View Single Post
Old 07-11-2005, 01:49 PM   #16
davem
Illustrious Ulair
 
davem's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: In the home of lost causes, and forsaken beliefs, and unpopular names,and impossible loyalties
Posts: 4,240
davem is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.davem is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.
AAARRGH!!!!

The whole argument of my last post falls apart!! I just found this, from The King of the Golden Hall:

Quote:
"Behold! I go forth, and it seems like to be my last riding," said Theoden. "I have no child. Theodred my son is slain. I name Eomer my sister-son to be my heir. If neither of us return, then choose a new lord as you will.
Public declaration, days since! Another embarrassing fox paw

I hereby promise to actually read LotR one of these days.

Anyway, hiding embarrassment & pretending none of that happened, let's move on...

Civil War

Of course, we don't know what position Grima actually held in the court. Certainly, Eomer was imprisoned for threatening death to him, so we may assume that, in his 'broken' state Theoden had held Grima in higher regard than Eomer. I say 'may' because its quite likely that, given the laws of the Hall, anyone threatening another with death there would have been locked up to 'cool his heels'.

What it does show, though, is that Eomer was not, at that point, held to be the automatic heir of Theoden, assuming the place of Theodred on his death - if he had been in that position his authority would have been too high for him to be treated in such a humiliating fashion.

Could Grima have been declared 'Heir Apparent' by Theoden in his broken state? The Civil war scenario Lalwende mentioned could have been Saruman's intention - a 'second best' after Grima forcing Eowyn into marriage after Theoden's death. Break Theoden, kill Theodred, & the whole realm is likely to implode. We can assume that part of Saruman's intent was also to break Eowyn's will - he probably thought that as a woman she was easily breakable in that way!

Whatever, it seems that Saruman saw Eomer as his major problem once Theodred was out of the way, & probably his next move would have been to get him out of the way permanently. And if Eowyn wasn't 'compliant' she could go the same way. Grima would be left, as the ruler, Erkenbrand then opposes him - civil war again.

Whether this was Saruman's plan alone, or whether Sauron was behind it, we'll never know, but what we can say is that if Gandalf hadn't intervened when he did there would have been no Ride of the Rohirrim, Gondor would have fallen & Sauron would have gone through the west like a dose of salts!
davem is offline   Reply With Quote