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Old 09-18-2020, 04:33 PM   #265
Galadriel55
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Location: The realm of forgotten words
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Galadriel55 is lost in the dark paths of Moria.Galadriel55 is lost in the dark paths of Moria.Galadriel55 is lost in the dark paths of Moria.Galadriel55 is lost in the dark paths of Moria.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Huinesoron View Post
I have not - yet - searched for "free video editing software", but it's coming. Partially because I want to do 'Truth' as a slow-motion flyover of the landscape from the Lament, flying right into the sunset, but absolutely cannot do that with the tools I have.
I just realized when we were reassessing Wind that since Truth happens during the westwards journey, the golden dust that's shining on the heights is very literally Finrod approaching Valinor - but also confirming that it will yet stand as it once was, right will triumph over wrong (to echo his lines about gold and ships in Prison Duet, which sound like he's questioning if anything he believed was right). That tempts me to say "Sky ships are burning in the sunset light" is referring to Earendil, although that's only one ship. As for the "fire that shines brighter e'en than they" - I vote for the truth Finrod focuses on: the "holy fires blazing in the eyes", a reflection almost of the Flame Imperishable itself.

Speaking of Truth - I found a copy of the Athrabeth and was skimming it, and saw that Finrod actually uses the words "heirs" and "inheritance" with regards to mortals. Isn't that what you had in the first draft - of Secondborn inheritors? I did not realize at the time this was a Finrodism, or Tolkienism. It doesn't sound as smooth (it would have to go as "inher'tors"). But if this was an intentional reference, maybe it can be worked back in - though I almost have more hope for "heirs" than "inheritors" in terms of how the word structure fits the scansion.



On the topic of lyrics, I did another sing through after watching the different performances, and the fiddling (TM) came out again.

- Any who stand in our way will be cast at our side to the dark we court! --> And any...? (I guess we'll see what ends up being more comfortable to sing)

- Waves of the Sea --> Waves of the Great Sea? (Ideally Wind of the West would have an extra beat too, but if not, neither one is critical)

- One by one, the oath-bound warriors fall --> ALL the oath-bound? It sounds a touch better with the extra beat, but I don't think ALL is appropriate (cause technically none yet and in the Zongverse only 4-5 of the brothers).

- That my heart lies cold by the way --> ON the way?

- I leave a beggar, as when I came here --> AND I leave a beggar?

- I know exactly how to make this good / If you bring my daughter back at once -- I was thinking for a while if there's a better way to rhyme this. I would suggest "surely" instead of "exactly" for scansion purposes, but not sure I can offer anything for the rhyme. There is "I know surely how to fix this fuss / once", but it also has to rhyme with "push", so I got stuck there.

- Can turn our lives from shadowed journey -- a question of intended meanings: would Melian be more likely to say "can turn our lives" or "will turn/save/shield your realm"?

- And fate does not know grace or mercy! -- even more of an aesthetics question: "And fate knows neither grace nor mercy"?

- And I will fight for that which always has been mine! --> is the "always have been" out of place here a bit, without the present tense "is" variant? Is it better rephrased? And I will fight for that which is and has been mine?

- For the Oath's sake I forsook my own home, braving the Sea and bitter Cold -- currently has an emphasis on "THE sea". Another Great Sea? Or leave it as is?

- Is he leading an army to Land of Woe? -- a force can be 10 people. But what about a host? Though considering that Luthien uses Land of Woe again without a preposition just a couple lines down, maybe it's best to keep the pattern.

- Then I will kiss the ground where he lies still... --> On this one, I always have to remind myself which meaning of "still" it's supposed to be. Also, in an ideal world it would rhyme with "wolves". How do you feel about something like "where he last stood" as an alternative?

- Your throne will crumble into ash -- another weak alternative for rhyme: Into the dust your throne will sink...... meh. I am near ready to give up on this one.

- And in the dust the gold did shine! -- is this enough of a parallel to "golden dust is shining in the heights"? Or would it be better if "heights" was on there as well? But then either "dust" or "gold" has to go, I can't find a way to fit all 3 nouns into this phrase.

