What will you choose?

[Diamond18]

Ah... this old fascinating thread. I saw the title on the main forum index and thought, "Is that what I think it is....?" Some threads are so thought provoking they stick in your mind long after you've read them.

I'm still a Right person, actually even moreso than I was the last time I posted. But funnily enough, in that post I used a story I was writing as an analogy and since then I've realized that my ending didn't work -- my characters, like me, just plain ended up being Right people despite everything I wrote into their lives to make it as easy as possible to leave this world behind. One of those instances where you realize you're just forcing an outcome that doesn't really fit. That realization and change of plan really meshes with my stance all the more, though, so I won't complain. I think the trouble is because fantasy worlds, no matter how much time you spend imagining them, when compared to our world, always end up being small and narrow and limited. M-E may be one of the deepest, but at the end it's still the imaginings of one man's mind, and so if I stood there I would probably be hit even harder with its limitations.

And then of course, since I am a writer, even living in M-E I'd have all these stories in my head that have been inspired by this world. I wouldn't be able to show them to anyone from M-E. That would be a drag. I couldn't force myself to forget about everything I know and write only M-E appropriate stories, that just wouldn't be me. I can just see the look on a hobbit's face when reading something I wrote. Hee. Hee. Hee. (evilman smiley where are you?)

At any rate, I still think it's a mistake to measure the worth of the two worlds by comparing good and bad elements. I'm not basing my desicion on the fact that "I can't live without all my friends and family/modern conveniences/favorite stories/rock music" etc. (though the thought of no more rock does make me shiver ;p) because frankly I hope that if was called to live without those things in this world I could indeed survive without them. All those "comforts" can't be the things that keep you alive. Losing them could very well happen. After all, there are lots of places in this world, like Third World countries, where there are no modern conveinences or free culture. I thank God that I do live in America and have the luxury of thinking this world is pretty swell. I don't want to disrespect the trials and tribulations of other nations and say that life in America is bad because the rent is high, so you won't hear me screaming "get me outta here" anytime soon.

Back to comparison to M-E: Sauron beats the pants off of any unpopular world leader/government that's ever been in this world, so I have to laugh when that is cited as a reason to leave here. We have the benefit of knowing that in LotR everything turns out pretty swell in the end, with Sauron being defeated. But the inhabitants of the story don't have that foresight. Indeed, one of the huge themes of the book is that even when you don't know if there will ever be a Shire to go home to you must still persevere. One of the things that makes Tolkien's work so powerful is the hope in face of bleakness -- to turn from our own world in the way that the Hobbits et al did not turn from theirs seems very ironic considering! Of course, then there are the Elves, who did take their equivalent to the "Left" and sail away to Valinor, but they were immortal and so that was really their "heaven" and I won't begrudge them such a thing.

And now... goodness, I just remembered that I made tea for myself nearly two hours ago and it's been steeping ever since.

[Lyta_Underhill]

Hmmmm....for me, I think it would be a matter more of a 'kick in the pants' rather than a choice. I think that, if I were thrown into Middle Earth, I would love some of it and hate some of it. But what in this world are those of you who wish to experience something new trying to get away from? Wouldn't it be awful if you took that with you into Middle Earth and couldn't get back? I think that it would be possible to truly enjoy Middle Earth OR this world if one became a 'different person'. Middle Earth would be a 'kick in the pants,' a call for you to become something different, to experience the new and challenging, to liven up your life. That is available here in this world as well, but I, like Frodo, am getting rather used to being Master of my own Bag End and I think it gets harder and harder to change my life and outlook unless someone or something hits me over the head with it. I think I prefer to wander the backroads and woods and meet up with the Elves and Fairies, rather than being handed the Ring of Power and being told to survive by the seat of my pants. Simply put, even though I am not in Middle Earth, I can see the aspects of it here well enough to enjoy its comforts in my imagination, and I need not be thrust into the Fire to live in Middle Earth. (Although if I were kicked into Middle Earth, I could probably get used to it!)

I sure hope that made sense. It's real late here! Goodnight all!
Cheers,
Lyta

P.S. Anyone think about what it would be like to be all comfortable and complacent, looking forward to a quiet life and suddenly being thrown into a world of danger? Did I ever mention I sometimes identify too closely with Frodo?

[Diamond18]

Originally Posted by Evisse the Blue

reaches out for the red pill
I'll go left, into the 'flawed' fantasy world of a human (oh, but a human genius!)

Isn't the Red Pill more like choosing the Right Door? In the Matrix, the Blue Pill leads back to a more comforting, likable world, and the Red Pill leads to the dire reality. Granted, the Matrix-world is patterned after our world as it is, the world we'd be staying in by taking the Right Door, while the "real world" in that movie is a science fiction creation, but the principle is still there. The Matrix is like the temptation of the "sun dappled Elven glade" but the characters chose to face the technologically scarred, war-torn eco-disaster of the "real world" because the harder path was the more rewarding one.

However, seeing as how I didn't see the third Matrix movie because the second one was so uninspiring, I can't really say if the final outcome was portrayed as rewarding or not.

