[Nerwen]

Day Two, Part One (Election).

#483.

Originally Posted by Boromir88

I'm glad you were able to finish with Nogrod. I've been going through the posts too, but Nogrod is someone I haven't finished yet; he actually reall has been someone I've relatively ignored so far. That's also rather peculiar, Nogrod just hadn't stood out to me as someone important on Day 1. (No offense there Nogrod). Anyway, I decided to take a good look at his last couple posts yesterday, what sticks out to me is his continued pressure on Legate, yet doesn't vote for him, and goes for Gwath instead.

Now before Lommy (or Nogrod for that matter) gets in here and explain all about how Nogrod doesn't like lynching vocal players early on, and ended up going for Gwath, thus he's innocent you see...Going off his posts though it just doesn't make sense.

I agree with tp that in 352, that looks bad, and by Nogrod's admission:

"It seems I have the weightiest reasons to suspect Legate then? But I'm more than reluctant to try him out toDay for the case is more speculative than I'd wish it to be were I to vote someone who could be such an assistance to us."


In 370 he lays out his reasoning against Gwath.

"I'm one of those who were a bit uneasy with Gwath's vote for me as a representative. The contraditory nature of that vote was clear indeed. And it could be looked from the devil's advocate viewpoint quite easily and deemed evil."

I guestioned this at the end of yesterday, on what was the big deal here, about Gwath's choice for Nogrod? Ok, Gwath says Nog will keep the quiet ones on their toes, Gwath hasn't posted a lot...ya it's contradictory, but talk about a real weak (I would even call bogus) accusation of wolvish-ness.

Then he credits Gwath for questioning the phantom. What is it that teachers like to do now...the compliment sandwhich? This is really good, wow you suck here, but oh this is nice.

In 375 he underlines those who he will not vote for today, one of them is Legate. However, as mentioned above he continues to put pressure on Legate. In 380, right before he says he's got to vote and leave...

"I haven't even read all of your post yet Legate but this cries for spelling it out aloud...

If tp says that if you keep on making that Star Wars stuff he'll be backing you... what do you do? You keep on with it in a striking manner.

That looks suspicious indeed... I need to make the choice in something like fifteen minutes (1.30AM here, waking up call at 6.30) and you didn't make it easier."

Nogrod, pal, this doesn't look good to me. If you said before you would not be voting for Legate, why turn up the heat on him? Why not focus on Gwath or anyone of the 4-5 other people you didn't underline? Also, it's strange that you said the case against Legate was purely speculative, and it made you nervous, but what was the deal about Gwath's representative vote? That looked like more balogna than anything you said about Legate.

And like I said, don't think about feeding me the bull of you not wanting to lynch someone like Legate so early. I bet you wanted the innocent Legate lynched yesterday you see...Although I would also bet you didn't want to get your paws messy.

Before I even post an edit, I'll just say now I've probably cross-posted with tp at least 3 times (Edit: alright I was close - 4 times plus 1 Ilya).

#542.

Originally Posted by Nogrod

I managed to peak in during the morning and will have a few comments on something there. Then I'm going to read what has been said after that.

And just fyi I'm sharing the computer with Greenie tonight (RL) so we will be posting in something like turns.

I don't know if you have come to a conclusion about McCaber being killed or not but to me it looks very puzzling indeed. And it makes me wonder. Why not tp? Why not Boro? Why not me? (add any player you think being a major threat to the wolves). There is no ranger so they roam free at Nights. So why not?

So Boro and tp and Lommy / Aganzir... (add your favourite wolf's bane here) are wolves and they let me live to see the other Day (just to attack me... it seems...)? It would sure be in the wolves' interest to get down players who'd threathen them. But they didn't.

And as the suggestion of there being those wolves looks a bit improbable I must think the wolves were actually after a seer. Even if it's Fea's game I'm not just ready to believe that he would have picked tp and Boro as wolves together with Lommy or Agan... or morm / Kath (if it's Fea who picks them)?

[goes on to speculate about whether the wolves thought McCaber was the Seer.

#555.

Originally Posted by Nogrod

[replying to the phantom]
You know it as well as I do that neither you or me, or Boro, or Lommy, or... would vote a contributing player out on Day1 unless there was a severe case to be made against that one.

[accuses phantom of being a wolf]

[replying to Boro's criticism of his attack on Gwath.]
But on the Gwath-suspicion. Sadly you left out the real point - or was it on purpose? I kind of remember you used a sig saying something like "for your safety and my sanity read all the thread"!!!

