Saruman's fireball

[The Saucepan Man]

I doubt that Jackson and co really thought about it that much. They just wanted a nice effect that (non-book reading) viewers would like and, at the same time, would show that Gandalf's powers were now superior to those of Saruman.

Hey, you could come up with any number of theories. Perhaps the restrictions placed on the Istari prevented them using such powerful magic on "lesser" beings.

Although it seems to me that Saruman would have been hard pressed to take all of the Ents out and, Lolidir pointed out, a fireball would have been practically useless once the Ents undammed the river.

[Lyta_Underhill]

The fireball didn't bother me nearly as much as Legolas shooting Wormtongue did! Totally gratuitous and another instance of weakening the integrity of Legolas to have him perform a stunt...I don't think a fireball is out of character for Saruman, although we can argue he would not have had the proper skill in terms of the ordering of Middle Earth , etc., etc.,....

Cheers!
Lyta

[Essex]

Legolas was trying to save the life of another person. That is a noble cause, not gratuitous, and did not weaken his character IMO.

[Lyta_Underhill]

Legolas was trying to save the life of another person. That is a noble cause, not gratuitous, and did not weaken his character IMO.

I'll have to go back and watch it again, because I could have sworn he launched the arrow when it was already too late!

Cheers!
Lyta

[alatar]

Originally Posted by Lyta_Underhill

I'll have to go back and watch it again, because I could have sworn he launched the arrow when it was already too late!

Thought the same, but am relying on memory. And why would Legolas kill someone who was killing the 'bad guy'? Oh, that's right, because Saruman was just about to tell Gandalf something important, and interrupting the same must have warranted death as Gandalf the Anxious needed some assurance...

It is assumed that Legolas' slaying of Wormtongue was a nod to Wormtongue's death in the Scouring of the Shire, but if so, it's pretty weak. The hobbits in the Shire heard that Wormtongue may have eaten the Chief, and so were hot to shoot someone. But Legolas?

And in regards to Saruman vs the Ents, he could have at least attempted to torch the Ent (or was it Ents?) that was undamming the river.

[The Saucepan Man]

Originally Posted by alatar

And in regards to Saruman vs the Ents, he could have at least attempted to torch the Ent (or was it Ents?) that was undamming the river.

It is many years since I last played Dungeons and Dragons but, if my memory serves, I don't believe that the fireball spell has sufficient range.

[Snorri Swifthammer]

Originally Posted by The Saucepan Man

It is many years since I last played Dungeons and Dragons but, if my memory serves, I don't believe that the fireball spell has sufficient range.

[geek on]

text from fireball from newest version of D&D (important part bolded)

Fireball
Evocation [Fire]
Level: Sor/Wiz 3
Components: V, S, M
Casting Time: 1 standard action
Range: Long (400 ft. + 40 ft./level)
Area: 20-ft.-radius spread
Duration: Instantaneous
Saving Throw: Reflex half
Spell Resistance: Yes
A fireball spell is an explosion of flame that detonates with a low roar and deals 1d6 points of fire damage per caster level (maximum 10d6) to every creature within the area. Unattended objects also take this damage. The explosion creates almost no pressure.
You point your finger and determine the range (distance and height) at which the fireball is to burst. A glowing, pea-sized bead streaks from the pointing digit and, unless it impacts upon a material body or solid barrier prior to attaining the prescribed range, blossoms into the fireball at that point. (An early impact results in an early detonation.) If you attempt to send the bead through a narrow passage, such as through an arrow slit, you must “hit” the opening with a ranged touch attack, or else the bead strikes the barrier and detonates prematurely.
The fireball sets fire to combustibles and damages objects in the area. It can melt metals with low melting points, such as lead, gold, copper, silver, and bronze. If the damage caused to an interposing barrier shatters or breaks through it, the fireball may continue beyond the barrier if the area permits; otherwise it stops at the barrier just as any other spell effect does.
Material Component: A tiny ball of bat guano and sulfur.

So if we assume that Saruman is high level (maybe 17th) you have a range of 400 * (40*17) ft. ( 1080 ft.) Not bad, apparently PJ didn't do his research!!!!


[geek off]

[alatar]

Originally Posted by The Saucepan Man

It is many years since I last played Dungeons and Dragons but, if my memory serves, I don't believe that the fireball spell has sufficient range.

LOL - that's pretty funny. Played the same way way back in the day. Surely someone is geeked out enough to have run the calculation.

And it was from his staff, which shortens the distance at least a few feet.

And wasn't this the same Saruman who caused snow many miles away (he was at it again this weekend), then even caused a lightening bolt to hit Caradhras?

Which raises the next question - if Saruman could do all of the above, couldn't he have hampered Gandalf's escape via the Eagle?

Note that I'm not that serious about all of this - it's not like it's 'Gandalf losing to Witch-King' important...