monks, you're still throwing out far too many points per post; it's literally impossible for anyone to engage with all of them, so I'm not sure what you're looking to achieve. I'm going to choose just two to respond to. The first is your list of 'did you see's:
- Did you see this lady hidden in this image? -- No. There are two eye-like images at the top of your heavily cropped image - and also four at the bottom. Even if the top two are taken to be eyes, they are no more female than male.
- Do you see the hidden figures in the West Gate? -- No. All you've done is drawn some wiggly lines on clips of a rock face; I have no idea how this is supposed to be 'sexual'.
- Did you see the two figures here? That's the Loathly Lady theme. -- No. I can barely make out what you've done, but it seems to be just outlining some shadows. No figures.
- Did you see these wings and this apparition in this image? -- Maybe. There could be wings, but only because of that vertical line on the right side. The head isn't there, and the shoulders... are a door.
- Do you see the geometry of the rune Dagaz? He reuses that in other images such as his drawing of Helm's Deep and twice (here and here)in his Book Mr Bliss. -- No. Or rather, yes - it's called perspective. Any picture looking straight down a receding road/corridor will exhibit this shape. It's not mystical to draw a straight path.
- Do you see these hidden images in the West Gate? -- No. As far as I can tell, you're just slapping arrows down at random here.
- Did you see the woman with her cloak with its left wing oustretched (the same wing in Seth's anagram MINE HOLE FALL HELD LEFT WING and the same wing in the butterfly rune). -- No, in any of its forms. (Incidentally, you never have explained where the supposed anagram comes from, other than "Priya Seth".)
- Do you see the Balrog as the inverse of that woman here? -- No. There's nothing there.
Much like numerology, pareidolia is extremely subjective.
Quote:
Originally Posted by monks
But no it's definitely not subjective in specifically Tolkien's works. Tolkien took his number system from Dante and developed his own from that which is encoded in the Chain of Angainor. Have you read any of those predictions I've made? Let's extend your analogy. Could you make specific predictions about details of moments in the film *even down to the second* before you even saw it based on Tolkien's use of those instances of 7?
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Okay, I love a challenge. I'm not going to watch
Seven Samurai to check predictions about it (and why would I? We're analysing Tolkien, not Kurosawa!), but I will make specific predictions for you. Ready?
- There are at least four named sets of seven in Tolkien - the Houses of the Dwarves, the Sons of Feanor, the locations of the Palantiri, and the Beacon Hills of Gondor. I predict that each of these sets will contain a reference to the names of the titular Seven Samurai. (Predictions 1-4)
- I predict that Tolkien would not stop at four sets of seven. There will be more. (Prediction 5)
- In fact, I predict that there will be seven named sets of seven which will contain references to the Seven Samurai. (Prediction 6)
- I predict that one of these will be found in the Hobbit family trees in the Appendices. (Prediction 7)
- I predict that another will concern rivers. (Prediction 8)
- I predict that there will be a reference to a seven in chapter seven of each book of LotR. (Prediction 9)
- In fact, I predict that the seventh word, of the seventh paragraph, of chapter 7 of The Fellowship of the Ring will be a reference to the Seven Samurai. (Prediction 10)
I have not checked any of these. If they are all correct, will you either concede that Tolkien was inspired by a film that came out after he'd already published the book, or that it's incredibly easy to make and 'prove' specific predictions based on numerology and pareidolia?
EDIT:
For reference, the Seven Samurai, along with Google Translations of the characters in their names, are:
- Kikuchiyo - Thousand Generation Chrysanthemum
- Kambei Shimada - Intuitive guardian / rice-field island
- Shichirōji - Next seven white
- Katsushirō Okamoto - Four white victory / book hill
- Heihachi Hayashida - Flat eight / rice-field forest
- Kyūzō - Long-term storage
- Gorōbei Katayama - Five white guardian / Piece of Mountain
As these translations precede any attempt to prove the predictions, errors are irrelevant - we
know there's no actual connection, so who cares if I'm proving a link to the wrong thing?