What I said about Gwath was this (talking from the devil's advocate point of view that is): Let's spell it out then...

Think of Gwath as a wolf (take the devil's advocate point of view).

He knows I'm one of the loudest proponents of lynching the enigmatic people out on the first Days as it will get tougher Day by Day and the number of submarines may decide the whole game in the end.

He realises he's one of the possible targets (I've gotten him lynched pretty early a time or two on Day1 or 2).

So what does he think as he sees many people seem to trust me and I might be on my way to being a representative thus adding to his anguish (he is a wolf in this scenario, mind you)?

He makes a decent try by voting me to be his representative so that I would feel good about it and leave him out from my possible list of "lynching the quiets" because he trusted me! This is the point I voted for him, not that it was a contradicition.

Sorry Boro, but I get the feel that you are as well either disparaging my intelligence seriously or you are just throwing things forwards without actually reading the thread. Or then you're a wolf trying to get something on someone who is an innocent but make a pretty bad performance with it.

And I'm having serious hardship in trying to believe any of the possibilities.


And the last thing. You Boro say I'm giving pressure to Legate while voting Gwath - and that makes me suspicious.

I never vote Legate on Day1, neither I vote you, or tp, or Lommy or... unless there is a major case behind the suspicion. You know it. (and if not look up there for the explanation)

But what I'm used to is to kind of give all my last thoughts forwards before I go as I don't know whether I'm alive when the next Day comes. So I pointed to the fact that I suspected Legate for that "doing a Legate 180" and when I saw the Star Wars -thing I thought it noteworthy enough to point it out (I was wrong, yes; but had he been a wolf and I had not pointed to that one, I would have cursed aloud if I had been killed the last Night and Legate had gone on winning the game while I had noticed that little thing but had not voiced it).

I like your "cut the crap" -attitude Boro, but this is not it. Not the least as you were one of those who actually lynched Legate.

Are you trying to whitewash yourself? Turning the attention to others from your own guilt? Couldn't resist lynching an innocent loudmouth who could be on your way? Got a trophy from lynching Legate?

#559. [The Great Balogna Post.]

Originally Posted by Boromir88

I don't believe I left out anything important, I quoted your point about Gwath's contradiction and the devil's advocate line; I'm not going to quote you line by line here Nogrod, I would certainly hate to infringe on any type of copyright. Anyway, I'm not going to dive into this tit-for-tat, you're not reading what I'm saying stuff.

I said your case against Gwath was balogna. Period. And I thought it was very reasonable to ask why you continued to pressure Legate after you said you wouldn't be voting for him. Alright, you like to post your final thoughts before heading out, I know that, and concede it's normal for you. Normal doesn't mean you're not a wolf, and yes I guess that means it doesn't make you one either.

Anyway, I still call your vote for Gwath balogna. So, let me get this devil's advocate thing straight...you assumed if Gwath was a quiet wolf, and he knew you were going after the quiet players, than he would try to win your trust by voting for you as his rep? Also all that not wanting to lynch tp, me, legate...etc on Day 1 that you just love to feed everyone, ok got it. It's still balogna, because you assumed Gwath was a wolf and then carved out a reasoning to fit your assumption.

I'm also well aware that Lommy (and I believe Agan) originally threw out the idea that since McCaber died, they want to scream "Nogrod's a wolf." So, don't lecture me about not reading carefully. I just haven't said anything about it yet, because I wanted to get a response from you, and I can only do one thing at a time here.

I'm getting about as me-focused as the phantom here, because I thought after McCaber's death, crap the wolves are going to be coming after me, as at the end I made a case for why they should kill an innocent McCaber. Virtually, I signed his death warrant there...but really the opposite has happened. Lommy's said it makes me look innocent to her, Agan has voted me as a rep, and they both thought the death would point towards you. So, apparently if you're innocent, you're the one the wolves wanted to set up, or you're a wolf and killed McCaber.

Edit: crossed with Greenie and morm

#587.

Originally Posted by Nogrod

Greenie went to sleep and I'm back.

Just the first ones to caught my attention (I really need to look at the thread better!).

Sorry, Boro, I appreciate your gaming a lot. And I'm always delighted to see you in a game I'm going to attend myself. But plese Mr. Boro, when you say my thoughts were "balogna" - whatever it is that word means - you should consider your own ones likewise. Why are you trying to twist this as I quite clearly answered you question that was something you hadn't read about (or had decided to ignore because it did not fit your interests of getting me lynched?)

I was not voting for Gwath because of the "contradictory" nature of his post but because of the possible intention behind it.

