The Fall of the North Planning/Discussion Thread

[Kransha]

Likewise, Ossë

I've been wanting to clarify one or two things, but never really got around to saying anything. So, this seems like the ideal time.

I must impress upon you, my fellow writers, that this is a game that takes place in a somewhat archaic time. Many of you have played in Rohan (and are probably more well-versed than I in the ways of BD writing/gaming, so this seems condescending), but others have not. This game touches on a civilization that is not widely portrayed in either Tolkien or RPGs, Arnor. Arnor is a sister of Gondor, in a sense, but an ancient one, as this game takes place a good millenia before the events of The Lord of the Rings, which, in itself, is not modern. Thus, it seems that Arthedain would be like an offshoot, slightly modernized, of Numenor, as I mentioned in my little note about the structure of Fornost.

I'm not entirely sure why I'm saying this. Everyone seems to have grasped the concept, but, I'll just make the point. Like I've implied, time and time again, I am trying to avoid becoming manipulative, and want this game to be as open-ended as possible, considering that it has a definite ending. Luckily, we've been allowed quite a bit of liberty, but I'd like to stick to a genuine ideal. Had to get that off my chest, if it makes any sense.

Saurreg: In a desire to get your bio complete, I'll give you a little critique of what you have. Your bio, in itself, is great, and Belegorn is a very interesting character, but there are a few quirks in your first post. You don't have to change these things, but they are merely oddities - For one, your use of military terms (i.e. regiment) is spot-on, but I do not think all of them are appropriate. The rearguard is not a regiment, in the normal sense, but I suppose you may call it that if you so wish. One thing that does seem inaccurate is the use of the term "Royal" to describe everything. In truth, the rearguard is Royal, I guess, but the army is not, and Royal seems to be too specific an adjective to describe the rearguard, especially capitalized, because that implies that all these things are royal, something out of 1600's France, perhaps. Similarly, I find the use of 'drummer boys' in an archaic setting to be jarring, but hey, that's just me.

There I go again, with my controlliness. Well, change whatever you want, it's not a big deal. I'll just make my peace here, and establish what does not seem to fit.

Also, I would like to consider something. At the time of this game, there was a very recent political controversy, of national scale and depth, involving Arvedui.

On the death of Ondoher [King of Gondor at the time, slain by Wainriders] and his sons, Arvedui of the North-kingdom claimed the crown of Gondor, as the direct descendant of Isildur, and as the husband of Fíriel, only surviving child of Ondoher. The claim was rejected. In this Pelendur, the Steward of King Ondoher, played the chief part.
'The Council of Gondor answered: "The crown and royalty of Gondor belongs solely to the heirs of Meneldil, son of Anárion, to whom Isildur relinquished this realm. In Gondor this heritage is reckoned through the sons only; and we have not heard that the law is otherwise in Arnor."
'To this Arvedui replied: "Elendil had two sons, of whom Isildur was the elder and the heir of his father. We have heard that the name of Elendil stands to this day at the head of the line of the Kings of Gondor, since he was accounted the high king of all the lands of the Dúnedain. While Elendil still lived, the conjoint rule in the South was committed to his sons; but when Elendil fell, Isildur departed to take up the high kingship of his father, and committed the rule in the South in like manner to the son of his brother. He did not relinquish his royalty in Gondor, nor intend that the realm of Elendil should be divided for ever.
'"Moreover, in Númenor of old the sceptre descended to the eldest child of the king, whether man or woman. It is true that the law has not been observed in the lands of exile ever troubled by war; but such was the law of our people, to which we now refer, seeing that the sons of Ondoher died childless."
To this Gondor made no answer. The crown was claimed by Eárnil, the victorious captain; and it was granted to him with the approval of all the Dúnedain in Gondor, since he was of the royal house. He was the son of Siriondil, son of Calimmacil, son of Arciryas brother of Narmacil II. Arvedui did not press his claim; for he had neither the power nor the will to oppose the choice of the Dúnedain of Gondor; yet the claim was never forgotten by his descendants even when their kingship had passed away.
-Appendix A, The Return of the King

This caused a great upheaval, no doubt, when it occured, and many people were forced to take sides, although it didn't matter to the decision, which was made by Gondorian counselors. I suggest that, it would be an interesting character exercise to think about how your character[s] might have felt about this incident, when it occured. Did your character support Arvedui's claim, or were they against it? All characters, except maybe the two Dunedain children, were around at this time, and must've had a political stance on the matter.

This is not a requirement, just a suggestion.

P.S. pio, in light of recent developements, I have written a little prologue to the game. Should I, perhaps, PM it to you for pre-approval?

