<font face="Verdana"><table><TR><TD><FONT SIZE="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Pile o' Bones
Posts: 20</TD><TD></TD></TR></TABLE>
<img src="http://www.barrowdowns.com/images/posticons/sting.jpg" align=absmiddle> Istari
Grond man - you are REALLY reaching. Okay: If you want to differentiate between the Maiar as they existed in Valinor and their incarnations as Istari in Middle Earth, I can see your point only from the strictest of technical definitions.
The bottom line, however, is that Saruman (for example) did exist in Valinor AS a Maia (I forget what his name in Valinor was) who served Aule. He DID take form as an Istari in Middle Earth who, though his powers were limited, was still unquestionably the same identity. I challenge you to find even one other person on this board who agrees with you on this point.
In any event, this question refers to Maia at the time of their entrance into Arda. So if you need to nit pick and say it was Olorin and not Gandalf, that's your business. But Telchar totally got it right.
- Maglor
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