Harry Potter and The Stolen Plot...

[Lalaith]

The Downs have become more literate over the years, that's for sure. Some of the spelling, punctuation and syntax back there...*shudder*

[alatar]

By the by, note that I am not accusing Rowlings of anything sinister or untoward. I just happened to be reading 'Stone' and noticed that Harry woke up to a bedside Wizard that was able to fill us all in on the last scene.

The HP books are cute, readable, though having read books 1-4 I'm starting to get a little irked at some of the typecasting (i.e. character X always does this). Then again, the Silmarillion has its repetitions...

[Galadriel]

Originally Posted by Lalaith

The Downs have become more literate over the years, that's for sure. Some of the spelling, punctuation and syntax back there...*shudder*

That, I am afraid, just reminds me of bad fan fiction T_T

[Morsul the Dark]

Everyone seems to draw the link between Dumbledore and Gandalf.

I disagree that Dumbledore is too close to Gandalf for comfort, well rather agree and disagree.

They are extremely similar no doubt, however they both fill an Archetype. Merlin and his apprentice, certainly come to mind.

[alatar]

It's taken years, but I'd finally put down my animosity towards the Harry Potter series. I've liked the movies, and the Lego video game looks cute, but the books...well...there's an ugly history there that I'd rather not revisit.

So I've started reading the series, comparing what I read to the movies, and to, of course, Lord of the Rings. What was striking to me (and possibly in a post somewhere in the billion within this thread) is how HP:The Sorcerer's/Philosopher's Stone ends much like FotR. Harry/Frodo wake up after facing the enemy, in a bed, with a wizard at his side recounting what happened just before our hero blacks out. I read the chapter with Harry lying in the Hogwart's hospital and couldn't help but see Frodo in Rivendell with Gandalf at his side.

Coincidence?

[Nerwen]

Originally Posted by alatar

It's taken years, but I'd finally put down my animosity towards the Harry Potter series. I've liked the movies, and the Lego video game looks cute, but the books...well...there's an ugly history there that I'd rather not revisit.

So I've started reading the series, comparing what I read to the movies, and to, of course, Lord of the Rings. What was striking to me (and possibly in a post somewhere in the billion within this thread) is how HP:The Sorcerer's/Philosopher's Stone ends much like FotR. Harry/Frodo wake up after facing the enemy, in a bed, with a wizard at his side recounting what happened just before our hero blacks out. I read the chapter with Harry lying in the Hogwart's hospital and couldn't help but see Frodo in Rivendell with Gandalf at his side.

Coincidence?

More than that, probably: Tolkien's influenced so much of later fantasy, so why not this? That's not quite the same as saying the plot was "stolen", though. I've read things that do copy The Lord of the Rings directly, and there's a difference.

Also, as this guy points out, you can draw comparisons between the HP novels and a lot of other things too.

That poster is being funny, of course, but in fact I do have a problem with the HP books being generally a bit derivative (rather than straight rip-offs of any one thing). It's not that Rowling uses elements that appear in other stories, it's that I've never found what she does with them all that interesting. That's just my personal reaction, of course. I know they caught a lot of kids'– and even adults'– imaginations.

Btw, as I've said elsewhere, it's always fun when someone unearths one of these prehistoric threads. The Downers of the First Age certainly had quite a lively debating style:

Originally Posted by Aryana

This is a message for tumil about the Hogwarts moto.
BASCIALLY to stop me from screaming at you all, im gonna keep this as short as possible.
JKR did classics at A level and i think even at UNI

Srsly? UNI?!! NOES!!!111

Originally Posted by Aryana

the motto means never tickle a sleeping dragon
very funny and very dumbledoreish
like the rest of them books
that has NOTHING to do with tolkien, cause im sure he would NEVER use something so humourous.

Nope. As we all know, Tolkien never used any line remotely like that, anywhere.

Originally Posted by Aryana

dont get me wrong, i love LoTR and tolkien is an amazing writer, but he isnt for children so he wouldnt use that, JKR is!

What, Tolkien write a childrens' book? The very idea!

Originally Posted by Aryana

and also about you all thinking that dumbledore is gandalf. why dont u realise that gandalf is merlin!

Oh.

Originally Posted by Aryana

anyway im gonna go now, but u all better go home and do your homework before preaching about tolkien being the one god.
because even though his books r great, he wasnt amazing. he was a racist facist little old man. think about it. the orcs, evil and black, come from the same place that africa would be if you compared the two maps of our world and middle earth.
now u cant say thats a coincidence!
ha!
i have proved u all wrong! mwhahahahaha!
(with thanks to my equally angry friend, izzie!)
mwhahahahahahaha
byeeee
dont hate me just cause im right

Well, how can one possibly counter such a devastating argument as that?


*sigh* Darn it, I why didn't I join the Downs eight years ago? Everyone's so staid and literate these days!

Note: seriously, most of the thread is not like that at all.

[alatar]

Grima Wormtongue is called thus as no one, with the exception of the bewitched Theoden, likes his slithering ways and constant lying. Peter Pettigrew Wormtail, a rat in more ways than one, is named thus as...

One nick seems natural; the other forced.

And I'm not even going to mention anything about a certain person going into hiding after losing a finger.

[Nerwen]

Originally Posted by alatar

Grima Wormtongue is called thus as no one, with the exception of the bewitched Theoden, likes his slithering ways and constant lying. Peter Pettigrew Wormtail, a rat in more ways than one, is named thus as...

One nick seems natural; the other forced.

And I'm not even going to mention anything about a certain person going into hiding after losing a finger.

Okay, that's a point. "Wormtail" is an obvious... er... reference, let us say. And as you say, it doesn't quite work.

Not sure about the missing finger. It may be simply that Rowling wanted to include the old tradition that a shapeshifter's injuries persist from one form to another, and just happened to pick "missing digit" as the telltale mutilation, when it could as easily have been a torn ear, or something.

[alatar]

Originally Posted by Nerwen

Okay, that's a point. "Wormtail" is an obvious... er... reference, let us say. And as you say, it doesn't quite work.

So at least it's not just me.

Not sure about the missing finger. It may be simply that Rowling wanted to include the old tradition that a shapeshifter's injuries persist from one form to another, and just happened to pick "missing digit" as the telltale mutilation, when it could as easily have been a torn ear, or something.

Two fingers could have worked even better to fool the MoM of Pettigrew's death, but no, we need to leave nine...

Bet it was his Ring finger.