And I thought it a better idea than lynching Legate. Unlike you did...

Absolutely. As you said yourself. So why all the hassle? Because you thought you could get me lynched with it but had to concede it was not a case after all, right? Mr. smooth wolf?

You are doing the very same thing Boro! You are looking at me with eyes keen seeing wolfy-moves in my posts like I did with Gwath yesterDay. So you can't kind of claim you are on the high-ground you seem to be trying to reach here... Indeed this makes me look at you even more suspiciously as I know that my vote was for keeping the informative players around while you decided to let the village be without one of it's most sharp-eyed players who could turn the tables...

So whose case was a "balogna"? No one has yet called you for it, has anyone?

Well, I'm calling you now. Why did you vote Legate?
(you may have answered this already and then I apologise and will look at your answer from there... I will get reading all said toDay after I stop writing this)

X and Y said A is a wolf because of B. So don't lecture about me saying A is a wolf! I have not said anything on the matter!"
(and add B being like "s/he has used yellow socks before or s/he used the word "blue" earlier as well...")

You cared to echo their points, right? That comes about even with saying it yourself, doesn't it?

That is sneaky! And bad. Sorry Boro, I thought you'd perform better... But hiding behind te back of the two ladies ius just... bad.


So if you're an innocent, just check back on yourself. You are basically just doing the things you're accusing me of doing Boro and that's bad playing indeed. If you're evil, well, then we have to get you lynched sooner rather than later.

I'm not sure what to think of you.

I might vote you as a representative just to check your cards.


PS. Talking about paranoid wolves, just read this...
So you wrote McCaber to his death? Was that a confession indeed, muddied by the "opposite happened" -thing? I mean were you an innocent why should you say something like that no one had seen or mentioned (Well I have not seen all of toDay)?

Bad conscience knocking on the door that is not a Heaven? ?

#592.

Originally Posted by Boromir88

"I was not voting for Gwath because of the "contradictory" nature of his post but because of the possible intention behind it.~Nogrod"

Yet in your post (370) laying out your reasoning against Gwath...
"I'm one of those who were a bit uneasy with Gwath's vote for me as a representative. The contraditory nature of that vote was clear indeed. And it could be looked from the devil's advocate viewpoint quite easily and deemed evil."~Nogrod

Do I have to do an underline job like Shasta? You're connecting his contradictory vote with the reason Gwath could be deemed evil (that is what the word "and" does).

"You are doing the very same thing Boro!"~Nogrod

I already said I'm a hypocrite.

"Well, I'm calling you now. Why did you vote Legate?"~Nogrod

You cared to echo their points, right? That comes about even with saying it yourself, doesn't it?

Read my posts yesterday and you'll find out...or better yet read why Legate didn't want to make me a rep, he thought I would vote for him, he was right. Someone has to go, I made the wrong choice. I mean no offense to Legate, but it was day 1 and his death isn't a game-breaker. Are you confident a Gwath lynching would have turned up a different result?

"X and Y said A is a wolf because of B. So don't lecture about me saying A is a wolf! I have not said anything on the matter!"
(and add B being like "s/he has used yellow socks before or s/he used the word "blue" earlier as well...") "~Nogrod

I'm not sure why you're trying to alienate me on this one, when I brought it up as a possible reason that could point to your innocence. I said McCaber's death could have been an attempt at a set-up, with Lommy and Agan both saying it points to you. And as I said, I fully intend, and still do, plan to pursue that possibility, but I wanted to hear your response to my accusations first.

Edit: crossed with Brinn

#594.

Originally Posted by Nogrod

Like I said, we would have changes in the representatives...

Now why don't you like tp any more?


Anyway, I'm giving Boro a third vote even if parts of toDay are just black areas to me as I had no time to read them all. I'll try to catch up tomorrow as it's now 3AM here... Happily we have these 48 hour-Days!

But I really want to see what Boro does with the power invested on him on that scale... even if it narrows down the number of the representatives.
(Think of the game balance indeed! Seven "two-voters" are the happiest place for the wolves qualified... after not being a representative in the first place, that is)

I don't trust him at all at this moment but I want to check his cards whatever it leads to.

++ Boro for representative

This Day has shown how this game works.

Lommy for Nerwen
Ner for Lommy
Agan for Boro
morm for Agan
KA for Lommy (2)
Green for morm
Eonwe for Lommy (3)
Rune for morm (2)
Kath for Boro (2)
Shasta for Nerwen (2)
Nogrod for Boro (3)


EDIt: X'd with Boro x2

EDIT: fixed stuff.