[Nurumaiel]

...but I, like Frodo, am getting rather used to being Master of my own Bag End...

Lyta, you have summed up my entire feelings in these shorts words. It's something that I found very hard to describe; I commend you for your excellent work in saying it half a sentence!

To wake up in the morning in my own little room and hear the birds singing and little feet just beginning to run about... Sure, I could have a little room in the Shire (or wherever I would live in Middle-Earth) but it wouldn't by my little room, because I already have a little room. Birds would sing, but they wouldn't be the birds I've tempted for hours a day with seeds so they would come perch on my hand. Little feet might run about and I might hear children's laughter but they wouldn't be the dear children I've become accustomed to hearing.

And to wander out into the garden and bid good morning to the flowers, feeling delighted when I see new little buds blooming. It would be highly unlikely that I wouldn't have a garden in the Shire, but it wouldn't be my garden because my garden wouldn't be home.

I could have books in the Shire, I suppose, but they wouldn't be my books that have been passed down through the family till they came to me. And I could sit by a fireside and read, but it wouldn't be the fireside of my childhood, the one I have sat by for years, the one I sat by when I first heard tales of Frodo and Sam.

I could live without these things, sure, but it would be hard to be somewhere else, in an entirely different world, and still have these things that were not mine. Rather like raising a little boy who was your own and then switching sons with some other woman. You'd still have a little boy but he wouldn't be yours, would he? Of course the pain of switching books, gardens, etc. would be much less than the pain of switching sons! I merely use it as an example... not one quite equal to the situation, I fear.

I would have small regrets about not going to Middle-Earth... it would be lovely to Walk to Rivendell for real.

[Willow]

Right. Not a doubt.
What if we got to Middle-earth, and it wasn't what we wanted? We'd be stuck and disappointed.

[Nilpaurion Felagund]

Long ago, the temptation for me to take the left door would have great. It would have been comparable to Ar-Pharazôn's quest to wrest the Undying Lands from the Valar and claim immortality, shunning the dread of Death. But such temptation comes of ignorance - ignorance of what is, and ignorance of what is desired. This blindness could be summed up in a sentence: That world, indeed any world, is better than this one. So I'll go there.

But is it really? Is life at Middle-earth all it's cracked up to be? A great adventure, or an endless peace, perhaps? Really, what would make Middle-earth superior to Planet Earth?

The setting would have been different, but the same cast participate in the play. Characters with the same weaknesses, the same darkness that lies within the people in this world. Sure, we see shining examples of those who had overcome the shadow, but in the end, we'll see too much of Bill Ferny and Gríma.

It is the truth, in this world as in that of Tolkien's imagination, that vigilance tires. The terror of the Enemy might have been fresh in the people's mind by the end of LotR, but how long before the people grow indifferent again? What if there are no new Travellers to stop the despoliation of the new Sharkey's engines? What if there is no new Gandalf to rally all the Free People to the go up against the return of the Shadow? During the first three Ages of the Sun, it was almost too late to stop the Shadow - indeed, in the Age of the Trees, they were too late. There is precedence for complacency in Middle-earth. What would happen to the next ages? Would the hobbits one day awake to smog, AIDS, or famine?

It would be better for me to live in this world. At least now, with everyone seeing the ascendancy of man’s destructive abilities, people are slowly turning the tide. That would be nice.

Besides, it's escapism. I'd hate the day I have to escape from such a world.

You're just too morbid. Admit it.

[Evisse the Blue]

Diamond, I get your point. I was thinking along the lines of not which is the most rewarding, but which is the most difficult path. Going left would take a lot of adapting and fighting against hardships, despite having one's curiosity infinitely rewarded; while going right (staying behind) would mean settling comfy in the same life as before, with a hint of regret, or maybe with pride in having rejected temptation. That was so smart of you not seeing the third part of Matrix. I wish I had taken the blue pill that one time.

A clarification of my motivation is in order. I see myself almost in the minority here. I don't want to go there in hopes of finding an ideal world. I'm perfectly aware that ME is as full of villains as our world is. I just want a taste of that experience. It won't be better, but granted, it will be different.

[Diamond18]

I don't want to go there in hopes of finding an ideal world. I'm perfectly aware that ME is as full of villains as our world is. I just want a taste of that experience. It won't be better, but granted, it will be different.

Very true. I myself would love to be able to visit Middle-Earth for a time (maybe not Mordor), but Sharon put that "you shall not go back" stipulation in there to make it a more weighty decision. For me that one catch changes it into a matter of foresaking this world forever, and I don't plan on doing that in this life.

Now I wonder -- (and forgive me for posing a new question in your thread, Sharon...)

If you were a person who would, on your own, chose the Right, would you go Left after all if someone you loved was going there and begged you to come with? I mean, if someone you really, really don't think you can live without is bent on going to Middle Earth, how would you react?

I've seen people saying they'd go to Middle Earth and bring so-and-so with them, or would stay because so-and-so wouldn't want to go. But what if you were so-and-so?

Not sure I'd go.... But them I am single so the question is purely hypothetical for me.