[/edit]
The quickest one to look at, as a sample, is...
Prediction 10
Excluding the Prologue, and counting Frodo's poem as a single paragraph, the word descibed in #10 is 'with', as in 'overcome
with surprise'. Now, the word by itself refers to the fact that [i]Seven Samurai[i] is a story about a group of warriors coming together to achieve their goals. They don't start out as a team - they come together over the course of the story. 'With' is a very apt word here - they fight
with each other, rather than fighting
separately.
The OED (on which Tolkien worked, mind you!) describes the development of the word 'with' in these terms:
These senses are mainly those denoting association, combination or union, instrumentality or means, and attendant circumstance. 'Union'. 'Combination'. These meanings foreshadow the Fellowship of the Ring, Tolkien's homage to the Seven Samurai of his favourite film.
And there are other meanings of 'with'! It's used as a term relating to chimneys, ie fireplaces - and here occurs exactly seven (that number again!) paragraphs after the Hobbits enter a welcoming home. In words such as 'withhold' and 'withstand', it means 'away' or 'against' - and, indeed, just as the Hobbits move
away from the Shire to fight
against Sauron, we see this remarkably significant word show up!
Finally, since it is a word about coming together, it's appropriate to look at those surrounding words. 'Overcome with surprise' - this is a perfect description of the samurai's raid on the bandit camp at the beginning of Part 2. And how do they carry out that raid? With
fire - as in fireplace, chimney - with.
I will come back to the other 9 predictions later, when I have more time. They probably won't be covered in as much detail (I don't have
that much time), but I am confident they will all be proven true, and demonstrate the accuracy of my theories with indisputable power.
EDIT2: Found a little time.
Prediction 7
There are seven named Masters of Buckland before Meriadoc the Magnificent. Obviously, as Merry is a member of the Fellowship, he would not be included on a list set at the time of LotR.
The first connection to the Seven Samurai is that the first Master was
Gorhendad Oldbuck, with the name 'Gorhended' meaning 'great-grandfather' (it's Welsh). Both his names therefore connect to old age, and who was the first of the Seven Samurai? Kikuchiyo -
Thousand Generation Chrysanthemum.
Another link - you didn't think Tolkien would stop at one, did you? - is that three of the Masters have names ending in 'madoc'. See how three of the Samurai's names include 'white' in translation? Those are all the same character - 'shiro'. Three and three - you see?
Prediction 9
This should be fun.
Book 1, Chapter 7: In the House of Tom Bombadil
How many characters appear in this chapter - six, right? Four hobbits, Tom, and Goldberry. Except no: there is a seventh, though we don't learn about it until later. Frodo has a dream, in which he sees a vision which is later revealed to be Gandalf.
Book 2, Chapter 7: The Mirror of Galadriel
The heart of this chapter is Frodo's visions in the Mirror of Galadriel. How many does he see? Well, nine are mentioned - but the last is Sauron, and the first, described at length, is Gandalf. Between these two opposing forces, he sees seven things in the Mirror.
Book 3, Chapter 7: Helm's Deep
Seven warriors appear in this chapter: Aragorn, Legolas, Gimli - Eomer - Gamling (leader of the soldiers of Helm's Deep) - Theoden - and Erkenbrand, who arrives to break the siege. Gandalf arrives with Erkenbrand, but is presented less as a warrior than as a force of nature.
Book 4, Chapter 7: Journey to the Cross-roads
Easy:
before the fall of night they halted, weary, for they had walked seven leagues or more from Henneth Annûn
Book 5, Chapter 7: The Pyre of Denethor
Reveals the palantir of Minas Tirith, one of the Seven Stones.
Book 6, Chapter 7: Homeward Bound
Towards the end of this chapter, the hobbits pass the point where they left Tom Bombadil, and think back to their time with him - the heart of which takes place in Chapter 7 of Book 1.
Predictions 'proved': 3. No, 4:
Prediction 5 was proved by the existence of the Master of Buckland 7.
hS