The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum


Visit The *EVEN NEWER* Barrow-Downs Photo Page

Go Back   The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum > Middle-Earth Discussions > The Books
User Name
Password
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


 
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Prev Previous Post   Next Post Next
Old 03-08-2005, 09:12 PM   #6
Lostgaeriel
Shade of Carn Dûm
 
Lostgaeriel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Toronto the Good
Posts: 477
Lostgaeriel has just left Hobbiton.
Sting Man! Indeed not!

First of all, can a mature male hobbit be called a man?

Lolidir wrote:
Quote:
bc i would consider Merry a man, wouldnt you? some may say no he was a Hobbit
Let's go to a good source on this question:

Quote:
'I will vouch for him before the seat of Denethor,' said Gandalf. 'And as for valour, that cannot be computed by stature. He has passed through more battles and perils than you have, Ingold, though you be twice his height; and he comes now from the storming of Isengard, of which we bear tidings, and great weariness is on him, or I would wake him. His name is Peregrim, a very valiant man.'

'Man?' said Ingold dubiously, and the others laughed.

'Man!' cried Pippin, now thoroughly roused. 'Man! Indeed not! I am a hobbit and no more valiant than I am a man, save perhaps now and again by necessity. Do not let Gandlaf deceive you!'
If a hobbit says that a hobbit is not a man, then I think that question is settled.

This is of course the reason why we debate whose blow actually killed/destroyed the Witch King - Eowyn's or Merry's. (But that is discussed on another thread.)

But back to the initial question posed by Feanor of the Peredhil which I think I can paraphrase as 'Could the Witch King have been killed by an unliving man or unliving woman?’.

Note that Glorfindel does not include the adjective 'living' in the following excerpt from Appendix A, Annals of the Kings and Rulers; I, The Númenorean Kings; (iv) Gondor and the Heirs of Anarion (just before The Stewards section):

Quote:
’Eärnur now rode back, but Glorfindel, looking into the gathering dark, said: “Do not pursue him! He will not return to this land. Far off yet is his doom, and not by the hand of man will he fall.” These words many remembered; but Eärnur was angry desiring only to be avenged for his disgrace.
So, 'Could the Witch King have been killed by an unliving man or unliving woman?’
is not relevant to the actual 'prophecy' by Glorfindel. Sorry about that. (I really didn't know what my conclusion was going to be until I searched through the quotes.)
__________________
Elen síla lúmenn’ omentielvo, a star shines on the hour of our meeting.

Last edited by Lostgaeriel; 03-08-2005 at 10:24 PM.
Lostgaeriel is offline   Reply With Quote
 

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:45 AM.



Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2025, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.