The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum - View Single Post

alatar · 10-31-2007, 12:09 PM

Wow! A thread comparing and contrasting the books and the movies. How novel!

Anyway, I've been trying to figure out Sauron the White and others with a similar bent (and I mention him by name apurpose as he knows that, from me, this isn't personal but just to make a point) and what they are trying to 'get' from some of their posts. Earlier in thread many of the posts are like similar discussions that we've all had recently wherein the books are considered perfect and the popular movies are considered garbage...or the movies are just wonderful and those who cannot see the digital light are simply cloak-wearing troglodytes that just can't give Peter Jackson a break.

The Downs, if I have this right, preceded the movies. Therefore one would assume that members may have joined due to their love of the books. Others, after the movies came out, joined as well, and these member may love the books, movies or both, but there existed a time when PJ movie love was not possible. The forum culture, therefore, may reflect this book bent especially if we also consider the age of some of the members.

That said, we have StW asking why there seems to be bias in regards to the books/movies. I define bias as the tendency, when no other evidence presents itself, to choose the side one more prefers. StW, seeing this bias, for some reason wants these persons to not only admit their bias (which should be apparent) but also to renounce it when not presented with rock solid contrary evidence.

I live near Pittsburgh Pennsylvania (USA) and the Steelers, a (American) football team, holds a near religious status in the area (and the world, truth be told). If you are in the home stadium when the Steelers are playing, would you think it odd that many of the fans are cheering their local team? In that word, Duh! When a referee makes a questionable call - objectively, if we had perfect knowledge, the call could go either way - would it seem odd if the home crowd saw it as for the Steelers while the fans of the opposing team saw it otherwise? Same crowd, but assume that the referee makes a completely awful call that, given perfect knowledge, we know should not have been made but benefits the Steelers. Home team's opinion is like, "Well, you'll have that in sports," while the opposing team is outraged that such a travesty was permitted. When the call is reversed, the attitudes are reversed as well.

Note that in both cases you have some that are truly fair and so denounce the unfair call regardless of the team.

So, it would seem to me that StW has come to the Downs, which again I assume to be more book-philic than PJ-philic, and expect persons to convert to the "PJ got it spot on" team when the call is completely subjective. Do you prefer the Steelers or the (rival) Browns? In Pittsburgh, Browns-love is tolerated but one wouldn't hear much about it pre-game on the news, in the neighborhood, at parties and during the 5000 hours of post-game analysis. PJ's work is new and not the reason why many persons are here.

Does that make sense?

I'm not disregarding the arguments for or against, and have enjoyed the discussion on this thread, but with the exception of maybe being provocative I'm not sure why certain points of view are considered extreme.

alatar starts the tape... And, yes, PJ's films are popular and successful and have been seen by almost everyone on the planet, and with the TV broadcasts will soon be seen by our extra-terrestrial neighbors as well, but again, we have one data point, and so cannot extrapolate anything. In other words, we do not know what another director/writer/producer could have done, nor what the outcome would have been if PJ were truer to the books or truer to his vision (or whatever). But we can fill up a lot of pages with guesses.

Anyway...

Bombadil was the hook that got me into not only LotR but the Sil as well. What's all of this other stuff to which ole Yellow Boots is referring? PJ, not knowing that FotR would be successful enough for the trilogy to continue, couldn't afford putting a hook in his first flick for movies not yet scripted.

What was the significance of the necklace that Tom plucks from the Barrow hoard?

10-31-2007, 12:09 PM	#140
alatar Doubting Dwimmerlaik Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Heaven's basement Posts: 2,466	Just some thoughts Wow! A thread comparing and contrasting the books and the movies. How novel! Anyway, I've been trying to figure out Sauron the White and others with a similar bent (and I mention him by name apurpose as he knows that, from me, this isn't personal but just to make a point) and what they are trying to 'get' from some of their posts. Earlier in thread many of the posts are like similar discussions that we've all had recently wherein the books are considered perfect and the popular movies are considered garbage...or the movies are just wonderful and those who cannot see the digital light are simply cloak-wearing troglodytes that just can't give Peter Jackson a break. The Downs, if I have this right, preceded the movies. Therefore one would assume that members may have joined due to their love of the books. Others, after the movies came out, joined as well, and these member may love the books, movies or both, but there existed a time when PJ movie love was not possible. The forum culture, therefore, may reflect this book bent especially if we also consider the age of some of the members. That said, we have StW asking why there seems to be bias in regards to the books/movies. I define bias as the tendency, when no other evidence presents itself, to choose the side one more prefers. StW, seeing this bias, for some reason wants these persons to not only admit their bias (which should be apparent) but also to renounce it when not presented with rock solid contrary evidence. I live near Pittsburgh Pennsylvania (USA) and the Steelers, a (American) football team, holds a near religious status in the area (and the world, truth be told). If you are in the home stadium when the Steelers are playing, would you think it odd that many of the fans are cheering their local team? In that word, Duh! When a referee makes a questionable call - objectively, if we had perfect knowledge, the call could go either way - would it seem odd if the home crowd saw it as for the Steelers while the fans of the opposing team saw it otherwise? Same crowd, but assume that the referee makes a completely awful call that, given perfect knowledge, we know should not have been made but benefits the Steelers. Home team's opinion is like, "Well, you'll have that in sports," while the opposing team is outraged that such a travesty was permitted. When the call is reversed, the attitudes are reversed as well. Note that in both cases you have some that are truly fair and so denounce the unfair call regardless of the team. So, it would seem to me that StW has come to the Downs, which again I assume to be more book-philic than PJ-philic, and expect persons to convert to the "PJ got it spot on" team when the call is completely subjective. Do you prefer the Steelers or the (rival) Browns? In Pittsburgh, Browns-love is tolerated but one wouldn't hear much about it pre-game on the news, in the neighborhood, at parties and during the 5000 hours of post-game analysis. PJ's work is new and not the reason why many persons are here. Does that make sense? I'm not disregarding the arguments for or against, and have enjoyed the discussion on this thread, but with the exception of maybe being provocative I'm not sure why certain points of view are considered extreme. alatar starts the tape... And, yes, PJ's films are popular and successful and have been seen by almost everyone on the planet, and with the TV broadcasts will soon be seen by our extra-terrestrial neighbors as well, but again, we have one data point, and so cannot extrapolate anything. In other words, we do not know what another director/writer/producer could have done, nor what the outcome would have been if PJ were truer to the books or truer to his vision (or whatever). But we can fill up a lot of pages with guesses. Anyway... Bombadil was the hook that got me into not only LotR but the Sil as well. What's all of this other stuff to which ole Yellow Boots is referring? PJ, not knowing that FotR would be successful enough for the trilogy to continue, couldn't afford putting a hook in his first flick for movies not yet scripted. What was the significance of the necklace that Tom plucks from the Barrow hoard? __________________ There is naught that you can do, other than to resist, with hope or without it.