Cryptic Clues - Page 19 - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Morsul the Dark · 11-27-2005, 03:43 PM

Well an explorers home on the sea ship was first in mind
however bilbo could be considered an explorer and he had many homes bagend rivendel but most notably on the sea

Lake-Town?

Rune Son of Bjarne · 11-27-2005, 03:48 PM

nope

go with you're first thought Morsul

Morsul the Dark · 11-28-2005, 08:35 AM

well Eriol was the explorer he went to the cottage of lost play so i looked at the lost tales for eriols ship i didnt find it however....

Vai is the outer ocean with the world ship on top of it so...

Since the Cottage is west I would have to Say

NUME?

The Squatter of Amon Rûdh · 11-28-2005, 11:43 AM

It's Unfinished Tales rather than The Book of Lost Tales in which we must look for this answer.

This floating palace is Eämbar, or Sea-home, which was built by Aldarion, king of Númenor. It was a home both for the king himself and for his guild of explorers, so it's an explorer's and an explorers' home, literally on the sea.

Rune Son of Bjarne · 11-29-2005, 12:06 PM

The Squatter of Amon Rûdh I salute you!

You may proced

The Squatter of Amon Rûdh · 12-01-2005, 07:49 AM

And I you. I like fiendish clues.

Without further ado I shall begin to make use of my newly acquired thread. Tell me, ye luminaries, the meaning of this.

King, for example, backed by unconventional advance, builds a nation

Morsul the Dark · 12-09-2005, 09:48 AM

ok

thorondor?
hes king for example EG kind of like eagles

King for eagles his origin is unknown(unconventional advance)and he built eyries in the high mountains of someplace(i dont know what an eyrie is buti looked over all the kings i couuld think of and this one fit best

Gil-Galad · 12-09-2005, 06:20 PM

Gwaihir the Windlord?

unconvential advance could mean the wind pshing him...

The Squatter of Amon Rûdh · 12-12-2005, 04:29 AM

Nothing to do with eagles, I'm afraid.

The Squatter of Amon Rûdh · 02-08-2006, 06:18 AM

I'm not so patient as the Green Knight, so I'm sending this monster back to the surface. If it shames an answer out of anyone it's worth my saying that my clue isn't difficult:

King, for example, backed by unconventional advance, builds a nation

Clue: you've probably already seen the answer today.

Mithalwen · 02-08-2006, 06:21 AM

I guess unconventional could be signalling an anagram..

The Squatter of Amon Rûdh · 02-08-2006, 10:23 AM

Indeed it could.

Morsul the Dark · 03-17-2006, 11:59 AM

I think we've all but given up on this one a few hints if you would my good sir

Mithalwen · 03-18-2006, 06:33 AM

How many letters would be useful

JennyHallu · 03-18-2006, 08:49 AM

It looks to me that the answer is going to consist of the name of a or a synonym for king, followed by an anagram of "advance" and will spell out a nation. I'm not very good at cryptic clues though, so I'm wondering if anyone else has had the same idea. The clue seems awfully straightforward.

Mithalwen · 03-18-2006, 01:29 PM

That is what I would expect Jenny but it hasn't got me any closer.

The Squatter of Amon Rûdh · 03-22-2006, 07:36 AM

I'm not telling anyone the number of letters in the solution, but I will expand on Jenny's interpretation of the clue. As usual, if it seems too simple to be true, it probably is.

A lesser-known cryptic technique, known to such as the benighted souls who do the Grauniad crossword, is for the word that is an anagram to be defined in the clue but not actually given. For example:

'Youngster always allowed to run amok' = Anagram of 'ever let' = Leveret.

I also draw your attention to my use of the phrase 'for example', which is significant, although not at all cryptic in its meaning.

Mithalwen · 03-23-2006, 06:43 AM

This will be hopeless - I am too Telegraph-minded!

Turambar · 03-23-2006, 07:20 PM

And I'm too Nation-minded, but . . .

Cardolan ?

A king is one type of card, and a loan is an advance . . .

The Squatter of Amon Rûdh · 03-24-2006, 07:11 AM

I hope I'm not expected to congratulate you for following my highway to the answer. Good to see you back on the thread all the same.

See what I mean, folks, about having already seen the answer today?

