is a sad ending, and it's that element that I feel more. So sad ending is my answer, I guess, though I'm really not a pessimist at heart. __________________ "Wherever I have been, I am back." Last edited by Azaelia of Willowbottom; 09-06-2006 at 01:38 PM. Reason: phrasing, adding a final answer...etc.

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09-09-2006, 11:30 PM	#2
Raynor Eagle of the Star Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Sarmisegethuza Posts: 1,058	According to letter #89, for Tolkien, Joy and Sorrow ultimately converge, even in the event of the eucatastrophe, the happy turn. He also notes in the Atrabeth that "sadness ... must come even from the unselfish love of anything less than Eru".

09-10-2006, 02:58 AM	#3
Lobelia Wight Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Australia Posts: 150	What a lovely thread. As it happens, I'm currently re-reading; Frodo and Sam are on the last part of their journey to the mountain and I'm sniffling with sadness. I have this feeling I am going to have to promise myself to start all over again as soon as I get to the last page of the story proper. While going on the ship to the West is as much of a reward as Frodo can have, it's still sad. IMO, Frodo would rather be in the Shire, which he has saved, but he just can't go home again.However, I'd like to think that when Sam gets to the West, he'd find Frodo still alive, for a while at least, otherwise, what's the point? Maybe the healing would help Frodo to live his normal lifetime, and he was, after all, only 50ish when he left, which is not old for a Hobbit. Bittersweet is right. Yet it's nice that, despite having his mind on the West, Gandalf still thinks to make sure Sam doesn't have to go home alone after the Grey Havens, by letting Merry and Pippin know what's happening. What a nice man - er, Maia.I would love to share a pint and a darts game at the pub with Gandalf... (I keep having this vision of Gandalf arriving home in Valinor and finding several thousand years' worth of mail waiting... )