Star Wars and Middle-Earth - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

yavanna II · 09-07-2005, 04:31 AM

As I was watching Star Wars for the nth time, my dad came, and said something like this:

"Haven't you noticed any similarities between Star Wars and Lotr?"

I replied: "Pa, they're both great movies..."

Then he told me something he'd read in the internet about Sauron, Darth Vader, Morgoth, the Emperor, Yoda, and Gandalf.

Similarities tween Sauron and D. Vader
1. They were once good, Vader being the former Anakin Skywalker and Sauron the former servant of Aule
2. They were both corrupted: Sauron by Melkor and Anakin by the Emperor

Similarities tween Morgoth and the Emperor
1. THEY'RE STRONG AND MIGHTY!!!
2. They were once good (at least, I think the emperor was once a Jedi)
3. They're very good in corrupting people's minds
4. They're EVIL and powerhungry and treacherous

Similarities tween Yoda and Gandalf
1. They're good
2. THey're OOOOLLLLLLDDDDD!!!!!!
3. They were part of councils of the great and wise
4. They're like guiding people, counselling against evil
5. They're damn good warriors
6. Yoda's strong with the Force and Gandalf is a Maia--don't that make em powerful?
7. They were never allied with evil....

Oh and I must add that I find something similar with Yoda's speech and Gollum's...

Forgiveness I must ask if posted already this thread has been... very curious I was, yess, precious!!!

Boromir88 · 09-07-2005, 05:19 AM

I think you can pick out people from Star Wars movies and compare them to other movies. And same for LOTR. The comparisons being made seem to be general and can be applied to anyone.

Quote:

2. They were once good (at least, I think the emperor was once a Jedi)

Quick note on Mr. Palpatine, he was good but wasn't a jedi. Became a corrupted politician.

Dimcollowen · 09-07-2005, 09:32 AM

yeah there are lots of similarities.....i think that you could even compare obi-wan to Aragorn....they are both great warriors....they both are friends with really great people..(yoda and Gandalf) ....they are both really attractive.....i could go on

VanimaEdhel · 09-07-2005, 09:56 AM

In my opinion what it comes down to is good storyline. There are certain elements - even in terms of story - that comprise a good, exciting story. There will most certainly be overlap, since, as the expressin goes, "There are no new things under the sun." While that might not be entirely true, there will most certainly be similarities between "good" tales and "good" books or movies.

I mean people compare Lord of the Rings and Harry Potter just as much. Meanwhile, Rowling has never read the Lord of the Rings all the way through (make of that what you will). There's a rough model of sorts for fantasy stories (and even science fiction stories pick up on this) involving good people being persuaded by dark forces, sages giving advice and providing guidance, a great but humble man must come to grips with his role in the world - all of that can be found in almost any fantasy or science fiction story. Whether you want to assert that Tolkien started this tradition or not is up to you, but there are so many things that you can find that are similar to Lord of the Rings in many ways, that you can't presume that there's intention behind it or even that it's unique in its similarity.

Dimcollowen · 09-07-2005, 10:03 AM

I think that Tolkien did start a tradition and I hope its one that never dies!!

Kitanna · 09-07-2005, 11:46 AM

I wrote a list of this many months ago as a way to combat boredom. Here are three of my results. I may add some more in the future...

1) Frodo Baggins = Luke Skywalker: Both dream of a life away from their peaceful homes. Frodo wishes to go out on one of Uncle Bilbo's adventures. Luke wants to be with his friends at the academy, fighting the Empire. Both are brought into something bigger because of a family member. Frodo inherits the Ring from Bilbo, Luke has the Force from his father. Both are removed from their homes by a wise, older man. (Gandalf and Obi-Wan Kenobi *is considered part of the hero cycle*). Both are sent on missions to help conquer evil and restore peace. Frodo to destroy the Ring and Luke to train as a Jedi and join the Rebel Alliance. Both destroy something that is a great threat to their worlds. Frodo "casts" (I'm using that term lightly here so please excuse me) the Ring into Mount Doom and Luke helps to blow up the Death Star.

2) Boromir = Lando Calrissian: Both wanted what was best for their people, despite their means of getting it. Boromir wanted to see Gondor restored to her glory and would go as far as to steal the Ring from Frodo. Lando wanted the people of Cloud City to continue a peaceful existence and was willing to turn his friend Han over to Darth Vader to ensure it. In the end both come around and see their folly. Though it was too late for Boromir, Lando was able to be of service to the Rebels by leading a fleet to destroy the second Death Star.

3) The Witch King = Darth Maul: Second in command to the ultimate evil force. The Witch King serves Sauron and Darth Maul serves Darth Sideous. Both meet their end at the hands of someone who lost a friend/family member to their evil ways. The Witch King is killed by Eowyn after he kills King Theoden. Darth Maul is killed by Obi-Wan Kenobi after he kills Qui-Gon Jinn.

But of course as VanimaEdhel and Boromir said you can find similarties between LOTR and SW as well as with other fantasy stories like Harry Potter, etc.