Turambar · 03-24-2006, 07:32 AM

Thank you for solving my three and a half month old puzzle - is that what you meant to say?

I'll try to think of a new one today.

The Squatter of Amon Rûdh · 03-24-2006, 07:38 AM

Well, that too, obviously. I didn't realise it had been so long. How time flies when you're in stasis.

Turambar · 03-24-2006, 09:55 AM

Fish lost its tail, but swims after endless perdition to the sea.

The Squatter of Amon Rûdh · 03-24-2006, 10:25 AM

Fish lost its tail: 'carp' minus its 'p' - car
Endless perdition: 'Hell' without its last letter - hel

Which would leave us with Helcar, a sea.

**The Saucepan Man** · 03-24-2006, 10:28 AM

Well, Squatter's had me compeletely stumped, but I think I have an idea about this one.

Endless perdition = Hel minus l = Hel
Tailless fish = Carp minus p = Car

Tailless fish swimming after endless perdition = Helcar

Helcar is an inland sea.

So, Helcar.

**The Saucepan Man** · 03-24-2006, 10:29 AM

Bah! Pipped to the post. Curse you, Squatter!

Btw, good to see you back, Turambar.

Turambar · 03-24-2006, 11:05 AM

Thank you!

I'm thinking that it would take a difficult puzzle indeed to stump either of you. Not that Helcar was very tough.

I'm going to try make my next one a true poser.

The Squatter of Amon Rûdh · 03-27-2006, 05:10 AM

Hopefully this manages to avoid the Scylla of dispensing clues for three months, although it may easily be sucked into the Charybdis of being answered within an hour.

Merchant town: her togas are in a terrible state.

**The Saucepan Man** · 03-27-2006, 06:23 AM

Being in such a state of disarray, I feel it my duty to rearrange her togas forthwith, to provide Esgaroth, the merchant town of the Long Lake.

The Squatter of Amon Rûdh · 03-27-2006, 09:09 AM

I didn't realise you were such a dab hand with linens. Esgaroth it is.

Morsul the Dark · 03-27-2006, 09:49 AM

and for once i knew that too sadly saucey had beat me by a good long while

**The Saucepan Man** · 03-27-2006, 10:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Squatter

I didn't realise you were such a dab hand with linens.

Only those composed of threads such as this one ...

Next up:

Plague victim features in novel transposed after discovery of old city.

Morsul the Dark · 03-28-2006, 10:16 AM

well lets see...THe best-known symtom of the plague were red rings(from which derived ring around the rosey) the symptom being Rings

in novel Lord of the Rings

Transposed changed moved....War of the Rings?

Im assuming because the War of the ring is slightly less detail than LOTR you want to know which city(an old one is Missing from the text) and since I do not

for now my guess is

The War of the ring

(i think i got the first part right(the plague thing) the rest is rubbish)

**The Saucepan Man** · 03-28-2006, 11:04 AM

I am afraid that you are on the wrong track, Morsul ...

Turambar · 03-28-2006, 11:50 AM

That's a tough one! It's "features" not "featured", right?

*goes to ponder*

Morsul the Dark · 03-28-2006, 12:50 PM

you know what im betting it is "featured"

Earendil the mariner?
He found the undying lands but then chose to be immortal for his wife so transposed after discovering the lost city he was a victem of morgoths wrath(he went to ask the valar for help)

at first i thought "Plague victim features in novel " transposed meant that entire phrase was an anagram for an old city but unless i missed it i couldnt find any cities that would be an anagram of that phrase

Sauce: am i ever actually on the right track

Mithalwen · 03-28-2006, 12:59 PM

My guess is that "Plague victim" is the straight clue ..and that has just given me an idea of where to look...

But I don't have the book on me *Curses*

Mithalwen · 03-28-2006, 01:12 PM

Telemnar was the King of Gondor who died int eh great plague but I can't make the clue fit. Meh...

Turambar · 03-28-2006, 02:48 PM

I thought old city was the straight clue and I note that M. Michel was a victim of The Plague (Camus), but Michel Delving doesn't fit the rest of the clue and in any case Michel isn't transposed (as it should be) in the guess.

So . . . . where were we?

The other Tolkien-related plague victim I remember was Lalaith/Urwen.

