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Old 03-10-2011, 07:11 AM   #52
Galin
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 1,036
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cirdan
Yeah, I don't know, Glorfindel was more a figure of valor in the FA. Inspiration and wisdom were more Olorin's gifts.
While Tolkien does note that Glorfindel's return must have been for strengthening Gil-galad and Elrond, I think his great fame would naturally be an inspiration. And as for wisdom, while not Olorin himself obviously, it was said Glorfindel became a friend and follower of Olorin in Valinor, and...

'for long years he remained in Valinor, in reunion with the Eldar who had not rebelled, and in companionship of the Maiar. To these he had now become almost an equal, for though he was an incarnate (...) his spiritual power had been greatly enhanced by his sacrifice.' JRRT, Glorfindel II

Quote:
But I suppose I'd like to add this to the list of things that I'd ask him -why was Glorfindel (of all Elves) sent back? Why not Ecthelion, or Finrod, or Fingolfin?
I rather like Tolkien's first 'answer' to this question from Glorfindel I (even though he seems to have superseded it in Glorfindel II): Laurefindel came with Gandalf as a companion (and again, he was a friend and follower of Olorin).

Finrod had good enough reasons to stay in Aman; but more generally, the late essays raise issues that include: Glorfindel being a reluctant rebel in the first place, his sacrifice, the matter of reincarnation in Aman concerning the Exiles... and again generally speaking, we can see Tolkien working out Glorfindel's special circumstances.

Of course externally Tolkien had two Elves named Glorfindel in his legendarium (not necessarily a problem in itself), though only one was known to the general public in any case; and if they were to be considered the same being, then it was a given that Glorfindel of Gondolin had returned to Middle-earth at some point (unless JRRT was willing to change the circumstances of Glorfindel's death, which I doubt).

Quote:
It seems that Tolkien was willing to change info in the Appendices btw (or so it seems). Reading UT last night, Celeborn was going to be changed to a Telerin prince from Aman overwriting the published fact that he was a Sindar from Doriath. Or perhaps JRR was just musing about it with no real intentions at all....

Tolkien wrote a later essay concerning the word ros for example (which, not unexpectedly, included details beyond specific linguistic concerns)... then he noted that most of it failed because of an already published detail however, the word andros being Sindarin. For another instance, JRRT wrote two variant late descriptions of Celebrimbor after he had published (second edition) that Celebrimbor was a Feanorean -- but did Tolkien remember this when he wrote these descriptions? and if he forgot but remembered later, did he necessarily need to go back and write 'this fails' on either text, since the public was unaware of them?

Christopher Tolkien thinks his father had forgotten about this detail and (in his opinion) JRRT surely would have felt bound to Celebrimbor the Feanorean.

I tend to agree, but this matter is difficult. To state the obvious: we know what already published text Tolkien was willing to change when he changed it for the Second Edition. What was he willing to change later? who knows? for example, why not simply change the appendices and note ros really was a Beorian word rather than Sindarin (as in his late essay)? But, it would appear that his 'most of this fails' should mean that he was not willing to alter this.

I would say that later writing does not necessarily indicate revision to already published text will certainly occur (not that you said otherwise) -- especially if a given matter is possibly not truly being considered by reason of a simple factor: memory.

Last edited by Galin; 03-10-2011 at 08:00 AM.
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