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Old 07-29-2007, 02:03 PM   #12
Legate of Amon Lanc
A Voice That Gainsayeth
 
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Legate of Amon Lanc is spying on the Black Gate.Legate of Amon Lanc is spying on the Black Gate.Legate of Amon Lanc is spying on the Black Gate.Legate of Amon Lanc is spying on the Black Gate.Legate of Amon Lanc is spying on the Black Gate.Legate of Amon Lanc is spying on the Black Gate.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lalaith View Post
Anyway, I wonder if part of the problem in these discussions isn't that they are taking place among people who are used to the logic of computer games. This weapon plus that armour plus so many power points and that experience level gives you strength to defeat this monster....
I'm not sure how useful this very logical, gaming-type viewpoint is to understanding Tolkien's world. It was a literary creation, which as many here have pointed out, underwent many changes over the years. So one minute you can have a High Elf defeating a Balrog in just a short battle, and in another, a mighty maia like Gandalf take a week to defeat one in underground combat.
I thought about that too, though I think in this discussion it was not as evident from the start, so I didn't bring it up. When you look up, unless you yourself get dragged down in thinking in these "level lines", the question is well posed: the Balrogs are something - and that is clear enough from the Legendarium - completely qualitatively different from the Elves, they are Maiar, Ainur. This is evident and everyone who thinks about someone who was with Eru performing on the Music can be somehow puzzled about all this. I think it's about realizing the different story changes, as you said, and also - very importantly, I think - realizing what the "coming to flesh" in Arda means: that as they are once there, you are technically as capable of slaying a Balrog as a human (no high "lives" here - though he probably is tougher than common man, there are mainly other things that prevent you from killing him). I saw the "game-thinking" problem emerging in many different threads, but particularly in this case I think our problems lie somewhere else. Good you brought it up, though, as it allows people to realize if they are thinking like that, preventing possible misunderstandings.
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Last edited by Legate of Amon Lanc; 07-29-2007 at 02:11 PM. Reason: italicising the point I consider very important
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