**The Saucepan Man** · 03-28-2006, 06:35 PM

Turambar - you have mentioned the correct answer. Now all you have to do is work out which one it is and give me the reasoning ...

11-27-2005, 03:43 PM	#721
Morsul the Dark Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 3,448	Well an explorers home on the sea ship was first in mind however bilbo could be considered an explorer and he had many homes bagend rivendel but most notably on the sea Lake-Town? __________________ Morsul the Resurrected

11-28-2005, 08:35 AM	#723
Morsul the Dark Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 3,448	well Eriol was the explorer he went to the cottage of lost play so i looked at the lost tales for eriols ship i didnt find it however.... Vai is the outer ocean with the world ship on top of it so... Since the Cottage is west I would have to Say NUME? __________________ Morsul the Resurrected

11-28-2005, 11:43 AM	#724
The Squatter of Amon Rûdh Spectre of Decay Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Bar-en-Danwedh Posts: 2,178	Unfinished business It's Unfinished Tales rather than The Book of Lost Tales in which we must look for this answer. This floating palace is Eämbar, or Sea-home, which was built by Aldarion, king of Númenor. It was a home both for the king himself and for his guild of explorers, so it's an explorer's and an explorers' home, literally on the sea. __________________ Man kenuva métim' andúne?

12-01-2005, 07:49 AM	#726
The Squatter of Amon Rûdh Spectre of Decay Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Bar-en-Danwedh Posts: 2,178	More encryption for the crypt And I you. I like fiendish clues. Without further ado I shall begin to make use of my newly acquired thread. Tell me, ye luminaries, the meaning of this. King, for example, backed by unconventional advance, builds a nation __________________ Man kenuva métim' andúne? Last edited by The Squatter of Amon Rûdh; 12-01-2005 at 07:56 AM.

12-09-2005, 09:48 AM	#727
Morsul the Dark Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 3,448	ok thorondor? hes king for example EG kind of like eagles King for eagles his origin is unknown(unconventional advance)and he built eyries in the high mountains of someplace(i dont know what an eyrie is buti looked over all the kings i couuld think of and this one fit best __________________ Morsul the Resurrected

12-09-2005, 06:20 PM	#728
Gil-Galad Psyche of Prince Immortal Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Above a Parapet Obvious exits are: North, South, and Dennis Posts: 4,734	Gwaihir the Windlord? unconvential advance could mean the wind pshing him... __________________ Love doesn't blow up and get killed.

12-12-2005, 04:29 AM	#729
The Squatter of Amon Rûdh Spectre of Decay Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Bar-en-Danwedh Posts: 2,178	Far too avian Nothing to do with eagles, I'm afraid. __________________ Man kenuva métim' andúne?

02-08-2006, 06:18 AM	#730
The Squatter of Amon Rûdh Spectre of Decay Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Bar-en-Danwedh Posts: 2,178	The Kraken Wakes I'm not so patient as the Green Knight, so I'm sending this monster back to the surface. If it shames an answer out of anyone it's worth my saying that my clue isn't difficult: King, for example, backed by unconventional advance, builds a nation Clue: you've probably already seen the answer today. __________________ Man kenuva métim' andúne?

02-08-2006, 06:21 AM	#731
Mithalwen Pilgrim Soul Join Date: May 2004 Location: watching the wonga-wonga birds circle... Posts: 9,460	I guess unconventional could be signalling an anagram.. __________________ “But Finrod walks with Finarfin his father beneath the trees in Eldamar.” Christopher Tolkien, Requiescat in pace

02-08-2006, 10:23 AM	#732
The Squatter of Amon Rûdh Spectre of Decay Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Bar-en-Danwedh Posts: 2,178	Unconventional Indeed it could. __________________ Man kenuva métim' andúne?

03-17-2006, 11:59 AM	#733
Morsul the Dark Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 3,448	I think we've all but given up on this one a few hints if you would my good sir __________________ Morsul the Resurrected

03-18-2006, 06:33 AM	#734
Mithalwen Pilgrim Soul Join Date: May 2004 Location: watching the wonga-wonga birds circle... Posts: 9,460	How many letters would be useful __________________ “But Finrod walks with Finarfin his father beneath the trees in Eldamar.” Christopher Tolkien, Requiescat in pace

03-18-2006, 08:49 AM	#735
JennyHallu The Pearl, The Lily Maid Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: In my luxury Barrow, snuggled up in a pile of satin pillows, eating fresh fruit. Posts: 1,628	It looks to me that the answer is going to consist of the name of a or a synonym for king, followed by an anagram of "advance" and will spell out a nation. I'm not very good at cryptic clues though, so I'm wondering if anyone else has had the same idea. The clue seems awfully straightforward. __________________ <=== Lookee, lookee, lots of IM handles!

