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Old 02-14-2004, 10:16 PM   #1
Hot, crispy nice hobbit
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Just who first thought of weapons?

This is just my first topic in the site, and I don't know whether there had been any other threads like this one... but I beg the question: Just who first thought of weapons of war?

In the creation of Arda, the Valar took physical raiments to cloth their glory. Melkor, who had risen against them, took the form of a terrible giant to destroy their works:

Quote:
His envy grew then the greater within him; and he also took visible form, but because of his mood and the malice that burned in him that form was dark and terrible. And he descended upon Arda in power and majesty greater than any other of the Valar, as a mountain that wades in the sea and has its head above the clouds and is clad in ice and crowned with smoke and fire; and the light of the eyes of Melkor was like a flame that withers with heat and pierces with a deadly cold - Silmarillion
Now, it was not stated what weapons they used to make war, but since Aule is the master smith, weapon smithing can probably be attributed to him. And it was said that "the armouries of the Valar were locked" or something (Sorry, can't find my BoLT and History of ME). Earlier versions said that the Eldar had only "weapons of the chase" that is javelins, bow and arrows, slings, spears and such. But surprisingly, the Sindar and the Dwarves, or Naugrim, which have never been to Valinor after they woke up, could know of smithing weapons and armor!

Quote:
Therefore Thingol took thought for arms, which before his people had not needed, and these at first the Naugrim smithied for him; for they were greatly skilled in such work, though none among them surpassed the craftsmen of Nogrod, of whom Telchar the smith was the greatest in renown.
The Noldor know of weapons and armour from the teachings of Melkor; if Aule had taught the Noldor how to make the weapons, then they would not have needed Melkor to "remind" them that they need to protect themselves. How is it then, that those left behind in Arda should know of tools of war even before the Noldor. Of Man, of course, they learn everything either from the Noldor, or from Morgoth... But what of the Sindar and the Dark Elves? What also of the Dwarves, assuming that Aule had not taught them how to make weapons and armor before putting them to bed? And had Aule really taught the dwarves how to make tools of war? Several versions of Prof T's work seemed to defer, and I can't really tell which is authenic...
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Old 02-15-2004, 08:41 AM   #2
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The Noldor were safe and in peace in Aman, and didn't really need swords, but Melkor lied them into it.
Those who stayed behind in Middle-earth, however, had to deal with Melkor's left-behind evil creatures. Certainly the peoples of Middle-earth were inventive enough to create weapons of war on their own. Ancient cultures on earth didn't have anyone to instruct them at least
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Old 02-15-2004, 10:48 AM   #3
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I would think that, based on knowledge and experience, it wouldn't be very hard for the peoples of Arda to figure out weapon-smithing, but the question is, as you stated, who was first? Well, in my opinion, Aule and Melkor spread the locked up weapons around, Melkor to incite war and Aule to quell it. It stands to reason that weapons may not have existed among the elves and dwarves until they had need of them, when the threat of Morgoth was upon them. Aule gave the wisdom of crafting, but they might not have used it until Morgoth first captured and twisted elves into orcs, arming them with his dark weapons in the fortress of Angband. Perhaps then the good peoples of Arda became proficient in fighting and the making of weapons.
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Old 02-16-2004, 08:21 AM   #4
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Hmm, but I believe that in the unfortunate incident of kinslaying, the Teleri were also armed, but it was said mostly with slender bows. Now, if the Teleri live at Valinor and dwell near the sea, why should they need bows and arrows? Not for fishing, I belief?

But jokes aside, it really seemed somewhat far-fetched that sentient races in ME should not have invented any weapons at the very first. Before the appearance of Orome to the Elves, Melkor had already kidnapped some of them in the guise of a dark rider, presumably for his equally dark genetic experiments. The point is, however, if weapons of war were first invented by the Elves, then they could probably have dominated every other races that were just awaking... if not for the untimely appearance of Orome.

So, I guess Melkor is really right in saying that the Valar kept the Elves in Valinor so that they can't be rulers of the entire world, huh?
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Old 02-16-2004, 12:06 PM   #5
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And at the end of HoME, X, part 3, II, Of the Silmarils and the Unrest of the Noldor there is a commentary (I omitted some of the parenthetical info)-
Quote:
In QS, where the matter first entered, it was said the 'the Elves had before possessed only weapons of the chase, spears and bows and arrows', but that now, under the influence of Melkor, the Noldor 'learned the fashioning of swords of tempered steel, and the making of mail' and shields. This was rewritten in LQ, still as an observation made by Pengaloo, to read that the Elves had originally possessed no weapons, and that now they learned the making of all kinds of arms, swords, spears, bows, and arrows. Similarly in AAm: 'Melkor spoke to the Eldar concerning weapons, which they had not before possessed or known'; but my father afterwards noted on the typescript of AAm: 'No! They must have had weapons on the Great Journey.' Feeling a need to explain how the Quendi survived 'amid the deceits of the starlit dusk', and concluding that they must have been armed in Middle-earth, he adopted the (to my mind) somewhat mechanical narrative device introduced here.
Here's the "narrative device" from the text preceding the commentary-
Quote:
Now the Quendi had possessed weapons in Middle-earth, but not of their own devising. They had been made by Aule and sent as gifts by the hand of Orome, when it became known to the Valar that the Quendi were beset by prowling evils that had discovered the places of their dwelling beside Cuivienen; and more were sent later for the defence of the Eldar upon the Great March to the shores of the Sea. But all these were long unused, and lay in hoard as memorials of old days half-forgotten; and since the chaining of Melkor the armouries of the Valar also had been shut.
I hope that is somewhat helpful.
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