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Ravenna · 10-21-2002, 06:48 PM

In many ways, Elrond is no different to the fathers in so many epic stories. The ardent suitor is told he has to prove himself worthy of marrying the princess.
In real life too, many young couples are, or were at one time, expected to wait until the parents are certain that the man can support his bride properly, and that their love is going to last, Elrond, may have gone a bit further than this, but the same priciples apply.
As to the accusation that Elrond is acting out of selfishness, in not wanting to lose his daughter, I cannot altogether blame him considering the circumstances, and also I think he was thinking of Arwen's welfare, not necessarily just her happiness. He was not going to let her commit herself to a mortals life without ensuring that she would be safe and happy and have no cause to regret her choice.
The marriage of a mortal to an elf is an occurrence of huge significance, and tha mortal has to be pretty darn special to earn that honour. Leaving Idril and Tuor aside, as their fate was very different and does not really compare, we are left with Beren and Luthien. As has already been said, Beren's task was imo, much harder to achieve, and was laid upon him maliciously by Thingol, both to get rid of an unwanted suitor, and out of greed for a silmaril. Elrond, on the other hand, whilst setting an extremely high standard for Aragorn to reach, never seems to me to be quite so set against the marriage happening eventually, but rather seems to be saying that 'if you want to marry my daughter, a descendant of Luthien, you must prove yourself as great a man as Beren was, or you won't deserve to have her'. Considering what Arwen was to give up by marrying Aragorn, I have never thought that this was too terribly unreasonable a way to think.
Final thought, would you really want your daughter to stay in a land ruled by a tyrant like Sauron, living a rough life etc, when you could keep her safe in Valinor? Which is what would have happened if Aragorn had married Arwen first and then not fulfilled Elrond's dictum, and Sauron had won.

10-21-2002, 06:48 PM	#17
Ravenna Haunting Spirit Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: witney, oxfordshire Posts: 70	In many ways, Elrond is no different to the fathers in so many epic stories. The ardent suitor is told he has to prove himself worthy of marrying the princess. In real life too, many young couples are, or were at one time, expected to wait until the parents are certain that the man can support his bride properly, and that their love is going to last, Elrond, may have gone a bit further than this, but the same priciples apply. As to the accusation that Elrond is acting out of selfishness, in not wanting to lose his daughter, I cannot altogether blame him considering the circumstances, and also I think he was thinking of Arwen's welfare, not necessarily just her happiness. He was not going to let her commit herself to a mortals life without ensuring that she would be safe and happy and have no cause to regret her choice. The marriage of a mortal to an elf is an occurrence of huge significance, and tha mortal has to be pretty darn special to earn that honour. Leaving Idril and Tuor aside, as their fate was very different and does not really compare, we are left with Beren and Luthien. As has already been said, Beren's task was imo, much harder to achieve, and was laid upon him maliciously by Thingol, both to get rid of an unwanted suitor, and out of greed for a silmaril. Elrond, on the other hand, whilst setting an extremely high standard for Aragorn to reach, never seems to me to be quite so set against the marriage happening eventually, but rather seems to be saying that 'if you want to marry my daughter, a descendant of Luthien, you must prove yourself as great a man as Beren was, or you won't deserve to have her'. Considering what Arwen was to give up by marrying Aragorn, I have never thought that this was too terribly unreasonable a way to think. Final thought, would you really want your daughter to stay in a land ruled by a tyrant like Sauron, living a rough life etc, when you could keep her safe in Valinor? Which is what would have happened if Aragorn had married Arwen first and then not fulfilled Elrond's dictum, and Sauron had won.