Elves' Ears

[Fordim Hedgethistle]

So, what's the deal? Do Elves have pointy ears or not?

I can't recall a single sentence anywhere in Tolkien about pointy ears, but they're always painted that way, in movies that way, and described that way in fanfics and RPGs.

So what am I missing? Does Tolkien describe their pointy-ears and I've just missed it all these years?

For my money, I would prefer if they don't have pointy ears as that would solve a big problem for the Half-Elven: did Elros have pointy-ears that turned normal? Did Arwen? Did Elrond's ears get pointy?

[The Barrow-Wight]

Here's what people had to say in earlier discussions:

Do Elves Have Pointy Ears?
Pointy Elf Ears
Elfin Anatomy
How Pointy Were Elrond's Ears?

[Bêthberry]

Originally Posted by Fordim Hedgethistle

did Elros have pointy-ears that turned normal? Did Arwen? Did Elrond's ears get pointy?

This question reminds me of a thread some summers ago, concerning the extent of Tolkien's creationist theories.

Now, if we follow a creationist approach, there would be no change or evolution, so that the state of the half-elven ears would be determined at birth, or, rather, at conception. This would, though, impinge upon the free will of the half elven in deciding which way to go, assuming there would be a unity between the inner desire and the outer expression.

It's a mystery.


EDIT: Opps, cross-posting with The Barrow Wight.

[The Saucepan Man]

In the links which Mr Wight kindly gave there are two references to Elvish ears being pointed:

I picture a fairly human figure, not a kind of 'fairy' rabbit as some of my British reviewers seem to fancy: fattish in the stomach, shortish in the leg. A round, jovial face; ears only slightly pointed and 'elvish'; hair short and curling (brown). The feet from the ankles down, covered with brown hairy fur. Clothing: green velvet breeches; red or yellow waistcoat; brown or green jacket; gold (or brass) buttons; a dark green hood and cloak (belonging to a dwarf). (Emphasis added)

A description of Bilbo in Letter #27 (March/April 1938)

and

LAS- *lasse leaf: Q lasse, N lhass; Q lasselanta leaf-fall, autumn, N lhasbelin (*lassekwelene), cf. Q Narqelion. Lhasgalen Greenleaf, Gnome name of Laurelin. (Some think this is related to the next and *lasse 'ear'. The Quendian ears were more pointed and leaf-shaped than [?human].) (Emphasis added)

From The Etymologies (in HoME V), dating from the late 1930s

These would seem to be the only published references to the shape of Elven ears, but do suggest that Tolkien conceived of them as pointed, at least in the late 1930s.

What's wrong with Half-Elves having pointed ears, anyway? Perhaps they were less pronounced than full-blood Elves.

[elfearz1]

This is *ahem* a subject very close to my heart

I don't have any real proof that they did have pointy ears. (Although I think saucepan man laid it out quite nicely) but I like to think they do have pointy ears, even if Tolkien never specifically said that they did. I think it just looks better and makes them more distinct from humans.

[Lalwendë]

What's wrong with Half-Elves having pointed ears, anyway? Perhaps they were less pronounced than full-blood Elves.

Perhaps they had one pointy ear and one non-pointy ear, much in the fashion of Bowie's differently coloured eyes?

[Fordim Hedgethistle]

I picture a fairly human figure, not a kind of 'fairy' rabbit as some of my British reviewers seem to fancy: fattish in the stomach, shortish in the leg. A round, jovial face; ears only slightly pointed and 'elvish'; hair short and curling (brown). The feet from the ankles down, covered with brown hairy fur. Clothing: green velvet breeches; red or yellow waistcoat; brown or green jacket; gold (or brass) buttons; a dark green hood and cloak (belonging to a dwarf). (Emphasis added)

LAS- *lasse leaf: Q lasse, N lhass; Q lasselanta leaf-fall, autumn, N lhasbelin (*lassekwelene), cf. Q Narqelion. Lhasgalen Greenleaf, Gnome name of Laurelin. (Some think this is related to the next and *lasse 'ear'. The Quendian ears were more pointed and leaf-shaped than [?human].) (Emphasis added)

Thanks to the links provided above by the Wight, I saw these citations in the other threads. For me, at least, they do not really put the final nail in the pointy-ear coffin.

1. If these really are the only direct references to pointy-ears, then that's pretty slender evidence to hang such an important feature on.

2. I find them rather uncompelling in their own rights:

2.1 In the first citation, Tolkien is making a comment on Hobbit ears, not Elvish. His only reference there to Elves is extremely indirect -- not only is he referring to them as elves (with a lower case 'e') he even puts them in quotation marks, which means that he is using the word not in its usual sense. Given that he always capitalises the Elves of his world, and that he never refers to them in such a backhanded manner ("The 'elves' of Lorien. . .") I can only conclude that in this letter he is referring to the elves of popular imagination: those pixie like spirits of the wood which have NO relation to the Elves created by Tolkien. (In letter 151 to Hugh Brogan, Tolkien wrote that he came to regret calling his folk Elves since it allied them too closely with these trivial figures of English myth.)