03-18-2006, 01:29 PM	#736
Mithalwen Pilgrim Soul Join Date: May 2004 Location: watching the wonga-wonga birds circle... Posts: 9,460	That is what I would expect Jenny but it hasn't got me any closer. __________________ “But Finrod walks with Finarfin his father beneath the trees in Eldamar.” Christopher Tolkien, Requiescat in pace

03-22-2006, 07:36 AM	#737
The Squatter of Amon Rûdh Spectre of Decay Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Bar-en-Danwedh Posts: 2,178	Hints and tips I'm not telling anyone the number of letters in the solution, but I will expand on Jenny's interpretation of the clue. As usual, if it seems too simple to be true, it probably is. A lesser-known cryptic technique, known to such as the benighted souls who do the Grauniad crossword, is for the word that is an anagram to be defined in the clue but not actually given. For example: 'Youngster always allowed to run amok' = Anagram of 'ever let' = Leveret. I also draw your attention to my use of the phrase 'for example', which is significant, although not at all cryptic in its meaning. __________________ Man kenuva métim' andúne?

03-23-2006, 06:43 AM	#738
Mithalwen Pilgrim Soul Join Date: May 2004 Location: watching the wonga-wonga birds circle... Posts: 9,460	This will be hopeless - I am too Telegraph-minded! __________________ “But Finrod walks with Finarfin his father beneath the trees in Eldamar.” Christopher Tolkien, Requiescat in pace

03-23-2006, 07:20 PM	#739
Turambar Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Non-Stop Home Posts: 859	And I'm too Nation-minded, but . . . Cardolan ? A king is one type of card, and a loan is an advance . . . __________________ In the upper air the fireflies move more slowly. Last edited by Turambar; 03-23-2006 at 07:24 PM.

03-24-2006, 07:11 AM	#740
The Squatter of Amon Rûdh Spectre of Decay Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Bar-en-Danwedh Posts: 2,178	Inevitably, yes I hope I'm not expected to congratulate you for following my highway to the answer. Good to see you back on the thread all the same. See what I mean, folks, about having already seen the answer today? __________________ Man kenuva métim' andúne?

03-24-2006, 07:32 AM	#741
Turambar Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Non-Stop Home Posts: 859	Thank you for solving my three and a half month old puzzle - is that what you meant to say? I'll try to think of a new one today. __________________ In the upper air the fireflies move more slowly.

03-24-2006, 07:38 AM	#742
The Squatter of Amon Rûdh Spectre of Decay Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Bar-en-Danwedh Posts: 2,178	Thank you for solving my three and a half month old puzzle Well, that too, obviously. I didn't realise it had been so long. How time flies when you're in stasis. __________________ Man kenuva métim' andúne?

03-24-2006, 09:55 AM	#743
Turambar Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Non-Stop Home Posts: 859	Fish lost its tail, but swims after endless perdition to the sea. __________________ In the upper air the fireflies move more slowly.

03-24-2006, 10:25 AM	#744
The Squatter of Amon Rûdh Spectre of Decay Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Bar-en-Danwedh Posts: 2,178	Fish lost its tail: 'carp' minus its 'p' - car Endless perdition: 'Hell' without its last letter - hel Which would leave us with Helcar, a sea. __________________ Man kenuva métim' andúne?

03-24-2006, 10:28 AM	#745
The Saucepan Man Corpus Cacophonous Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: A green and pleasant land Posts: 8,390	Well, Squatter's had me compeletely stumped, but I think I have an idea about this one. Endless perdition = Hel minus l = Hel Tailless fish = Carp minus p = Car Tailless fish swimming after endless perdition = Helcar Helcar is an inland sea. So, Helcar. __________________ Do you mind? I'm busy doing the fishstick. It's a very delicate state of mind!