- But, life entrusted to fate's hand --> life surrendered? A touch stronger, perhaps

- More mute than stones - only the dead -- I realized later that the Russian word can mean either "mute" or "numb". My first instinct was "mute": not only are they trying to be mute as stones in the face of Sauron's questioning, but it also echoes the symbolism of their imminent deaths as songs ending and last horn call dying etc. But "numb" can also work, they probably wish they would be numb as stones as well. Do you feel strongly about either interpretation?

- But mysterious still --> scans and rhymes a bit awkwardly. How about "But greatest/strangest of all lore"?

- Light and dark can both be damned! -- if you really want the abyss reference, there's "Abyss may swallow light and dark". Or "abyss may take both light and dark". But so far I got nothing that would be a good equivalent of "both light and dark can be damned and devoured by the abyss for all I care".


Quote:
Originally Posted by Hui
My ultimate goal is to put the whole thing together as a single video, so in the end it won't matter overmuch, but... yeah. A lot of those songs flow right into each other, which is good for a musical, but bad for splitting them... I'm inclined to follow the Official Libretto for the most part, but the Coming to Nargothrond was just so short!
Agree. I see no good reason why the Coming is split from the rest of Nargothrond. I mean, we technically could, but it would be more and not less work to do so, and for no good reason.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hui
Oh, it's got to be Sauron. I'm actually wondering if the Zongplex as a whole doesn't simply merge the two Dark Lords into one - there's nothing I can see in the lyrics to indicate there's more than one Enemy or Fortress unless you already know it!
Well... They do have a certain code of what things they reference directly, and obliquely, and none at all. They never say Morgoth's name. But by the same token, they also never speak Luthien's name. We broke both of these rules. But about the Dark Lords - yeah, unless you know that there are two of them which are being referred to, it would be hard. Except for little things, like "greater is the guilt of he who in the dark etc" (as opposed to "it was YOUR fault"). Or the fact that the Silmarils are still in an iron and not bat-like crown somewhere and still in need of rescuing. I guess some of Morgoth does end up rubbing off on Sauron in the Zong, as he takes over the role of the main villain...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hui
(At some point we'll want to talk about how much 'publicity' we want to give the translation. We could probably reach a fair audience by comment-bombing all the Zong videos on Youtube if we wanted to.)
Elanor keeps telling me what we could do for a PR campaign, and I keep telling her that I'm the wrong person to do it. But she could readily do the publicity thing in the Russian-speaking world at least and somewhat in the English when the light turns green.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hui
Eeeeexcellent. Um, if you can easily sort out Audacity that would be lovely, but if not I can do it myself no problem. (Do we have a Beren yet, or am I putting on an accent again? I'd probably go for somewhere in Yorkshire, which I at least have a family claim on, rather than plagiarising the Scots.)
I have a list of people I can maybe peer pressure into doing this. I have high hopes for Captivity, cause it's only two lines. Surely one of them will agree. The other Finrod/Beren duets might be trickier. But bottom line, Beren can have a girly voice for those until we find a substitute.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hui
Oh heck. So the easiest song for me to draw would be the Ballad to Amarie, because I already have all the pieces, but it's probably better to save that (I'm likely to have less time as the year goes on). It might be nice to give the Feanorions or Luthien something to do, though equally I haven't drawn the Brothers and want to redo Luthien. I mean, there's the Oath - or we could jump sideways to the Prison Duet, though that runs us back into the question of Beren.
I am looking forwards to both Ballad and Truth - but I agree that they are probably best left for later, when there is less and more time respectively.

In terms of the "currently singable" Luthien/Feanorian songs, there is Meeting (if you sing Beren), Dream (ditto), Bloodzoning (I believe the bros take turns responding to Luthien), and Showdown. Oath has the Bros dueting, but that can be fixed by recording twice if we don't find someome to join in. Quarrel and Hate also have Thingol, which makes it more difficult.

Hate is my favourite of the Feanorian songs, but 1) We don't have the voices for that (yet), and 2) It would make more sense to do the Bloodzoning first, because Hate transitions right out of it.

Maybe the Bloodzoning? That gives an opening for all three of them without going beyond our current vocal capabilities.

If it's too much to draw all three at once, maybe Oath - and we'll figure out a recording once we get there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hui
Still no images for Captivity, but! I've upgraded the video for the Lament to include NuFinrod and the rebalanced audio. The new link is here.
Yay! Updated. I like NuFinrod's eyes - that look like he's contemplating something deep, but you can't quite tell what.
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