[Saurreg]

If a military outfit is raised in the services of a monarch, then it is a "royal" unit. These units also include forces commanded by a banneret in the services of a king or queen. The guard units like the rearguard and such that are raised by the mornarch himself or adopted, are household units. Historical units are the Praetorian Guards, the Guard Grenadiers, Maison du Roi etc etc.

But fine, I will remove the royal and rename the rearguard even if I don't know what type of unit it is now.

Fair enough, the drummer boys will go. Even though after the second crusade, european armies started to deploy kress, nakers and tabor drummers on the battlefield.

Anything else you want me to change?

[CaptainofDespair]

Yes, but Tolkien's Middle-Earth isn't second crusade in nature. It is more of a Dark Age setting. Thus, drummer boys would not appear.

[Kransha]

Saurreg, you need not change anything. Your historical acumen is quite something. I should've specified that, even though the rearguard was raised by the King, it's sole function is not to act as his personal guard, it is to cover the retreat of the armies of Arthedain in any situation. I think I mentioned something about the King's Guard in my original post (if I didn't, I should mention it), who are the ones that follow the king around, ala Praetorian Guards (thankfully, these are a little less power-grubbing than the Praetorian Guards, and don't look to kill the King every chance they get).

You don't have to remove 'royal' from the rearguard, just tacking it onto the whole army feels like overkill.

And CoD hit the nail on the head about the drummer boys. But, the main thing is, for the "Good Guys" of Middle-Earth, horns seem to be the signallers of tactical movements. Drums are, in Tolkien, used exclusively by orcs (Moria, Pelennor Fields [cinematic version], etc.). In the interest of canon, and fluidity, drummers are out of place in such a society.

But, in the interest of being non-manipulative, you may keep in there whatever you wish to keep. Whatever is edited in your next edit of that bio will be final, and postable to the section reserved for it above: the proposal.

Saurreg, I do apologize for all my profuse pickiness, but I have a very good reason, which I'm not sure I'm supposed to explain yet, but you'll find out soon enough. Thanks for all the editing and re-writing of your post, each different phase has been excellent in itself, and your level of tolerance for my shenanigans is more than admirable. Thanks again.

So, that's 3 down, 7 to go...and, we may be getting another player on board.

[piosenniel]

Kransha

Can you just put it here on the Planning Thread? That will be fine.

Child and I have approved your game for play - now all that needs to be hammered out are the final details between you and the Dedicated Players.

~*~

About warfare for Middle-earth RPG's in the Shire:

Most of the games based around the War of the Ring times would have a medieval flavor to their warfare techniques. This game, which is much earlier, would be the late Dark Ages, as CaptainofDespair suggested.

For a look at basic medieval weapons and techniques you can look at the Shire's RPG resources thread.

[Lalwendë]

I've a few questions if that's OK? I thought I'd post them here as the answers may be of benefit to others.

They are of a narrative variety. In my first post you will see the Dunedain woman become a widow, and she will be warned of the danger she is in. This is really an 'exposition' post, where she will be presented to the reader - through narrative. This is the pivotal moment in setting up my character. Thinking about how this will further develop, I was going to write of her visiting with her father as battle rages about the city. What I wanted to know before I do this, is whether, at the end of our first posts, the aim is to have all characters ready for evacuation? If not, then I shall save this further narrative/exposition scene for a second post - if this happens at that point.

Sorry to be a bit technical there, by the way, old habits die hard!

[Kransha]

Lalwendë, in response to your question, yes, technically. The end of initial first posts should be when everyone has been rounded up and ready for evacuation from Fornost. The battle will still be going on (I have a second post to be placed up after all the First Posts which will show the end of the battle) at the end of all first posts. CoD's and Saurreg's posts have a good grasp of what is going on, so use that template as a rubric, but, civilians would not be in the same situations.

All first posts should include, at some point, rendez-vous and/or rescue by the rearguard, which is sweeping through the city to round up the Elves and survivors, as my First Post specified. The idea of your post sounds like it could fit, but the 'visit' with your character's father must be done keeping in mind that the city has been overtaken, even though the rearguard is holding off the Angmar-host.

pio, I have to spruce up that Prologue a bit, then I'll post it to here. Thanks for that informational point about the Arnorian military, by the way.

[Lalwendë]

Thanks for that!

I am thinking that my character would be urged to rescue her father by the words of her dying husaband; to this end I was going to write of her visiting the old boy (an elderly retired captain) who is being steadfast in refusing to give up and go. This will enable me to show the old man as he has influenced my character in a significant way, and also work in something of the panic that would be going on, the fear, and also the bravery of the Dunedain. Anyway, I'll enjoy doing a little more writing!

Can I ask one more question if it's not too cheeky? At what time of the day is the city finally overtaken by the enemy? This is just to ensure my timing is correct.