03-24-2006, 10:29 AM	#746
The Saucepan Man Corpus Cacophonous Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: A green and pleasant land Posts: 8,390	Bah! Pipped to the post. Curse you, Squatter! Btw, good to see you back, Turambar. __________________ Do you mind? I'm busy doing the fishstick. It's a very delicate state of mind!

03-24-2006, 11:05 AM	#747
Turambar Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Non-Stop Home Posts: 859	Thank you! I'm thinking that it would take a difficult puzzle indeed to stump either of you. Not that Helcar was very tough. I'm going to try make my next one a true poser. __________________ In the upper air the fireflies move more slowly.

03-27-2006, 05:10 AM	#748
The Squatter of Amon Rûdh Spectre of Decay Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Bar-en-Danwedh Posts: 2,178	Here goes again Hopefully this manages to avoid the Scylla of dispensing clues for three months, although it may easily be sucked into the Charybdis of being answered within an hour. Merchant town: her togas are in a terrible state. __________________ Man kenuva métim' andúne? Last edited by The Squatter of Amon Rûdh; 03-27-2006 at 05:20 AM.

03-27-2006, 06:23 AM	#749
The Saucepan Man Corpus Cacophonous Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: A green and pleasant land Posts: 8,390	Being in such a state of disarray, I feel it my duty to rearrange her togas forthwith, to provide Esgaroth, the merchant town of the Long Lake. __________________ Do you mind? I'm busy doing the fishstick. It's a very delicate state of mind!

03-27-2006, 09:09 AM	#750
The Squatter of Amon Rûdh Spectre of Decay Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Bar-en-Danwedh Posts: 2,178	Reconstituted laundry I didn't realise you were such a dab hand with linens. Esgaroth it is. __________________ Man kenuva métim' andúne?

03-27-2006, 09:49 AM	#751
Morsul the Dark Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 3,448	and for once i knew that too sadly saucey had beat me by a good long while __________________ Morsul the Resurrected

03-28-2006, 10:16 AM	#753
Morsul the Dark Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 3,448	well lets see...THe best-known symtom of the plague were red rings(from which derived ring around the rosey) the symptom being Rings in novel Lord of the Rings Transposed changed moved....War of the Rings? Im assuming because the War of the ring is slightly less detail than LOTR you want to know which city(an old one is Missing from the text) and since I do not for now my guess is The War of the ring (i think i got the first part right(the plague thing) the rest is rubbish) __________________ Morsul the Resurrected

03-28-2006, 11:04 AM	#754
The Saucepan Man Corpus Cacophonous Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: A green and pleasant land Posts: 8,390	I am afraid that you are on the wrong track, Morsul ... __________________ Do you mind? I'm busy doing the fishstick. It's a very delicate state of mind!

03-28-2006, 11:50 AM	#755
Turambar Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Non-Stop Home Posts: 859	That's a tough one! It's "features" not "featured", right? goes to ponder __________________ In the upper air the fireflies move more slowly.

03-28-2006, 12:50 PM	#756
Morsul the Dark Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 3,448	you know what im betting it is "featured" Earendil the mariner? He found the undying lands but then chose to be immortal for his wife so transposed after discovering the lost city he was a victem of morgoths wrath(he went to ask the valar for help) at first i thought "Plague victim features in novel " transposed meant that entire phrase was an anagram for an old city but unless i missed it i couldnt find any cities that would be an anagram of that phrase Sauce: am i ever actually on the right track __________________ Morsul the Resurrected Last edited by Morsul the Dark; 03-28-2006 at 01:11 PM.

03-28-2006, 12:59 PM	#757
Mithalwen Pilgrim Soul Join Date: May 2004 Location: watching the wonga-wonga birds circle... Posts: 9,460	My guess is that "Plague victim" is the straight clue ..and that has just given me an idea of where to look... But I don't have the book on me Curses __________________ “But Finrod walks with Finarfin his father beneath the trees in Eldamar.” Christopher Tolkien, Requiescat in pace

03-28-2006, 01:12 PM	#758
Mithalwen Pilgrim Soul Join Date: May 2004 Location: watching the wonga-wonga birds circle... Posts: 9,460	Telemnar was the King of Gondor who died int eh great plague but I can't make the clue fit. Meh... __________________ “But Finrod walks with Finarfin his father beneath the trees in Eldamar.” Christopher Tolkien, Requiescat in pace