09-07-2005, 04:31 AM	#1
yavanna II Registered User Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: in my own little world Posts: 142	Star Wars and Middle-Earth As I was watching Star Wars for the nth time, my dad came, and said something like this: "Haven't you noticed any similarities between Star Wars and Lotr?" I replied: "Pa, they're both great movies..." Then he told me something he'd read in the internet about Sauron, Darth Vader, Morgoth, the Emperor, Yoda, and Gandalf. Similarities tween Sauron and D. Vader 1. They were once good, Vader being the former Anakin Skywalker and Sauron the former servant of Aule 2. They were both corrupted: Sauron by Melkor and Anakin by the Emperor Similarities tween Morgoth and the Emperor 1. THEY'RE STRONG AND MIGHTY!!! 2. They were once good (at least, I think the emperor was once a Jedi) 3. They're very good in corrupting people's minds 4. They're EVIL and powerhungry and treacherous Similarities tween Yoda and Gandalf 1. They're good 2. THey're OOOOLLLLLLDDDDD!!!!!! 3. They were part of councils of the great and wise 4. They're like guiding people, counselling against evil 5. They're damn good warriors 6. Yoda's strong with the Force and Gandalf is a Maia--don't that make em powerful? 7. They were never allied with evil.... Oh and I must add that I find something similar with Yoda's speech and Gollum's... Forgiveness I must ask if posted already this thread has been... very curious I was, yess, precious!!!

09-07-2005, 09:32 AM	#3
Dimcollowen Pile O'Bones Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Minas Tirith Posts: 23	yeah there are lots of similarities.....i think that you could even compare obi-wan to Aragorn....they are both great warriors....they both are friends with really great people..(yoda and Gandalf) ....they are both really attractive.....i could go on __________________ They say Lothlorien is beautiful, and I don't disagree. Elves, they also say, are the most beautiful race, and they are beautiful, But you are the most handsome of all. Elessar, you and I were meant to be.

09-07-2005, 09:56 AM	#4
VanimaEdhel Etheral Enchantress Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Wellesley College! Posts: 1,461	In my opinion what it comes down to is good storyline. There are certain elements - even in terms of story - that comprise a good, exciting story. There will most certainly be overlap, since, as the expressin goes, "There are no new things under the sun." While that might not be entirely true, there will most certainly be similarities between "good" tales and "good" books or movies. I mean people compare Lord of the Rings and Harry Potter just as much. Meanwhile, Rowling has never read the Lord of the Rings all the way through (make of that what you will). There's a rough model of sorts for fantasy stories (and even science fiction stories pick up on this) involving good people being persuaded by dark forces, sages giving advice and providing guidance, a great but humble man must come to grips with his role in the world - all of that can be found in almost any fantasy or science fiction story. Whether you want to assert that Tolkien started this tradition or not is up to you, but there are so many things that you can find that are similar to Lord of the Rings in many ways, that you can't presume that there's intention behind it or even that it's unique in its similarity. __________________ "I think we dream so we don't have to be apart so long. If we're in each others dreams, we can be together all the time." - Hobbes of Calvin and Hobbes

09-07-2005, 10:03 AM	#5
Dimcollowen Pile O'Bones Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Minas Tirith Posts: 23	I think that Tolkien did start a tradition and I hope its one that never dies!! __________________ They say Lothlorien is beautiful, and I don't disagree. Elves, they also say, are the most beautiful race, and they are beautiful, But you are the most handsome of all. Elessar, you and I were meant to be.

09-07-2005, 11:46 AM	#6
Kitanna Child of the West Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Watching President Fillmore ride a unicorn Posts: 2,132	I wrote a list of this many months ago as a way to combat boredom. Here are three of my results. I may add some more in the future... 1) Frodo Baggins = Luke Skywalker: Both dream of a life away from their peaceful homes. Frodo wishes to go out on one of Uncle Bilbo's adventures. Luke wants to be with his friends at the academy, fighting the Empire. Both are brought into something bigger because of a family member. Frodo inherits the Ring from Bilbo, Luke has the Force from his father. Both are removed from their homes by a wise, older man. (Gandalf and Obi-Wan Kenobi is considered part of the hero cycle). Both are sent on missions to help conquer evil and restore peace. Frodo to destroy the Ring and Luke to train as a Jedi and join the Rebel Alliance. Both destroy something that is a great threat to their worlds. Frodo "casts" (I'm using that term lightly here so please excuse me) the Ring into Mount Doom and Luke helps to blow up the Death Star. 2) Boromir = Lando Calrissian: Both wanted what was best for their people, despite their means of getting it. Boromir wanted to see Gondor restored to her glory and would go as far as to steal the Ring from Frodo. Lando wanted the people of Cloud City to continue a peaceful existence and was willing to turn his friend Han over to Darth Vader to ensure it. In the end both come around and see their folly. Though it was too late for Boromir, Lando was able to be of service to the Rebels by leading a fleet to destroy the second Death Star. 3) The Witch King = Darth Maul: Second in command to the ultimate evil force. The Witch King serves Sauron and Darth Maul serves Darth Sideous. Both meet their end at the hands of someone who lost a friend/family member to their evil ways. The Witch King is killed by Eowyn after he kills King Theoden. Darth Maul is killed by Obi-Wan Kenobi after he kills Qui-Gon Jinn. But of course as VanimaEdhel and Boromir said you can find similarties between LOTR and SW as well as with other fantasy stories like Harry Potter, etc. __________________ "Let us live so that when we come to die even the undertaker will be sorry." - Mark Twain Last edited by Kitanna; 09-07-2005 at 12:44 PM.