2.2 As to the citation from the HoME, there's all kinds of reasons for me to be unconvinced by it. First, who are these "gnomes" he's talking about? Second, the association between the word 'leaf' and the word for 'ear' is made in a very tenuous manner: "some think." Finally, the final word appears to be an assumption by the editor insofar as it is in parantheses with a question mark. This can only mean that the writing was not completed or that word is indecipherable -- in which case we don't really know what Tolkien meant in this throwaway line. And if the comparison in ear shape is not between Elves and Men, then how can we really draw any definitive conclusions about it?

Against these rather vague and uncompelling descriptions of Elf-ears I would hold up the much longer descriptions of Elves in The Hobbit and The Lord of the Rings (in particular, the description of the Elves in the Appendices) in which no mention is made of pointed ears whatsoever. Why would he reserve such a crucial distinction between the races for one letter and an illegible note in some rough drafts for an unpublished work??

Even among his unpulbished works (during his lifetime) the descriptions of Elves are remarkably devoid of pointy-ears. Nowhere in the Sil or UT do we hear that Elvish ears are anything special or different from our own. In fact, in another letter (#144 to Naomi Mitchison, who was proof-reading the typescript of LotR and so, presumably, Tolkien would want her to get it right) Tolkien describes his Elves:

They are represented as a race similar in appearance (and more so the further back) to Men, and in former days of the same stature.

Just checked in the mirror: I don't have pointy-ears, so I figure anyone "similar in appearance" to myself wouldn't either!

Guess that's settled now.

For my next trick, I'll prove that Balrogs had wings.

[Nilpaurion Felagund]

Drawings of hobbits with pointy eary by Tolkien: Pictures, descriptions of hobbits with pointy ears by Tolkien: Letters, descriptions of hobbits looking like men -- ONLY SHORTER: LotR, the Legolas issue and the relation of stem -Las to leaf shaped: Letters and History , and that hobbits and elves and by extension men (as it is now converging from BOTH sides of comparison), have pointed ears. (Saulotus)

If Elves have pointy ears, then Hobbits have pointy ears. But Hobbits are little Men, sorta.

Therefore, Men have pointy ears!

(Elenrod checks his mirror and hopes his invocation causes his ears to turn pointy.)

But you are a Noldo!

Clad in Mannish hroa. Quendian hroa will fizzle twenty minutes after exposure to this muck you call an "atmosphere".

[Estelyn Telcontar]

OK, I'm going to come out of the closet and say how I voted and why I made that choice. When I first saw photos of the movie hobbits before the films were released, I thought the pointed ears were a choice made by Peter Jackson and his team - and was not enthused. However, after reading that quote (given by Fordim above) by Tolkien, I realized that he had actually stated the shape of their ears. Since they are only "slightly elvish", I would take the meaning of that to be that Elven ears are more pointed than Hobbit ears. Therefore, Elven ears are pointed. Had they been identical with human ears, their shape would not have to have been mentioned at all. Thus my "yes" vote.

[Nimrodel_9]

Yes! Elves have pointed ears! Why? I do not know! I think it`s kinda one`s own opinion. Kinda like Balrogs with wings. Personally, I find pointy ears cute.

Nimrodel <---------Elven Maid of Old

[radagastly]

I voted no. Elves were genetically identical to humans in every way. It was just their Fea that was different, tied to the earth. Their body was the same as Men. The only men I've met with pointed ears got them surgically, not organically (Don't ask.)

So, what's the point behind these polls? I've read enough of your posts to know that you wouldn't bother with such questions unless you had something in mind. So, what is it?

I can't wait to find out!!

[Fordim Hedgethistle]

Originally Posted by radagastly

Elves were genetically identical to humans in every way. . .

That's a good point -- for Elves and humans to reproduce successfully, they would have to be the same species! In fact, I now do recall reading Tolkien making this same point in one of the letters.

Sadly, this does not definitively prove that Elves' ears are like humans', insofar as there can still be wide variety of variation in things like eye shape, skin colour and, presumably, ear shape within species.

As to any ulterior motives, I am sad to disappoint you in admitting that I have none. If you can think of any yourself, however, do please let me know so I can enact them.

Originally Posted by Nimrodel_9

Yes! Elves have pointed ears! Why? I do not know! I think it`s kinda one`s own opinion. Kinda like Balrogs with wings. Personally, I find pointy ears cute.

Agree 100%! GF has slightly pointy ears, mmm...

Also, while pointy ears were certainly never proven, it was hinted at... rounded ears on the other hand were never even hinted at. "Similiar" doesn't mean exact copy. There can be some differences while still retaining similarity.

[mark12_30]

Originally Posted by radagastly

Elves were genetically identical to humans in every way.

They were?