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Originally Posted by Nerwen
But did anyone say "Laws and Customs" should be "dismissed", anyway? I thought the question was whether it can be considered the final word on the subject. Not the same thing.
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Exactly. What you have to understand about LACE is that (per C. Tolkien who has some weight or doesn't have weight depending on the lunar cycle) it was written by men and not the Eldar; therefore it is a retelling of ancient lore, so there is an accuracy issue from the start, considering what we know about chroniclers adding or deleting information to suit their needs and prejudices. One only has to look at
Beowulf, a poem Tolkien cherished, to know that it was a pagan tract rewritten with a Christian patina many years later and not by the same hand(s).
In addition, Tolkien abandoned the whole idea of using Aelfwine as transmitter of Elvish tales in favor of Bilbo Baggins'
Red Book Of Westmarch, but then it seems he may have reconsidered later when compiling the
Narn i Hîn Húrin. In any case, the entire LACE section would need to be edited and changed, and Tolkien never went back to it. It obviously was not a pressing item in his agenda, and as C. Tolkien admitted it was "sometimes obscure, and tantalising in its obscurity" -- which it certainly is.
Finally, as nearly as I can tell, Tolkien never adjusted anything timewise in his chronologies to account for changes he made according to LACE, nor does any quotes I've seen from either Galin or Cellardur indicated a fixed time for maturity of Elves (or, more importantly, Half-elves); in fact, Tolkien bounces back and forth throughout his life from something as outlandish as 3000 years right down to the same as mortal men. As Galin pointed out, the last mention from Tolkien indicated they aged relatively the same.
It is variable and certainly not definitive. It is not canon in the sense that Sauron created the One Ring and Gollum destroyed It and himself in Mount Doom.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nerwen
We've been through this before, I think? I have the greatest respect for Christopher Tolkien's judgement regarding his father's work, but to not to the extent of treating him as some kind of high priest of Tolkienicity. -And yes, that's hyperbole and not meant literally- but honestly, cellurdur, you're pinning so much on his editorial decisions that it almost comes to that.
Also, there is what I said earlier: Sador's words point to *a* difference- but is it the one in "Laws and Customs"? Or something else again? I don't think there's any way of telling for sure.
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Sador's quote is not definitive:
'for in their first youth the Children of Men and Elves seem close akin. But the children of Men grow more swiftly and their youth passes soon; such is our fate.'
Does the youth of Men pass soon? Without a doubt. Like I stated previously, considering that up to the most recent times, mortal men died very early, women even earlier (depending on how many children they bore, they were lucky to get past 30). Throw in the plague or even an infected tooth, and death was swift. So they married very early as well, mid-teens was common. The historical record as far back as the Biblical Hebrews indicates very early marriages (betrothal being at 12 1/2 years-old). Tolkien the scholar would be most aware of this information, even without the interwebz.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nerwen
I, for my part, assume nothing of the kind. However, the bare fact that he may
have done so casts doubt on the whole line of reasoning based on Dior/Earendil/Elwing's ages- which was the original point. For that matter just the fact that it's not the *only* version does that.
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A jury of one's peers could not convict with the reasonable doubt spread in and out and all about.
But the real question is...did Half-elves have Balrogs wings? And did they sprout them when they grew beards?
