[Child of the 7th Age]

I believe the poem you are referring to is "Bombadil Goes Boating". This is the second poem in the general collection entitled The Adventures of Tom Bombadil.

Tolkien says in his introduction that the collection as a whole is "mainly concerned with legends and jests of the Shire at the end of the Third Age, that appear to have been made by Hobbits, especially by Bilbo and his friends, or their immediate descendents."

There is nothing in the introduction of the particular poem under discussion which contradicts this dating. Indeed, as can be seen below, the poem is specifically said to be after Frodo's visit to Bombadil. The origin of the first and second poems, both of which discuss Bombadil, is described in this way:

Nos. 1 and 2 evidently come from the Buckland. They show more knowledge of that country, and of the Dingle, the wooded valley of the Withywindle, than any Hobbits west of the Marish were likely to possess. They also show that the Bucklanders knew Bombadil, though no doubt, they had as little understanding of his powers as the Shire-folk had of Gandalf's: both were regarded as benevolent persons, mysterious perhaps and unpredictable but nonetheless comic. No. 1 (i.e. The Adventures of Tom Bombadil) is the earlier piece, and is made up of various hobbit-versions of legends concerning Bombadil. No. 2 (i.e. Bombadil Goes Boating) uses similar traditions, though Tom's raillery is here turned in jest upon his friends, who treat it with amusement (tinged with fear); but it was probably composed much later and after the visit of Frodo and his companions to the house of Bombadil.

I certainly think there is truth in the way you have described the conversations between Maggot and Bombadil. As Bird suggests, the LotR itself confirms their relationship. But I wonder, Littlemanpoet, if we can pin things down quite as precisely as you've indicated, at least in seeing the poem as, word-for-word, actual "historical" data. To what degree were these poems a recording of what happened during the LotR, and how much was hobbit hindsight, incorporating various legends and tales loosely floating about Buckland and the Shire?

Tolkien, in general, took a less than reverent attitude toward the poems in the volume. They were considered part of the Redbook but only in the widest sense. Tolkien noted that some are in "loose leafs, while some are written carelessly in margins and blank spaces." Most of the latter were described as "nonsense, now often unintelligible, even when legible, or half-remembered fragments." Even the more authoritative ones, probably including the two Bombadil poems, appear "in various hands, and were probably written down from oral tradition."

With this stress on "oral tradition", the author is suggesting a different level of believability from that of the Red Book itself which the reader is to take as carefully recorded history. As anyone who's done oral history interviews knows, what one person remembers and what another remembers are often quite different! And things have a way of creeping into oral narratives which are closer to fiction than fact. It may, for example, have been easier to see a few things in hindsight, which might or might not have been so clear at the time. I find the poems delightful, but I take them with a grain of salt.

A similar uncertainty, for example, hangs over the more somber Frodo's dream in this same collection. There has been considerable debate and discussion over what the poem represents. We just can't be sure in any kind of an "historical" context. And I would say the same for the Bombadil poems.

Perhaps the importance of these poems, and the others, is not that they show us any literal interpretation of what happened during the LotR, but rather they tell us about the hobbits who came after the quest and heard the tales. We learn something about what these hobbits felt was important as they pick and glean from the tales in the Shire and decide what to pass on. In this context, it's not at all surprising that they would remember Maggot, one of their own, with dearness and pass on that part of the lore, and perhaps forget other parts which had more to do with Men or Elves! How interesting it is to me that the stay-at-home Maggot captures their attention rather than the exploits of Frodo or Sam! There is not a single poem in the collection outlining any part of the Ring quest, except for the strange and sad "Frodo's Dreme" which, on some level, is an indication of failure.

Another interesting point to me, Gandalf, is that the hobbits felt a strong enough attachment to Bombadil that he indeed paid a visit to Maggot's house in "Bombadil Goes Boating". And this visit is even complete with the famed politeness and hospitality for which hobbits were generally known:

They turned down Maggot's Lane, rattling and bumping, Tom in the farmer's cart dancing round and jumping. Star shone on Bamfurlong, and Maggot's house was lighted; fire in he kitched burned to welcome the benighted. Maggot's sons bowed at door, his daughters did their curtsey. his wife brought tankards for those that might be thirsty. Songs they had and merry tales, the supping and the dancing; Goodman Maggot there for all his belt was prancing. Tom did a hornpipe when he was no quaffing, daughters did the Springle-ring, goodwife did the laughing.

I think this says as much about hobbit society and values as it does about the actual events of the age.

sharon, the 7th age hobbit

[ October 21, 2002: Message edited by: Child of the 7th Age ]